Successful switch from Atkins

[prsloan]

I've been 'sweating the switch,' but am happy to report that after 1 fairly strict week of CALP, I have lost 2 pounds.

Yes, I've had dessert almost every night but have been careful to balance by 1/3.

It's nice to know there is life after Atkins!

Success stories are sooooo important!

[HopeToday]

Thats great news - it has been hard for me to find the life-after-atkins with CAD stories:) :D

[tammay]

I also made the switch just last weekend and I'm happy with the results. Weight-wise, the scale is showing I gained a pound but in conjunction with switching plans I also upped my exercise and I read in a book that when you do that, you put on muscle mass pretty much right away, so I'm attributing the weight gain to that. Especially because I don't feel like I've gained weight.

I love CALP!

Tam

[prsloan]

Hi Hope and Tam,

CALP is a great plan - I finally started exercising too - it feels great.

I know what you mean about not FEELING like you've gained even tho' the scales sometimes show otherwise...all the evidence about muscle weighing more than fat, etc.

I would love to read more success stories from persons who have made their goal weight using CALP!

Where are you?

[LastHope]

I'm contemplating the switch from Atkins to CALP since I've lost nothing (I've gained 2 lbs) on Induction, and I'm wondering if I'd do better on CALP.

Any comments? Updates?

[roche]

I am currently on Atkins but struggling. Sheila recommended CAD to me. what does the CaLP stand for? Am glad to hear that some of you made transition from Atkins to Cad/Calp successfully. I am considering it but a bit nervous about the reward meal a day.

Roche

[Zuleikaa]

CALP means carbohydrate addict for life plan. It is an expanded version of the CAD plan and includes additional rules and tips.

[skyspinner]

Would Some Kind Soul please describe the essential differences between CAD, CALP and CA (Carb Addicts)? I know that they are all plans developed by the Drs. Heller, but that's about as far as my knowlege goes.

I generally understand Carb Addicts.....carbs only once every 24 hours, Reward Meals consisting of 1/3 protein, 1/3 LC veggies and 1/3 carbs, no carbs the rest of the day. Is this pretty much CALP?

I have heard that CAD is much the same, only you have one hour to complete your RM, and you can eat anything you wish during that hour, w/ little attention to balancing as CA does.

I own the CA book, and have followed it, but have never read the other books. What have I misunderstood?

Thank you in advance.....

[Zuleikaa]

CALP and CA are just expansions of the original book CAD.

In the first book, they said at your reward meal you can have whatever you want, however much you want. They did make a passing mention to having a balanced meal. Of course carb addicts did not hear that and some used the reward meal as a carb bindge. Carbs taken to the extreme and not in the presence of other foods can still affect insulin levels. Additionally fake sugars cause carb addicts to react as if they are true sugars.

Therefore, in the next two books the Hellers clarified rules and fingered triggers, fake sugars, diet drinks, MSG, that can cause an insulin reaction and thus hunger, weight gains or stalls.

[JudyTrue]

Hi Everyone:

I've been lurking for a few days and, now that I have something to say, thought I'd join you!

After losing 10 lbs. in the first two weeks of Induction on Atkins, I totally stalled out for the next month, then gained back 2 lbs. without changing a thing about my diet. I'd read about CAD/CALP and decided to give it a try. Since Monday, I've added a few carbs (nothing over the top) to my evening meal and, as of this morning, have dropped 2 lbs. :) So, now I feel like I'm back on my way downward and couldn't be happier with this WOE. After Atkins, I almost feel like I'm cheating! It's such a relief to be able to relax a bit about carbs, but the funny thing is now that I'm able to add some at my Reward Meal, I find that I'm really not that interested and have just had a few bites. I've also not added dessert yet--think I have to ease into this program.

The bottom line for me is that I feel just relaxing about what I'm eating has had a very positive effect on me. Seeing the scale move downward hasn't hurt either! :roll: :roll:

[Zuleikaa]

Welcome Judytrue:

The frustrating thing about Atkins if your a true carb addict is that when you go off induction levels or eat more than 4 times a day, you stall. You can even gain weight!! People who don't have this condition have a hard time sometimes understanding that the plan, after induction, does not work with a carb addicts body chemistry.

Hang in there. I think you've found your road.

[skyspinner]

For Heaven's sake, I never knew that! I've read about folks "stalling" for months, and always thought to myself that it's no stall, it's just not working.....

So all these people who actually do lose on Atkins are NOT carb addicts? Wow! No wonder it didn't work for me!!! How come nobody ever mentions this?

Well, I got the CALP book from the library and have read most of it....it IS the same as CA. I've switched from Atkins now.....yesterday was sorta the first day and today the first real attempt to follow CALP. I just hope it works!

I haven't yet weighed, so don't know how it's going, but I must say it is such a relief to shop w/o looking for the LC stuff that isn't there! I loaded up on grapefruit, apples, graham crackers and lotsa meat and vegetables at the store today....I feel as if I've been let out of jail! :lol:

Many, many thanks for the insight.....

[cayce]

I saw this posting and felt I just had to jump in because I am getting a little frustrated and hope I can find some words of wisdom as I'm not losing any more. I started Atkins July 27th and was losing every week. However, for 3 weeks, I didn't lose anything and in fact gained 2 lbs last week!

I haven't had any bread, pasta or sugar since I've started and seem to have reached a plateau. I feel myself weakening. This is the TOM but I never had a gain before and it is really scary.

I've wondered if it is the 2 large coffee with cream that I have every day (my only vice now) but I've done this since I started Atkins but lost weight at the beginning.

Should I just trust the program or think about switching to another one? I'd really appreciate your comments.

[Zuleikaa]

There are degrees of carb addiction and and uncontrollable appetites for carbs. However, Rachel Heller also tried Atkins and couldn't lose and even gained.

For a "true" carb addict, there is an escalating insulin surge that occurs with every incidence of eating or of the eating of carbs. Since insulin is the hunger hormone, hunger grows and grows even if you have just eaten. This chemically induced appetite can become uncontrollable.

So you see, it is the amount of carbs you eat each time but it is also the frequency with which you eat at all. Think of a superball that bounces higher each time it hits the floor. Now think of the well-meaning suggestion that you eat six times a day or that you take in more carbs.

This is why the Heller's have the various eating plans of two to four meals a day. Each carb addict needs to find his/her own eating program but no more than four times a day.

This is probably why, unknowingly, some Atkinsers refuse to leave induction even though their weight loss has stalled and their metabolism has lowered. They know instinctively and through experience that if they leave the strict carb levels of induction their hunger comes screaming back and they wind up binging.

The levels of carb addictiion can be even further complicated by SAD (seasonal affective disorder). SAD creates carb addicts in winter by the chemical reaction (lack of) in the brain serotin levels caused by lack of light intensity. You can imagine what effect carb addiction on carb addiction has. Often people are not carb addicts or can keep their addictions under control during late spring and summer month's, but when winter comes Look Out!!! Watch the posts in the confession booth and entries in journals. The sad thing is that people don't realize it's SAD and carb addictions affecting them. They just think they're out of control!! I think it is actually freeing when you realize you have an addiction, what triggers it and how you can regain control!!!

Again, there are different levels of carb addiction and for some levels perhaps Atkins works for the long term. However, for the severe carb addict, (just my opinion) being stuck forever to induction for control of your disease is not living.

Cayce
I can not tell you what plan to choose. I can only recommend that you read through "Which low carb plan is right for me", but I can recommend that you read through the CAD book and see if it describes you. There is also a test in the book that helps determine your level/severity of carb addiction.

Thank you all for your patience of sitting through my "lecture", I have lived with my carb addiction and SAD a long time and was learning controls and triggers before the Hellers 'book came out. For me the Hellers' book was a life saver.

[Zuleikaa]

Cayce

If you are not a carb addict, perhaps you are not getting enough calories and have damaged/slowed your metabolism.

The solution to that is more food, limits of 12-16 ounces of protein (my suggestion) and patience. The body is a miracle of adaption and you abuse it at your own risk. It's a shame to say that many on Atkins cut calories by cutting out veggies when they should be adding them. However when adding, especially at first I would recommend sticking with the very low carb ones. However, you can still eat a lot of veggies for very few carbs.

[JudyTrue]

Wow, Zuleikaa, you are now officially my CAD Goddess! :D

Everything you've said makes so much sense to me, especially the explanation of why Atkins stops working for carb addicts. I can't thank you enough.

I really do feel as if I've found my way with LCing. I've added a few carbs to my evening meal since I switched plans on Monday, and I've magically dropped 2.5#!! The very best part of it, though, is that I'm relaxed about this whole WOE for the first time since starting Atkins in September. Somehow, I could DO Atkins, but it didn't quite feel right to me. Now, I'm feeling very optimistic.

