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bike2work
Thu, Sep-05-13, 21:34
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2013/sep/05/bacteria-slim-treat-obesity-study
Bacteria from slim people could help treat obesity, study finds

Experiments show microbes from thin or fat people's intestines can cause mice to lose or gain weight

Bugs that lurk in the guts of slim people could be turned into radical new therapies to treat obesity, according to a new study.

The claim follows a series of experiments which found that the different populations of bacteria that live in lean and overweight people caused mice to lose or gain weight.

The findings build on a growing body of work that gives the millions of microbes that live in the gut a major role in weight control.

Scientists at Washington University School of Medicine in St Louis said the research paved the way for new therapies that tackle obesity by altering the types and numbers of bugs that make their home in the gut.

Researchers led by Jeffrey Gordon recruited four pairs of women who were twins. One woman in each pair was obese, but the other had a healthy body weight.

From each woman, the researchers collected faeces which contained a wealth of expelled gut microbes. Through a number of tests, the scientists then investigated what happened when they transplanted these into mice bred to have no gut microbes of their own.

The scientists found that mice stayed slim when they received faecal transplants from slim women, but put on much more fat when the samples came from the obese twin. Tests revealed that one type of bug, called Bacteroides, was more plentiful in slim women and protected the animals from putting on too much fat.

In a follow-up experiment, mice with microbes from the slim women shared a cage with mice that had microbes from obese women. Because of the animals' proclivity for coprophagia – that is their habit for eating each others' poo – this caused a mixing of the animals' gut microbes.

After the mice had spent 10 days as cage mates, the obese ones had become more lean. But this only happened if the animals were fed a healthy diet that was high in fibre and low in saturated fats. When the diet was switched to high-fat, low-fibre meals the obese mice remained overweight.

The scientists think that a healthier diet allowed "good" microbes to thrive in the animals' guts, and even reverse obesity in the overweight mice. But a more typical western diet, high in fat and low in fibre, blocked the effect. That would explain why there is no "epidemic of leanness" in the US and elsewhere in the west, the scientists say.

Gordon said the findings, which are published in the journal Science, would steer the development of foods and new therapies that treat obesity by altering the makeup of microbes in the intestines.

"In the future, the nutritional value and the effects of food will involve significant consideration of our microbiota, and developing healthy, nutritious foods will be done from the inside out, not just the outside in," he said.

In an accompanying article, Alan Walker and Julian Parkhill at the Sanger Institute in Cambridge called the work "a step toward the ultimate goal of developing relatively simple mixtures of bacteria for testing as anti-obesity therapeutics".

teaser
Fri, Sep-06-13, 04:45
In a follow-up experiment, mice with microbes from the slim women shared a cage with mice that had microbes from obese women. Because of the animals' proclivity for coprophagia – that is their habit for eating each others' poo – this caused a mixing of the animals' gut microbes.

After the mice had spent 10 days as cage mates, the obese ones had become more lean. But this only happened if the animals were fed a healthy diet that was high in fibre and low in saturated fats. When the diet was switched to high-fat, low-fibre meals the obese mice remained overweight.

Eat food with little hedonic value. And eat less of it than you want. Keep the temperature down. Wear scratchy clothes that abrade the skin (burn calories trying to heal). And eat sh--

Just kidding. And poop eating seems to be the rule rather than the exception in the animal kingdom.

Interesting evidence that consuming probiotics might actually do some good.

katoman
Fri, Sep-06-13, 07:30
Interesting evidence that consuming probiotics might actually do some good.Gah! What can I say? That all fits with some of the things I gleaned in the past. However, the thought of being implanted with gut bugs from other people via the rest of nature's methods has me running to hurl. :lol:

Ann_LC
Fri, Sep-06-13, 09:06
I get sh*t on by my skinny boss all the time and I'm still fat!

Nancy LC
Fri, Sep-06-13, 09:52
I get sh*t on by my skinny boss all the time and I'm still fat!
Next time, open your mouth and swallow. That seems to be key! :lol:

bike2work
Fri, Sep-06-13, 11:43
After the mice had spent 10 days as cage mates, the obese ones had become more lean. But this only happened if the animals were fed a healthy diet that was high in fibre and low in saturated fats. When the diet was switched to high-fat, low-fibre meals the obese mice remained overweight.I've read about other studies that suggest that those of us who are obese lack a certain strain of bacteria in our guts, so that fits what I've learned elsewhere.

As for the high fiber, low fat foods being better -- the test subjects here are mice. I have no doubt that mice are meant to live on grains but it doesn't necessarily mean that high fiber, low fat is an optimal diet for humans.