Thanks again, Zuleikaa, and Hey Skyspinner--Aren't we learning a ton??

[skyspinner]

(genuflecting deeply and repeatedly) "We're not worthy, we're not worthy, we're not worthy"!!!

Thank you so much for all the info...keep it coming!

I had a great CALP day......even may have lost a bit this AM. A week or so should tell the tale, but for now, I'm just enjoying life again.....

Take care all.....and HAPPY HALLOWE'EN!!!!!

[Zuleikaa]

I'm Laughing, I'm Laughing!!! :D

Thank you both so much, you have made my day!!

I have to very careful what I say on the other boards. I don't want to be accused on touting any particular LC plan. But sometimes, especially when a person has been stalled for month's, I really have to gag myself because I so want to tell them "Of course this doesn't work for you, once you're off induction. You are a carbohydrate addict!!! Go to CAD.

If I do mention CAD the response is that some people can't control themselves at the reward meal and though it might work for me it doesn't work for everybody. That is so true and that is my point. One size diet does not fit all! If you cannot control yourself at the reward meal, just like in Atkins, you have to search the rest of your meals for hidden carbs. In addition, just having more than 4 meals a day can also cause a surge.

Thank's for letting me rant! :)

Again, I appreciate you both appreciating me.

[Zuleikaa]

Though carb allergy and carb addiction produce the same results, an uncontrollable appetite for carbs and binging, the two conditions are not alike in their causes, physical reactions and necessary treatments.

Carb allergy is a food allergy to a particular class of carbs, i.e. grains, sugars. It is like other food allergies such as dairy and yeast producing foods in that eating the food can cause a reactive increased appetite for that particular food allergen. Carb allergists' physical results, unlike those of a carb addict, can result in bloating, water retension, swollen joints, gas, diarhea, vomiting, mental fogginess and disorientation, skin eruptions and flu like symptoms. As you can see these are all negative symptoms and can make you feel very ill. Low carb diets other than CAD are the appropriate treatment for this condition as they eliminate, minimize exposure to allergens. Generally, carb allergists don't react this way to carb vegetables and fake sugars.
So, yes, I need to correct myself. Carb allergists can not control themselves at a Reward Meal. They are reacting to a food allergen!

On the other hand, carb addicts react to carbs as a group and can have a reaction, yes, to grains and sugars but also to carb vegetables, even broccoli! , and fake sugars. A carb addict's physical results, unlike those of the carb allegist, include pleasure and a sense of satisfaction and not the negative physical ones above. In addition, the carb addict can feel sleepy, lethargic and drugged. But that is the point. Carbohydrates are a drug to the carbohydrate addict. Think of a heroin addict. He gets a high when using the drug but as time goes on the pleasure period gets shorter and requires higher doses and more frequent applications to attain. The same is true of a carb addict, except where the heroin addict cycles over a period of time, the carb addict cycles many times in a day. In fact every time he/she eats or eats carbs.

So you can see that you have physical reactions, i.e. craving and binging, that are the same in both cases but their underlying causes and treatments are very different. Put a carb allergist on CAD and it won't work for them. At the same time, putting a carb addict on Atkins, other than the induction phase, or one of the more moderate low carb plans won't work for them either.

I think one of the determining factors in answering the question "Carb allergy or carb addict?" is the person in question's reaction to fake sugars and sugar alcohols. Consuming fake sugars and sugar alcohols seem to bother only "true" carb addicts (my feeling). A "true" carb addict reacts to anything carb or carb tasting, while carb allergists react only to their specific allergen(s). Another sign of a carb addict is an increased appetite or carb craving resulting from eating more than four times a day.

Thanks for your patience in letting me get this off my chest!

I love you gals!!! :D

[JudyTrue]

SOOOO...

It seems to me, as I think you've already said somewhere, that the only way to find out where you fall on the spectrum is to experiment with different plans until you find the one that "clicks" with your body--correct? Is it not all about getting to know your body and working with what you've got? I think this explains why, after I stalled after Induction on Atkins without cheating at all, a simple switch to CALP just felt so right to me, and I believe it was both physically and mentally.

I looked back at some of my postings earlier this week and realized that I said several times how relaxed I felt and this wasn't because I could "treat" myself to carbs or anything like that. The truth is that I've added very few carbs to my evening meal as I haven't really wanted them. But, obviously what I have added is just right for me because I feel better physically, my system is working better and my attitude is terrific.

Another thing has dawned on me, too. In the beginning, I believe Atkins was attractive to me not only for the promised fast weight loss but for the "unlimited" foods one could eat, because I was hungry all the time. But, after getting all the carbs and sugars out of my body, that constant hunger has disappeared and now it's all about finding balance, not volume. An awful lot of carbs are like "filler" and I just don't seem to need that any more. I also know that if I lit into a carb fest that I would feel like crud and probably want more, and I'm not about to give up the feeling that my hunger is now "normal" and under control.

Geez, I didn't mean to write a sermon here, but thanks for listening and I hope it makes sense. Keep the information coming, Zuleikaa!!

[Zuleikaa]

Judy

You are exactly right!

It is all about body chemistry and what plan works with your particular body chemistry. Body chemistries are not one size fits all either.

The relief you feel and the mental almost sense of rightness you now enjoy with CAD just confirms, as you said, that this is where you were meant to be. And you are also exactly right in that often you don't want a lot of carbs. It is an addiction! And once that addiction is controlled, appetite returns to normal, hunger is gone, cravings are gone and you truely know what it is to feel satisfied and hungering/craving no more!

[skyspinner]

Hi, Zuleika! Say, I am wondering...just who is it who is sitting on your freedom to discuss these things? Is there a BBS policy against espousing any particular plan?

I for one, am very glad to have the opportunity to hear this stuff....I danged sure ain't getting it any other way! I never heard about Rachael Heller trying Atkins, or that leaving Induction causes stalls in carb addicts. Did you read this somewhere or other? Or is it just common knowledge among the groups that i missed somehow?

Whatever, please don't stop!!!!! Keep it coming. This business about the diff between addiction and allergy is very interesting. I never knew that!

Well, Judy, looks as if we've started someting here....:lol:, little "trouble-makers" that we are!
:roll: :lol: :roll: :lol:

But I'm feeling GREAT this AM....after what could be considered a disasterous day yesterday. I'm loving this!

Many, many thanks for all the help and knowledge. :)

[GatorGal93]

Ditto. I second you, SkySpinner.

Keep up the great posts, Zuleika!

Julie

[JudyTrue]

Amen, Sister!!

I'm all for getting as much information as possible. How else can we make modifications without knowing what to try?

Zuleika--I haven't said this before, but a big CONGRATS on your weight loss so far! I'm assuming most of it has been with CAD since you've got so much information and so many insights. Way to go, girl! :cheer:

Skyspinner--Yes, we really are a couple of stinkers! :o Isn't it great, though, that we came to this thread and CAD/CALP at the same time? It's much more fun to learn by the buddy system!

Can I make one observation--actually two? In my opinion the CALP book is poorly written, and I find myself with as many questions as answers when I read it. Also, the CA website isn't much better and is so limited. Do you agree? I did see the Hellers on the Rosie show some time ago and, dare I say, they were a bit "different"! ;)

[Zuleikaa]

Sky Spinner, Julie

Thanks for the support! I really need it after the slam I just got from Rosebud on this board for my posting of CAD/CALP overview and rules.

Rachel Heller in CAD or CALP listed all the diets she tried and Atkins was on the list. She stated that she initiallly lost weight on all the diets but then stalled and gained and wound up even heavier than before. She/they also explains how eating multiple times a day (over 4) or carbs in the form of unlimited amounts of healthy vegetables can cause stalls and insulin reactions. In CALP they speak especially about the triggers of fake sugars, sugar free drinks and MSG.

I have been living with this plan for years. Believe me I know it and understand it very well.

[Rosebud]

after the slam I just got from Rosebud on this board for my posting of CAD/CALP overview and rules.
Zuleika, as I believe I made quite clear, all I object to is your untrue statement that leaving Atkins Induction causes increased hunger and binging. Just because Atkins does not suit you, does not mean it does not suit many other carb addicted people.

:rose:Rosebud:rose:

[tofi]

I for one, am very glad to have the opportunity to hear this stuff....I danged sure ain't getting it any other way! I never heard about Rachael Heller trying Atkins, or that leaving Induction causes stalls in carb addicts. Did you read this somewhere or other? Or is it just common knowledge among the groups that i missed somehow?

No, I hadn't heard about Rachel Heller having tried many diets, but then I haven't read the CAD or CALP books.

I also have not heard that leaving Induction causes stalls. I KNOW I am/was a carb addict and will probably always have a problem with them. But I have been on Atkins for 4 years and when I increase the carbs as recommended (5 grams daily per week), I keep on losing and don't feel hungry until I get to my CCLL. Then I still don't feel very hungry, but I decrease the carbs and start losing again. My slow losses with some gains are due to the emotional or 'excuse" eating I allow myself to do. (Also medications and 2 major surgeries in the last 3 years.)

Refering only to the "leaving Induction causes stalls in carb addicts", it is certainly not common knowledge because, in general, it isn't true. It may very well be the case in some individuals.

Say, I am wondering...just who is it who is sitting on your freedom to discuss these things? Is there a BBS policy against espousing any particular plan?

No one. I think that members are free to discuss any LC plan and follow any LC plan they choose, including their own personal version which may be taken from many plans. And members are free to post their opinions. Members should be careful to state that something is their own opinion, because if they post 'facts' which are not true, other members are free to point out the error.

In all cases, it is hoped that members will give each other the benefit of the doubt when someone disagrees before taking umbrage.

[GLHB~Rinoa]

Hi everyone! I saw this thread in Skyspinners journal. and I wanted to join in on all the fun too.

I am a succesful (not very long on the program) switcher from Atkins to CALP. And I love it! Lost 7 pounds since last monday almost 2 weeks. And before I was stuck for 2 months not losing a thing. Don't you think this WOE is so much easier than most plans? Have a great CAD/CALP weekend yall! Dru

[Elihnig]

Sometimes, it seems, just changing your diet will shake things up for your body and get it back on the weight loss track. I remember when I did the rotation diet (which I am thinking about starting up again) and how successful I was with that.

One more thing though, when someone does get stalled on Atkins, one of the basic recommendations that people make on this board is to leave induction levels and begin OWL, adding in more carbs. I do believe that you can stall from too few carbs as well as too many. Giving your body what it needs is the key, IMHO.

Elihnig

[roche]

Hey Dru, congratulations on losing 7 lbs. since switching over! I am currently still reading CAD, and for now will have a RM weekly. I'll weigh Wednesday and see how I compare to last week. It's good to know you are doing so well, I like the idea of a RM every day, it's just that I am worried I'll lose one pound a month! Not that that would be necessary too bad, I did gain almost twenty pounds last year!

It's been really informative reading these posts and I've enjoyed it. Roche

[sn2Bsknny]

hi you guys, i've enjoyed reading thru your posts. i just switched to CAD from adkins because of the GUILT of eating carbs at lunch. i can handle breakfast and dinner, but at lunch time i'm in my car (i'm in sales) and i tend to end up meeting with clients and munching on bread, or eating crackers or chips and dip and it was driving me NUTS. i had no will power (or desire to tell people what was going on) other days i'd end up at my parents for lunch (they're close to my work) and of course all they have is sandwich stuff and chips and cookies (and of course now, after halloween, CANDY) i just couldn't handle the temptation. dinner was always easy because my boyfriend is also low carbing and we'd cook together (terrific support).

but anyway, enough of my excuses, i read about CAD on here yesterday and went out and got the book. just the idea that i can eat a burger (WITH the bun) and anything else i'd want (pizza, chips, fries, you know) as long as it's within an hour makes me feel GOOD. i've been up and down with adkins. i'm currently back at my start weight of 145, but have been as low as 138. i only want to be down to 130, i know that's not much to lose, but i fear if i don't get control of my eating NOW, i'll eventually end up with a BIG goal.

i do have one question tho. what is the limit for carbs at the CMs? i think i read on here that it's 4, but i've not seen that in the book yet...HELP! so far today all i've had is 2 eggs fried in a T of butter so i think i'm ok, but some of my dinner recipes have anywhere from 5-10 carbs in them (which was great for adkins, but maybe not now?)

SO, i'm looking for tips, tricks, success stories, inspiration, whatever you can throw at me...THANK YOU!!!

[Zuleikaa]

There is not a carb limit per se with CAD. You can have up to 2 cups of cooked or raw allowed vegetables with your Complementary meals. "The amount you eat is not critical as long as you include both protein and high-fiber vegetables. Some prefer to have 1/2 protein, 1/2 vegetables" You can also have a small salad.

[cayce]

ZJ

Thanks so much for your insights. I have the CAD book and will read through it. What I've learned from this thread is that I need to experiment a little more and be open to the possibility that a modified plan will be the best for me.

I was hoping I would have a blissful result from LCing and that the weight would just automatically come off. I do know that it is and will be my WOL but I need to customize it to fit my body and lifestyle. I am a little nervous about trying a RM but I have to be willing to get over my fear of gaining and remember that this is a long-term endeavour. I'll find the perfect plan for me, I'm sure of that!

Thanks again and I am ever thankful for everyone's comments.

Cayce

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by JudyTrue

snip

Can I make one observation--actually two? In my opinion the CALP book is poorly written, and I find myself with as many questions as answers when I read it. Also, the CA website isn't much better and is so limited. Do you agree? I did see the Hellers on the Rosie show some time ago and, dare I say, they were a bit "different"! ;)

I don't know that I would characterize the book as "poorly written", in that it follows a rather popular style of telling stories, and I tend to skip a lot of that. The real meat that I found was on only about 4 pages...the part where they describe how to do the Basic Plan, and what foods to eat when. But I can see how you would think that is not especially well-written. :)

One thing that confused me was in the recipe section.....one recipe was for Liver Mushrooms, and involved mushrooms, butter, chicken livers, onion, cream cheese and some spices. Over in the "Rewarding Meals" recipes there was Easy Chicken Liver Paté", which contains chicken livers, chicken broth, eggs, onion, chicken fat or butter, salt and pepper. Now I ask you, why is one CM and the other RM? That makes no sense to me at all. Perhaps SKS will explain it to me? :)

What sorts of questions were you left with after reading the book?

I did not see the Hellers on Oprah's show, but was on an email alias that discussed it at length. Too bad she didn't understand the plan...it may have helped her quite a bit, especially since she had Richard and Rachael at her beck and call to help her whenever she needed it. As I understand it, she got hung up on wanting to eat carbs any time she wished, and just never stayed on the plan long enough to see if it worked for her. The story goes that they talked to her on the phone quite a bit and "sang songs" to her to help her along. I guess that's kinda "different". :lol:

Their website appears to be only for selling their books, and giving a overview of their plan. Too bad it isn't more interactive, or there isn't something like this website offers. I like being able to discuss and all.....guess you can tell I like to talk!

Take care.....see you all later!

[sn2Bsknny]

There is not a carb limit per se with CAD. You can have up to 2 cups of cooked or raw allowed vegetables with your Complementary meals. "The amount you eat is not critical as long as you include both protein and high-fiber vegetables. Some prefer to have 1/2 protein, 1/2 vegetables" You can also have a small salad.

i just read a sentence in the book that says "do not eat carbs at any of your other meals" (other than your RM) so i'm assuming that as long as i stick to the list that is provided, they don't consider the veggies to have carbs? this is a little confusing considering i was programmed into adkins way of thinking, you know? what do you all eat for your CMs?

Sn2BSknny

[Zuleikaa]

Correct.

I think--They don't consider the vegetables in the amounts allowed to be reactive on insulin levels and thus cause carb cravings.

I think--This is a diet that you have to get in tune to your own personal body chemistry to excel at. There are hidden triggers and foods that will cause you to react. They can be different for different people. As you go on, get in tune with how your body feels.

[skyspinner]

Well, I stayed the same for two days, then gained a pound. Is this supposed to happen on CALP?

[Zuleikaa]

Skyspinner

I warned you. Look back over your journal last week and see the cheats. Carbs at other than a reward meal and carb binging reward meals.

The Hellers say that either can reverse the process through which your body is emptying fat stores and you can gain weight and incite cravings. One incident is enough to do it!! This diet is based on body chemistry and insulin levels.

The results of abuses of the plan can show up days later when you think you got away with something.

Get back on plan :)

Love :tears:

If you can't resist, maybe this isn't the plan for you. Maybe you're allegic to carbs.

Try to give it two weeks sticking strictly to plan.

[skyspinner]

Well the, I should start seeing some loss, 'cause I've been on plan for 3-4 days now. We'll see.....

[JudyTrue]

Hi Everyone:

Sorry to have dropped off the thread for a while--that darned thing called WORK! :(

So, all of a sudden I have no appetite--none at all. Has anyone else experienced this? Yesterday, I ate once and didn't even want what I did eat. Today, I feel the same. This happened to me on Induction also, so I know it'll pass. I know it's not good to skip meals, but I get a little queazy when I think of eating.