M Levac
Fri, Sep-06-13, 12:33
From the point of view of natural selection, the gut flora profile associated with obesity in humans should be rare. It should be rare mostly for two reasons. First, wild obesogenic foods are scarce, and second, obese humans are easy prey. Conversely, from the point of view of artificial selection (i.e. human civilization), the gut flora associated with obesity should be much more frequent, both because obesogenic foods are now abundant, and there's no predators hunting us down anymore.

The same idea applies to mice. But with mice, we could be dealing with hibernation or hoarding in some cases, whereby growing fat or gathering provisions before winter is a rule. For the growing fat part, doesn't really matter which foods are eaten, the animals will grow fat regardless. For the gathering provisions part, foods that conserve well would be preferentially selected. This means seeds, high-fiber plants, and dead insects. For hibernating mice, these foods will also be preferentially selected for immediate consumption, though probably eaten while still fresh or alive. For other mice, it should be similar, but maybe more varied.

The other thing is mice will eat human foods and discards. Another thing is the closer human foods are to wild mice foods, the more mice will eat human foods, the more mice will infest human populations. Finally, there's the difference between human evolution and mice evolution. Mice evolution is many times quicker than human evolution just by virtue of lifespan and reproduction capacity. Something on the order of 50-100x quicker. To put this in perspective, agriculture is ~10k years old, so mice evolution here is equivalent to 500k-1M human years, ample time to fully adapt to a new but very similar diet. So while humans are not adapted to eat the products of agriculture and remain healthy, mice have probably fully adapted to eat those same foods. What this means for mice->human/human->mice extrapolation is that if we feed a proper human diet to mice (low-carb, high-fat), the mice will not remain healthy; and if we feed a proper mouse diet (products of agriculture) to humans, these humans will not remain healthy either.

Nonetheless, the idea of gut-bacteria-affecting-health does transfer to other species.

teaser
Fri, Sep-06-13, 13:19
I wonder if the diet had an effect on how likely the mice were to taste each other's poo? After a bit of low-fat chow, maybe poo is more tempting than it would otherwise be. This time I'm serious.

jmh
Fri, Sep-06-13, 15:21
When I got my little doggie, I was reading up on what a good diet was (raw meat of course!!), and I remember hearing that eating pooh was a sign of a problem. Unfortunately I can't remember what the problem was. :lol:

Caroxx
Fri, Sep-06-13, 15:43
~ M Levac, omg I love smart people! You rock!

M Levac
Fri, Sep-06-13, 16:29
Hehe, thanks. I forgot to point out that this is only as I see it, not necessarily how it actually works. I mean, it makes sense to me.

Zei
Fri, Sep-06-13, 17:37
I first read this title as Bacteria from slime could help treat obesity, study finds
On the bright side it's yet another demonstration obesity is a more complex condition than just something brought on by poor personal choices like some believe.

rightnow
Fri, Sep-06-13, 19:36
Bacteria from slime would be less embarrassing. We wouldn't have to ask slime, "Can I put something up your butt for a sample?" :lol:

Pj

Rosebud
Mon, Sep-09-13, 19:46
I wonder if the diet had an effect on how likely the mice were to taste each other's poo? After a bit of low-fat chow, maybe poo is more tempting than it would otherwise be. This time I'm serious.
Thank you for making me laugh out loud! :p

CMCM
Thu, Sep-12-13, 12:20
When I got my little doggie, I was reading up on what a good diet was (raw meat of course!!), and I remember hearing that eating pooh was a sign of a problem. Unfortunately I can't remember what the problem was. :lol:

I think everyone who has horses and dogs knows how much dogs love horse poop...the fresher the better. It is somehow a real delicacy in the dog world!

Seejay
Thu, Sep-12-13, 14:04
eyew, getting it back-asswards again. ba da bump. Bacteria is the outcome, and what we eat, the root cause. so to fix it, let's eat the right bacteria?
This is so cargo-cult science-y. (Reference to Feynman's lecture)

Nancy LC
Mon, Sep-16-13, 11:30
A CALORIE is a calorie. Eat too many and spend too few, and you will become obese and sickly. This is the conventional wisdom. But increasingly, it looks too simplistic. All calories do not seem to be created equal, and the way the body processes the same calories may vary dramatically from one person to the next.
A wider understanding of obesity (http://www.economist.com/news/science-and-technology/21586269-how-bacteria-your-gut-may-be-shaping-your-waistline-wider-understanding?fsrc=scn/gp/wl/pe/widerunderstnading)