Also, I have to admit that I'm still a bit confused when it comes to CMs. What are all of you eating? 1/2 protein and 1/2 veggies?

Thanks! :)

[skyspinner]

EXACTLY the same thing has happened to me.....I don't feel queasy at all, just have no interest in eating. For the past two days I've had just the RM meal, and no hunger. I thought that I would be ravenous this morning, but so far haven't wanted to eat. Had my coffee w/ cream, and 36 ounces of water, and feel just fine. Its mid-morning here.

On the CM jam, my understanding is roughly half protein and half LC vegetables. Chicken Caesar salad w/o croutons is perfect for me. I think it's just important to not have either LC veggies or protein alone, but the two together. Anyway, that's my take on it. :)

There is also an Option in the CALP book that addresses eating a greater proportion of veggies to the other foods, so I think you can dink w/ this if you like. But read the book.....I may not have that right.

I have lost weight! This AM I am down to 226.8, which I last saw on 10/10/02. I hope it keeps up.....tomorrow is my weekly weigh in day, and I will be tracking both that day and the weekly average changes. If I stick today, I should be looking at a loss of about 2 pounds. Wheeeeee!!!!!!!!!!

[skyspinner]

:dazzle: ***** :daze: ***** :D ***** :roll: ***** :p ***** :thup: ***** :Party: ***** :cheer:

Well, it's official....I am now down 3.2 pounds since 10/30, which I consider my start date for CALP. I'm pretty impressed!

:yay: ***** :dazzle: ***** :yay:

And this plan is soooooo much easier to stay on than Atkins. I am less hungry, and I know that I have to wait only 24 hours at the most to enjoy anything in the entire world that I want to eat. That's so liberating!!! Thinking that I could NEVER again enjoy so many GREAT foods was a real turnoff for me. "Never" is 'way too long. 24 hours? I can deal.

Big "Thank you" to all who gave such good advice...keep it comin'!!!

Hope everyone is having a great LC day.....let's hear those success stories, folks.... :)

:dazzle: ***** :daze: ***** :D ***** :roll: ***** :p ***** :thup: ***** :Party: ***** :cheer:

[nawchem]

SKY Congratulations on your loss!

I'm just snooping on you CADers. I saw the book on carb addiction, on sale last night and bought it. I'm a major carb addict. I tried to do the Zone but had hunger and cravings in a major way. I thought maybe it was the fruit triggering the cravings but was wondering where that fits with the carb addiction. Maybe it was the 5 meals a day bothering me.

I was wondering where fat fits into the picture with the Hellers. When your eating the lowcarb meals with the veges could I put butter on my veges?

Nancy

[skyspinner]

Hi, Nancy. Thank you for your good wishes....I am jazzed! Just hope it keeps on the way it's started.

I am no expert, but I CAN read :lol: .....in my copy of "The Carbohydrate Addict's Life span Program", copyright 1997, on page 123 under the list of Craving-Reducing Foods, butter is explicitly stated as an allowed oil, fat or dressing.

So, butter those veggies! Rock on!!!

In my experience, eating fruit brings on major hunger for me...always has, even when I was a kid. And I was a skinny kid. :lol: I have not tried The Zone.

So, are you thinking of switching to CALP? There's a lot of really good people w/ CALP experience here to help, if you decide it's for you. Just bring your questions right here.

Take care....

[nawchem]

I think I may try it. I really identified with the things they bring up in the book. Once I start eating carbs the only reason I stop eating is because I can't fit anymore food in my stomach. This forum is the only place in the world I can admit to that.

Plus, I have a lot of higher carb foods in the house from the zone so I was thinking I could burn those off on reward meals while I try CAD ( I hate wasting food).

My body has been so messed up lately, I lost quite a bit of weight, gained half of it back. Started taking a betablocker, found out I don't need most of it when I lowcarb. Had low thyroid, got on medication, stopped taking it, don't know if I need that. I have heart palpitations all the time, may be stress related, but the only thing I'm really stressed about is my weight. For 6 weeks I could only sleep 2 hours a night, got really sick and slept a week straight. I haven't exercised or even moved much in a month. Dr told me to stop Atkins, and do the zone. That's when the weight gain started. I lose a lot of water when I do Atkins which they thought caused the heart problems but I haven't done it in a month and still have the heart problems. So I'm really confused and feel like I've been on a rollercoaster. Now the dr thinks I have hypoglycemia. I've decided to take a break from drs and try long walks, bubble baths, and prayer. Thanks for listening to all this.

Yesterday when I weighed in and saw how much weight I had gained I cried my eyes out. Today I feel a lot more hopeful.

Nancy

[skyspinner]

You are wise, Grasshopper, to listen to your body and mind.....

Take care....

[VictoriaT]

Hi All,
Im lurking because I am thinking about CAD. I am also thinking about BFL. Its not that I am unhappy with Atkins, because in 5 months I have lost about 50 lbs (Didnt post my new numbers yet so shhh :lol: )

I drink (and always did) diet cokes, eat Atkins bars and eat SF jello. I am a definite SUGAR addict.

I think that what someone said in an earlier post is true. ITs so strange. For 4 months I did not cheat ONE time. I exercised all the time-I lost weight. Then, I had a tortilla with my fajitas, I had some small amt of rice with my chicken and another day I had chips and salsa. The weird thing? I LOST WEIGHT. I also checked my ketosticks and they were still pink. Its weird. I think that for my weight, I wasnt eating enough carbs and that upping the carbs was a great thing.

My only reservation about CAD is that I dont want to get in the habit of eating candy and sweets all the time again for RM. I think MENTALLY its not a good thing for me to do--its comfort food.

Opinions?

You are all doing great!
Vicki

[roche]

because in 5 months I have lost about 50 lbs (Didnt post my new numbers yet so shhh )
I heard that!! ;)

Roche

[JudyTrue]

Hi VictoriaT: :wave:

I think I can accurately say that most of us on this thread switched to CAD/CALP because it just seemed right for our bodies. I only switched not quite two weeks ago, so I'm really green to this plan, but I've not found it difficult at all to control my carbs at my RM.

Right now, I've totally lost my appetite, but when I do plan my RM, I'm very careful to plan the WHOLE meal, including dessert--if any. So far, I haven't been tempted to add any extra carbs whatsoever, and I wake up the next morning still full from the night before and my meals have been very small so far. Of course you're right not to overindulge in sweets (or anything else really), but you just may find that giving yourself an occasional treat takes away the craving entirely. That's why this works for me.

Let us know what you decide to do!

[VictoriaT]

Roche: Hee hee hee All my friends are over here lurking on this thread, but I did post it in my journal. I couldnt resist :lol:

Judy: Thanks :) I would love the thought of having...

a sandwhich!!!!

I miss my sandwhiches.

I miss cereal.

Yum yummy!
Ill keep on lurking on here though-its good to learn about things and nice to see successful people on BOTH plans :)
Vicki

[nawchem]

Hi Victoria
(congratulations on the weight loss)

Today is my first day of CALP and I was just reading they recommend in the options trading out sweets for complex carbs. I think it depends on the person. I like the idea of the reward meal so I can have Mexican food and sushi, most of my friends like pizza and now I can have a slice. So I think its great as a special occasion thing. But if I don't lose I'll be right on back to Atkins.
Nancy

[Zuleikaa]

I'm back in town after three days.

SkySpinner

See. Work the plan and the plan works! Because it really is chemically based, you can't cheat. If you do, sometimes even once, it stops working.

Judy
The magic of CAD/CALP. Yes your appetite goes away and you really have to push to remind yourself to eat. Remember though, you must have at least one CM and one RM a day. The lack of hunger doesn't pass. Get used to it. This is your real body.

Others
You can have any fat as long as it's not margarine or shortening. Fat is not really limited. Your reward meals don't have to include sweets. Some carb addicts have a sweet tooth, some do not. The Reward Meal includes the carbs you want be it sweets, breads, or fruits.

Great to hear the success stories. Let's get this forum rocking!!

[roche]

As I posted in my journal, I AM JUMPIN' SHIP! The Atkins ship, that is. And starting bright and early Friday a.m., I will be on CAD along with the rest of ya! :wave: I won't be going hog wild with sweets however. I have no sense of self control -regardless if there is a timer that goes off at sixty minutes. I am the type that would have to make a pan of brownies, save a couple for myself, and GIVE ALL THE REST AWAY to make sure I don't eat the rest. That is just how I am. If it is in the house, I have no sense of self-control. I have been known to rifle through every creak and cranny of our home to find any hidden chocolate and eat it until it is ALL GONE!! This may or may not work for me but I am willing to give it a shot.

I have been browsing through CAD for over a week and still going over it. I wanted to clarify about the sugar substitutes, now according to CAD, sugar substitues are not recommended? Does that include splenda and does that include diet sodas? Can I have a diet soda with a CM? I might be confused with what I have read on other posts, not sure. So also, does that mean that Pure Delight bars and such are discouraged on this plan? (Believe me, if they are discouraged, I am sure I will be satisfied with an occasional Hershey Bar at RM). And from what I understand, aside from the two CMs and the RM, no snacking, even if lowcarb.

Thanks for all the info. and advice I have been able to read, it sure has been helpful. Hope to keep learning more. Roche

[nawchem]

Hi Roche- good luck for tomorrow, I'm eager to hear how it goes for you.

Today was day one. I was pretty hungry, just didn't eat enough, but had zero sweet cravings. I was looking forward to the rm all day. By the time I had salad, veges and fish I was so stuffed. I had a little bag of cracker jacks that I ate. That was 4 hours ago and I still have the after Thanksgiving feeling. I had all kinds of temptations today but I had absolutely no cravings or desire for sweets at all. Now if I can just lose this weight.

Nancy

[Zuleikaa]

Roche

This is my personal opinion/understanding of CAD/CALP. If you fit the profile of a Heller carbohydrate addict then there is an actual chemical reaction that occurs when you ingest real carbs or even sweet tasting foods. That chemical reaction is an insulin surge that causes additional hunger/cravings or hypoglycemic reaction. The carbohydrate addict has a malfunctioning insulin regulator that causes the release of too much insulin at every feeding or ingesting of carbs.

An additional handicap, as I said, is that anything sweet tasting also causes this surge. This means that sugar free products such as gum, sodas, meal bars, candies, mints and other things also cause this reaction. That is why the Hellers specify that nothing is to be eaten between meals and that meals are restricted to no more than four a day. That is also why the use of sugar substitutes is also severely restricted.

As a trial, I would have no more than a total of 3 sugar substitutes a day taken with meals. Watch for your body's reaction and any continued hunger after the reward meal. If you are still hungry after the reward meal, cut down/out.

[skyspinner]

Well, isn't the Good Ship CAD/CALP just busting at the seams? That's great! I hope all the folks who just boarded her find the cuisine magnificent and the entertainment spectacular. :lol:

I am down 0.2 this AM, but still up from a couple days ago. I guess this is a "normal" swing, to be seen only w/ daily weights. And yes, I do plan to average..... :)

I had a CM day before yesterday, of hamburger patty and cucumber. First CM meal I've had, as I simply have not had any hunger at all. This is my sixth day of on-plan. But after that CM, my weight went up. I think the single meal a day plan is working best for me.

My only problem right now is getting overfull at RM. By the time I'm done eating the salad, protein and LC veggies, there's no room for the good stuff! :lol: And I, too feel "stuffed" for several hours after RM. Gonna do something to fix that today.

But it's great to be relieved of the need to eat. That insulin information is really right-on.

Question for the gurus here.....I can't find it in the books. Is it legal to drink black, unsweetened decag coffee or tea between meals? It's listed w/ the "Craving-Reducing Foods", and the Hellers say to drink lots of water and other non-caloric beverages, but don't mention the timing of black coffee or tea. What's our "group conscience" take on this one, please?

Hope you are all having a wonderful day and continue to win!

Take care.....

[Zuleikaa]

Coffe and tea are fine anytime unless you react to caffeine. It is what you put into it that causes the problem. Limit yourself to 3 sugar substitutes a day and if you have reactions further limit it.

Re balanced reward meal. Most times I don't but I try to be concious not to overdo or not to overdo everyday. But I do think about it and always include veggies. Unless I'm having breakfast for dinner. My most pig out meals seem to be breakfast for dinner. All those carbs! Yum!! I often cut juice out though. But toast and jam, pancakes, home fries. Don't get me started!!

What I like about the plan is that everyone needs to find their own level and that level will be very individual. Your food needs can also vary with TOM and stress.

My plan was usually two meals a day. Sometimes the CM was very small. Sometimes the RM was very large. It all depended. Sometimes I only had 1 meal, sometimes I needed three. Sometimes I used to have veggies for breakfast, just to get them in.

Re hunger, lack thereof--I think there is a quote in the CAD book where one of their patients comments, "The voice is gone. You know that voice in the back of your head that is always wondering what you're going to eat next and when you're going to eat. That voice is gone." "This must be what a normal person feels like." It's like that.

[skyspinner]

Friday, November 8, 2002

226.0. A new low since starting Atkins. I worked diligently on not overeating yesterday, made absolutely NO effort to balance anything, and I think it worked out very well.

:Party: ***** :dazzle: ***** :daze: ***** :D ***** :roll: ***** :spin:

Hope everyone is having a great weekend. Take care, all.....

[roche]

Okay, I did it. One day of CAD accomplished. I actually was able to eat the two CMs and one RM without snacking in between. Hm.....maybe I CAN.....do this. Finished off RM with six minutes left on timer!! ;) Ended up having the potato soup, french bread, and chocolate chip cookies. Oh, those cookies were divine!! Today had br. of eggs & bacon, lunch of bacon cheeseburger (no bun) and RM of japanese food. Can't wait for that miso soup, rice and teriyaki chicken.

"Breakfast" for an RM sounds awesome, as well. Ever since looking into CAD, (THANKS SO MUCH SHEILA AND SKYSPINNER!!), I have heard from others who previously did CAD or who know others who did CAD. Seems like the consensus is that it is a really manageable eating plan.

Everyone have a great weekend, Roche

[roche]

BTW, I remember reading in CAD to try and be consistent with keeping RM "about" same time every day (like don't switch back & forth between br. and dinner., etc). I am assuming from reading Zuileka's posts and others, that one or two CM's a day isn't an issue. for example, if I don't feel like eating lunch (CM), that won't effect my blood sugars or whatever, right? I can just go to RM in evening, right?

Thanks Roche

[Zuleikaa]

Right. The important thing with CAD is to learn your own body and your own body chemistry and to eat when you get hungry and not by the clock. That means whether you have one CM or two or an extra snack is your choice and depends on your own needs for food that day. AS LONG AS YOU DON'T EAT MORE THAN FOUR TIMES ANY DAY. That need can vary day to day with activity level, stress or TOM. LISTEN TO YOUR BODY, EAT WHEN YOU ARE HUNGRY. DO NOT SKIP THE REWARD MEAL.

In some weird way, I think, for a Heller defined carbohydrate addict, the CA actually needs the carbs at the RM to regulate the body and make it lose weight. No carbs (low level), no weight loss. Just my opinion.

[JudyTrue]

Hi Roche: :wave:

Sounds like you're doing great so far!! I've been skipping meals this past week, and it hasn't affected my appetite at all. I simply haven't had any! For a few days, I ate a bit of something at my CM even if I wasn't hungry, but then just gave up the ghost and started listening to my body. A later breakfast and my RM at dinnertime seems to suit me.

I also agree with Zuleika about a CA needing some carbs to lose weight and, I would add, just feel good. Since I've changed to this plan from Atkins, my attitude is great, my body's "working" better and I feel really good.

YEA for CAD/CALP! :cheer:

By the way, Japanese food--YUM!

[nawchem]

Hey Roche I'm glad you're first day went well. Doesn't the food taste great? I still haven't figured it out is it the lack of guilt?

This is my third day and I've lost weight everyday after eating a huge reward meal and all the craving meals. I'm so surprised. It doesn't seem like I'm eating way different from the Zone but on that diet I gained 9.5lbs in 3 weeks was starved and had major sugar cravings. I feel like a normal person, I'm so surprised I'm not sitting here thinking about my next meal, or should I have some coffee or a soda to try to satisy my cravings.

I'm curious about you all. How did you score on the addiction test? My score was 45 which is pretty intense.

Nancy

[Zuleikaa]

58 out of 60 for CAD. 45 out of 50 for CALP.

[roche]

I took the CAD test and wasn't sure how to answer 8.

? A mean of only meat and veggies leaves me feeling unsatisfied.

Before I started Atkins, the answer to that would have been a definite "YES." However, since I have been on Atkins since first of August, now the answer is "NO," becuase I have for the most part adjusted to eating lc and it's not an issue anymore.

So with Question 8 answered as "Yes" - score is 44.

With it answered as "No" - score is 41.

So regardless of how I answer it, score falls into the Moderate Carbohydrate category.

I noticed that with saving diet soda for RM and with no snacks in between meals, I am DEFINITELY getting lots and lots of water in. I think I'll keep that up.

Take care, roche

[skyspinner]

I think I was 47 on CALP and 45 on CAD. Pretty close, anyway.

Last spring I had an abnormal 5-hour glucose tolerance test w/ insulin levels, so I knew I was a carb addict before taking the test. That test showed that I was on my way to becoming Type II diabetic, which is a normal production of insulin, but an abnormal utilization....that "insulin resistance" you've heard so much about . :)

But it was very interesting to see how accurate the Hellers' tests were. They've done a very good job of bringing their program to us, I think.

Take care all.....

[RedLisaP]

What a great thread. I don't remember my score on test, but it was pretty high.

When I switched from Atkins to CAD I remember feeling guilty about the RM carbs -- not any more! I really think I need those carbs to continue losing weight. I have noticed some things about my body and daily diet because of the daily (morning) weighings.

- If I have coffee with half-n-half in the afternoon I end to either stay the same or gain (the coffee shop next door doesn't have cream and I always forget to bring some to work).
- If I eat more than 3 times a day I definitely go up at the next weighing.
- If I eat breakfast (usually just a half of a "Think Thin" bar) it's better than skipping breakfast completely.
- The more water I drink, the better chance the scale will go down the next day.
- No BM means higher weight (I know, "duh", but it had to be said).
- The week prior to TOM is always a slight gain. The week of and after, is always a loss.
- Weekend cheating (hard to resist) ALWAYS means Monday morning weigh-in is on the high side.
- Wine has not been a problem for me at all in terms of stalling my weight loss. However white is better than red. I do not keep to the one hour RM timeframe with the wine, since I *must* have my glass while I'm cooking. I think the wine just doesn't affect my blood sugar like it does other people.
- Desserts at the RM affect my weight less than "good carbs" like pasta or potatoes (and do I love my potatoes).

I'd be interested to know if others have similar experiences. I probably forgot a few things, but this is the basic gist.

Cheers!

Lisa

[nawchem]

Welcome Lisa,
thanks for sharing all your experience. I was really glad about the last one, since I don't want to give up chocolate. How long have you been doing CAD? So far my weight has gone down 0.5lb everyday but I know it can't last so I'm trying to prepare myself for that. BTW have you tried the options from CALP?

I have slept so great since I started this plan. Having the extra carbs in the evening makes me feel so relaxed.

If you all have anything positive, any successes please share them here. Its really motivating to me. I loved reading when Sky said she lost weight, I'm still in the is this really gonna work stage.

The Eades from protein power were on an infomercial today. They were selling this stuff called pentabosal. Has anyone tried it?

Nancy

[RedLisaP]

Nancy,

I was on Atkins for a month and then heard about CAD, read the book, and immediately switched. That was about mid-June. I've had good weeks and bad weeks, and several weeks where nothing happened at all. But over all, I've consistently lost about a pound a week.

A half pound a day is great, and pretty fast (maybe a little too fast?). The general recommendation is between 1/2 to 2 pounds a week, regardless of which plan, in order to maintain a healthy weight loss. I suspect that will level off. Are you on the induction?

I have read the CALP book but I really like the CAD plan better - it suits my lifestyle better. Once I hit my goal (only 5 lbs to go!) I think I will re-read the CALP book and see what I can do for a good maintenance plan.

I so love this diet - I tell everyone about it. It is the first ever diet (sorry, WOE) that I really think I can stay on forever.

Lisa

[roche]

This is my third day and I've lost weight everyday after eating a huge reward meal and all the craving meals

So Nancy, are you eating any desserts with your RMs? Just wondering. (This is the one LOOMING question on my mind every time I read about a lowcarber doing CAD and losing weight. :D )

Okay, so today marks my third day of CAD. So far so good. I can't believe I can actually stop eating at the end of sixty minutes for RM and I haven't gone berserk over the leftover goodies. There are brownies and cookies leftover on my counter, and I am honestly doing just fine. Usually, I would be foaming at the mouth trying to control myself not to eat them. I mean, sure, I'd LIKE to eat them, but I don't HAFTA eat them. Know what I mean? I guess it's because I know I can always have them tomorrow for dinner. I am starting to think that the Hellers are a lot smarter than I gave them credit for. I really thought that their advice surely wouldn't apply to ME!

Catch ya'll later. Have a great CAD week! Roche

[nawchem]

Hey Roche,
I'm totally going for the chocolate at the rm. I'm having the same experience as you. Today I bought a bag of peanut butter cups, ate half at rm. The rest are in the cupboard. This has never happened before. In the past I would have eaten them to the point that I felt physically ill, waited a few hours and then had the rest. One day I did have fruit but I really look forward to having some chocolate everyday. I'm still thinking there might be a delayed reaction and I'll step on the scale and will have gained 10lbs overnight. It just seems too good to be true.

About the lowcarber-I don't know if I can honestly call myself that anymore ya know? I felt embarressed at the store buying goodies, and I also had to buy some cheese and cream, especially embarressing when you're overweight and you know what the cashiers thinking.

Lisa- I'm doing CALP, I don't think it has an induction. For the first 2 weeks they give ya 3 rules and that's all I'm doing. I don't lose weight quickly at all I think its just a first week thing, especially since I take beta-blocker, I told myself when I started that I would be satisfied with 0.5lb a week. I mostly need to see some consistent results. It is so great for you to be so close to goal, you've really gotta reward yourself when you get there, its a huge accomplishment.

Nancy

[need2bthi2]

:spin: :spin: How big do you have your rm? Mine is usually a good plate full (2 cups of salad and then the rest is protien & veggies). :spin: :roll: :daze:

[JudyTrue]

Hi Everyone! :)

It's so terrific to read how well everyone is doing on CAD/CALP. It's funny, though, how many times folks are saying, "This is too good to be true!" I guess it makes sense since most of us switched from Atkins.

I've just completed two weeks on CALP since switching, and I lost 3 pounds the first and 1 the second. Slow going, but it's fine by me since I feel SO good and have totally relaxed about my WOE. I totally believe that my body also needs carbs to lose and to feel good (as someone said above) and for my system to function properly.

Last, but not least, I found Atkins so boring and the possibilities on CAD/CALP seem endless. It's just incredible to know that I can have a "treat" at the end of the day. Last night, my dessert was two Milano cookies and the scale went down this morning. Does it get any better than that???

Cheers!!
:D

[VictoriaT]

Hi everyone!
Glad to see you are all doing so well.
So, I havent read the book yet-but have a real quick question-do they explain the scientific reserach of eating within one hour? I am a biochemist by training and to me, Atkins makes sense. I dont get the whole eat within one hour thingy though.

I am so scared to try out this WOE but looking at all of you makes me feel a bit better.

Anyone, anyone?

Yes, I am in the midst of reading-just a real quick question since they go into detail explaining Atkins.

Thanks!
Vicki

[Zuleikaa]

Vicki

The one hour reward meal limit explanation.

Background
1. In CA's too much insulin is released in the presence of carbohydrates.
2. This insulin release occurs every time you ingest carbs or eat or taste anything sweet.
3. Insulin is released in two stages if needed--the first stage is based upon the amount of insulin released at previous releases (for CAs this escalates), the second stage is a check to see if there are any carbs remaining that the first insulin stage didn't process.
4. These two stage insulin releases occur approximately 70 minutes apart.
5. Insulin is the hunger hormone. The more insulin surges and the more insulin in your system, the more hunger/cravings you have.

So
1. If you eat 4 or fewer times per day, you control insulin release escalation.
2. If your previous meals are lc, the amount of initial insulin guaged to be needed by your body and released is less and thus provides for less insulin surge/escalation of insulin release.
3. If you finish your reward meal in 60 minutes or less, your body has released less insulin initially, see 1 and 2. Additionally, you have further fooled your body because when it goes to check for the presence of carbs for the second insulin release there are none there.

Result
1. Lower, no insulin levels in blood.
2. No storage of fat
3. Release of fat stores
4. No/reduced hunger/cravings.
5. More energy.

Just my understanding.

[VictoriaT]

Thank you Z.
You are definitely a positive role model for CAD because look at you! You go girl.

I know Im addicted to carbs and sweets. When I started Atkins, I had WICKED headaches for one whole week. I guess that I am scared that if I go back to eating some of the things that make me out of control, Ill go through all that agin. Just a fear.

Thanks for the explanation. I am not going to attempt this without reading cover to cover... :thup:

[skyspinner]

Hi, all....looks as if we are all doing very well, indeed! Couldn't be happier.....

I am now down into the 225s....a place I haven't been in a good long time. I think it's time to take a cautious stand here and say "It's working". :lol:

I took RedLisaP's post to heart and realized that I had not had a good BM for a few days, and took action last night to fix that. I should have paid better attention, but you know how it goes....I plan to be sure that problem doesn't arise again. :)

As to how fast any individual is losing, I would be absolutely thrilled to be losing a half-pound a day. Back when I first did CALP, I lost at about that rate, and it was great. Too bad I was too dumb to stay on it at all costs, but let Life intervene....ah well....anyway, I think the loss may slow down after the first rush, so don't fret about losing too fast unless you begin to feel unwell. Just my two cents' worth there.....

I am baking today...Toll House cookies and banana pecan bread for the freezer.....and for today's RM. I can' t wait....the house smells SO good! Plus, I have avocados to eat up. Yum!!!

I realize now that I could not possibly have lived the rest of my life on Atkins, even if it had been working like a charm, which it wasn't. There's just too much enjoyment in food to lock it away forever. Learning how to enjoy it w/o letting it run my life is a much better goal, IMHO....:lol:

Well, take care, all....hope you are having a great LC day....and yes, I do believe we can still call ourselves that.....must be, or why is there a CAD/CALP forum on this board?

Bye.....

[Tigra1965]

Hi Everyone

I have been on the Atkins WOE since the 29th May 02 and lost approx 20lb. It has been more than this (up to 26), but I keep struggling.

I did very well on induction and lost 13lb, but then things slowed right down or I regained and some months I never lost anything at all.

What I have found really hard is the strictness of Atkins. Sometimes I have no problem with it and other times I just crave other foods so badly.

I take supplements of L-glutamine and chromium picolinate daily, as well as vitamins and minerals.

I started off so well with atkins, but now am getting no where and I can confess to having high carb moments at least once a fourtnight now and cannot seem to get myself totally out of them.

I posted in my journal about these struggles and a nice person directed me to the Hellers home page. After reading it and then coming on here - I now see that maybe the atkins WOE is not the plan for me.

I have continued on Induction since I started and am going to buy the CAD book tomorrow. I think this could be the answer for me, but I'm worried about regaining what I have lost.

What does BM, CM and RM mean? and how do they work?

I hear the mention of cups of veggies etc - what do you class as a cup (I'm in the UK)?

Sorry about all the questions :o

I have to say this thread is really enlightening and I've read the lot of it this evening. Please keep it up for beginners like me who will need all the help they can get.

Thank you in advance
:wave:

[need2bthi2]

Originally posted by Tigra1965


I started off so well with atkins, but now am getting no where and I can confess to having high carb moments at least once a fourtnight now and cannot seem to get myself totally out of them


:wave: [/B]

I know exactly how you feel. I was exactly the same. This is the 3rd day back to hellering. I feel good. As long as my clothes stay loose I will perservere. But I make sure I am very controlled at my RM. My treat tends to be a couple of slices of toast which is a absolute treat for me and a couple of lollies. After doing Atkins it is lovely to be able to eat toast! I make sure it is high fibre.

[skyspinner]

Hi, Tigra....glad you found us over here in the corner! :lol: Your experiences are not that different from what many of us have had, so you're in good company indeed.

As to the abbreviations....well, only two of them are Hellers' inventions, namely CM (Complementary Meal) and RM (Reward Meal) The CM is the 1 to 3 meals per day you may eat that contain no carbohydrate-rich foods. The RM is the one meals per day that you must eat that can contain anything your little heart desires. Purty good, huh?

As to that "BM", well, that's just an abbreviation for an ordinary body function we should all do once a day....."bowel movement". :lol: Not surprisingly, if one does not do this regularly, one's weight tends to creep up a bit.....anyway, back to your adventure w/ CAD.....

There are several very experienced folks on this forum, and each of them will be able to help you out as you need it....just ask. That's all ya gotta do. :)

If you want to, while you are waiting for your book to arrive, you might try staying on Atkins Induction and limiting your intake of foods greater than about 4 g carbs/serving to only one meal per day. At the rest of your meals, eat proteins and LC veggies...anything that gives you 4 g carbs per serving or less. That'll be good practice for when you get started on CAD, if you'd like to do that. Or you can wait until you've read your book completely and have a good understanding of the science behind the plan.

For a good explanation of the science, see above where Zuleikaa explains the insulin release during eating and why the RM must be limited to one hour. She's right on about it, and this is the central piece of the Hellers' plan. No matter which book of theirs you are following, they did not stray from this original concept. Once you get that down, you've got it! :)

The "cup" serving is a standard measuring cup....in the US it's 8 fluid ounces.

Again, welcome...we're glad you came!

[RedLisaP]

Julie,

The strictness of Atkins is what made me switch to CAD. I felt totally liberated after switching (after I got past the guilt of eating carbs at the RM (reward meal).

The basic premise on CAD and CALP is that you eat two (or three) Complementary Meals (CM) which consist of low-carb vegetables and protein, and one Reward Meal (RM) that contains low-carb vegetables, protein, and carbs - any carbs you want.

I definitely recommend you read the book. Although I'll warn you that the Hellers don't do quite as thorough a job of explaining the chemistry behind it all that Atkins does. However, you'll get the general idea of how it works. Also, many of the threads here explain this as well (I just read one earlier today).

Oh, one cup is 8 ounces (volume), or approx. 250 ml. BM is bowel movement ;-).

No need to apologize about your questions - that's what this forum is all about.

Good luck in making your decision!

Lisa

[nawchem]

Hi Julie

I was wondering if the foods you crave are carbohydrate foods? I think this plan works for those of us who get high insulin levels and that has caused us to store so much fat. There is a quiz in the book that you can use as a guide. Plus you can use your own experience. Before lowcarb I had noticed one day that I got kind of low energy in the afternoons. I would eat cookies or crackers just a few, and then I would be ravenous.

BM=bowel movement
CM=craving reducing meal (high fiber vegetables and protein)
RM= reward meal (salad + CM + reward)

I wasn't sure about the units for you regarding the cup question. For me I usually eat 1lb of frozen vegetables over the day + the required salad (approx 400ml).

I was very nervous about gaining too. I did the zone right before this following the meals they recommended and gained 9.5lbs in 3 weeks. I'm only on day 5 of CALP. Last Wed I weighed 145 and today I weigh 140, so I feel like I surely won't gain eating this way. I guess which plan is the best is a very individual thing.

Nancy

[JudyTrue]

Hi Julie and Welcome! :wave:

I had just the same experience as you--lost on Induction in the first two weeks, then stalled out, then gained two pounds. :( I just started CALP two weeks ago and have dropped 4 pounds, so it's working for me, and I'm feeling great! It does take a while to readjust your brain ;) but the plan is fairly straight forward, and you can get all of your questions answered here!! :)

Wow, Nancy, you're REALLY doing well! Five pounds in five days--I'm so impressed and jealous! A big cheer for you! :cheer:

[roche]

So basically, the equation goes like this........

CM + RM + BM = WEIGHT LOSS

Okay, sorry guys, just my juvenile sense of humor......and yes, I did graduate from the eighth grade. I know it can be hard to tell sometimes.

Fourth day of CAD, haven't deviated from rules so far.....everyone good luck and have a fantastic CAD week! Roche

[plum]

lol at your equation, Roche. Perhaps it not so daft either :)

Ive been doing Atkins 15 months. Lost 12 lb on induction and in following 14 1/2 months.....wait for it .... 8lb.

Iam very committedto LC. I am intrigued by the comment that Mrs. H didnt lose on Atkins. I have pre -Atkins had reactive hypoglycaemia.... and thats whats worrying me about CAD. Anyone else had reactive hypo and been ok with the reward meal ?

also, I may add CAD to my every increasing LC Library. But which to buy ?? CAD or CALP ???

[RedLisaP]

Plum,

I also had reactive hypoglycemia prior to starting the LC WOE.

I started with Atkins, and switched to CAD a month later. I rarely have symptoms anymore, although they do still happen occasionally. I haven't noticed if there is any correlation with the RM though, it's possible there is.

However, I have an RM every day (mostly for dinner) and I do not have reactive hypo symptoms every day. I think in the 6 months I've been on this diet, I've experienced it maybe 1/2 dozen times, whereas prior to LCing, I had them several times a week.

CAD and CALP are essentially based on the same theory, but the application of the diet is different. Some people like CAD, and some like CALP - I think it's a personal choice.

I read CAD first and was on that diet for 3 months before I read the CALP book. I have stayed on CAD though, because I just personally like that plan better for my lifestyle.

Have a great LC day!

Lisa

[Zuleikaa]

Personally, I like the CAD program better. But I think CALP contains a lot of explanations of things that you can also react to. Overall this diet is a very personal body chemistry type thing and many people can react differently to the many possible triggers. But then again, that's what I like about this diet. It recognizes the variations.

[JudyTrue]

Roche--I love your equasion and it seems pretty accurate to me.

OK, so now that we're on the topic of bodily functions, have any of you tried psyllium husks (the kind you mix in water)?? WHAT KIND OF BAD JOKE IS THAT? :eek: Mixed up a glassful yesterday and ended up with a batch of the worst looking, worst tasting, most vile concoction I've ever seen!! So, maybe I'm exaggerating (a little) and I know you're supposed to drink it quickly before it literally turns into Silly Putty, but I just could not bring myself to swallow those little balls of grey crud floating on the top of the water. :p

Went back to the store and bought tablets. Whew!

Have a great day, everyone!

[GatorGal93]

JudyTrue,

I use Fiber-Psyll and it tastes pretty good. I think I bought it online and I wil get you the address if you want.

It is definately not grey in color and has a lemon lime taste.

HTH,
Julie

[skyspinner]

There is a new fibre product out that addresses the "glop" issue......it's called "Benefiber" and when mixed w/ liquid turns into a clear liquid that does not jell. The TV ad claims one may add it to any liquid, cold or hot.

The ingredients list includes only guar gum, and it has 20 calories, 4 g carb, 3 g fibre, 20 mg sodium. Sounds as if it is CM.

It is made by Ex-Lax, and is found in the same place as all the other fibre products and laxatives.

[shelly]

Good Morning to all,

Today is my first day on CAD, I'm excited , but also a little nervous. After reading the Atkins book, I thought for sure it was the diet for me and that I was finally going to get t his weight off. I did so good for a month or so and then it just went down the drain. I was getting really discouraged because I wasn't loosing. Changing my eating habits so drastically, I thought for sure that I would lose. After reading CAD, it sounds so easy to do. I just really hope this is my answer.

What about caffeine on this diet? In the book I read that you can have as much coffee or tea that you want, Atkins book said that it should be limited because it can stall your weight loss. I really like my cup of coffee in the morning, if I didn't haveto give that up I would be verrry happy!
Bye for now,
Shelly

[Zuleikaa]

Welcome!!

Glad you found us. I hope this is the answer for you.

You can have coffee. If you take coffee with cream, you can only have it once a day at other than your reward meal and it has to be drunk within 15 minutes. Black coffee can be taken in unlimited quantities during the day depending on how caffeine affects you. Sugar replacements must be limited to 3 a day at other than the reward meal.

Hope this helps.

Good Luck!

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by shelly
snip After reading the Atkins book, I thought for sure it was the diet for me and that I was finally going to get t his weight off. I did so good for a month or so and then it just went down the drain. I was getting really discouraged because I wasn't loosing. snipBye for now,
Shelly
Shelly, I had exactly the same thing happen to me. I did not lose very much weight on Induction, tried the Fat Fast and lost a bit, then it just stopped cold. 3 months on Atkins and I lost a net of 3.8 pounds. Pretty danged discouraging for all that deprivation!

I switched to CALP at the end of October, and have lost a total of 2.4 pounds already. So, I'm pumped!! :lol:

On the caffeine issue, IMHO this is something you must work out w/ your body. Some appear to be able to drink it w/o stalling, others are not so lucky. For some it depends upon whether they drink it black and w/o sweetened, while for others that doesn't seem to matter. So play it by ear, and see how you feel. If you have not been craving and have been losing, CAD is working for you. If you add some caffeine and that changes, you have your answer. Take other factors such as TOM, etc. into account as well, but you should be able to figger out your reaction to caffeine in a couple weeks or so.

I have a caf/decaf blend coffee w/ heavy cream inside of the 15-minute limit nearly every morning. It seems ot matter to my body whether I use CoffeeMate or cream. I would probably lose faster if I gave up my coffee, but I have to do this for the rest of my life and dang it, I ain't gonna do it w/o my morning coffee! :lol:

So glad you have joined this bunch.....keep us in the loop of your progress, okay? We like to celebrate the losses and problem-solve the gains...take care!

Take care....

[RedLisaP]

Speaking of coffee... That is the one positive thing that the Atkins plan did for me - it got me off of caffeine. I had a headache for three days, but after that, I was done. It has been wonderful - I feel generally calmer, I sleep better, and I am less grumpy in the morning. :daze:

I now drink mate instead (pronounced mah-tay) which is a South American tea. It has a wonderful "picker-upper" affect but no caffeine. It did take me a while to get used to drinking it instead of coffee, but my husband's family is from Argentina so I had had it before.

It's now becoming more popular too. I have found a place online where I can buy 1 Kilo (2.2 lbs) packages for about $5. So it's even cheaper than coffee!

Sometimes I still want that coffee taste though - so I just drink decaf then.

If anyone's interested, I can post some links to information about it.

Lisa

[shelly]

Hello! Thank you for your replies. I had quit drinking caffeine for a while, now I only drink one cup w/splenda and heavy cream in the morning. It was really nice to see that I'm not the only one that had problems with Atkins. Thank you sooo much for the encouragement, it means a lot. So far everything is going well, I had breakfast and around noon I started feeling hungry which was about right because I had breakfast at 7:30 and I had a salad with a diet coke. I can't wait until dinner its been sooo long since i've had potatoes.

Hi skyspinner, that is so good that you've lost that much already. I will be very pumped too if I have that kind of success!

Thanx for the info Zule, I've read a lot of your posts. You seem to know a lot about this program. How long have you been on it and did you also start out with Atkins?

Redlisa, congrats on giving up the caffeine, its a hard habit to break. I could probably get by on decaf, I think I like the taste more than the picker upper. I like cold tea unsweetened, do you add anything to the mate or do you just drink it plain?

Hope everyone has a great day! :roll:

Shelly

[Tigra1965]

Hiya Everyone

Well after posting the other evening and thinking about it most of the night - I decided to jump in with both feet first. I took an hour out of work and was in the book store by 9.15am.

I bought the CAD book by the Hellers. I have read it as best I could in order to be able to begin today - so I hope I've grasped the basics until I can read it all.

I would appreciate if I can post my menu's for a while until I'm comfortable with what I must do and would appreciate honest and frank comments - or hints and tips to help me.

Todays menu stands as this:-

brekkie
2 fried eggs and 3 slices of bacon
herbal tea

herbal tea X 2

Lunch
1 scoop of carrots ( sorry no good selections at school )
1 scoop of cabbage
1 burger with no bread
water
herbal tea

herbal tea X 2

Dinner
2 pieces of roast potato
slice of turkey
slice of beef
slice of gammon
brocolli
parsnip
cauliflower cheese
yorkshire pudding and gravy
ice cream and chocolate syrup
brandy and diet coke

Now when I look at that dinner - it looks like a mountain - but honestly it was not. I actually put 3 pieces of potato on my plate, but the taste was funny to me, so only ate the two. I have to say though the icecream and chocolate syrup I adored, but I felt so guilty while eating it and I thought people were watching me. Which is silly considering that no one knew I was low carbing to begin with. :rolleyes:

Its now 8.21pm in the UK and its nearly two hours since I've eaten and I still feel really bloated. God I hope I dont put any weight on tomorrow.

:q: is it correct that I have to weigh myself every day?

Also would like to say thank you for welcoming me to this part of the forum and have just realised that really I should have posted my menu in my journal - silly me. Its all these carbs I've had they have confused me lol :rolleyes:

Some one was asking earlier about the carbohydrate addicts test - well I took it and I'm a severe carbohydrate addict according to that. So hopefully I will settle into this WOE better than the atkins. I have to say that it did work for a time - but for three months now I have repeatedly lost and regained the same few pounds or not lost at all.

Right I will go look around now - thank you again for your help in advance. Happy LCing

bye :wave:

[Zuleikaa]

Julie

Welcome to CAD/CALP. Here's hoping it's your way too. You should know very shortly.

Looking at your menu the only thing that stands out is the carrots. They are not an allowed CM food. If you were a bit hungry that night, that's why. Think Atkins induction foods. Those are the foods you are allowed at CM. I have a cheat sheet if you would like me to send you a copy. You can PM me your email. It helps to have a list to refer to.

We'd be delighted to help you with your food. We love food here. :D

Good Luck!

Welcome to the family.

[penelope]

I have also been thinking about CAD.
My problem is that I love my low carb breakfast which is:
Natural wheat bran 2 tbs= 5
psyllium seed husk 1tbs =2
Sci-Fit protein Powder =3
2 oz cream =2
= 12 carb minus 5 fiber = 7grams of carbs.
I have a big supply of these ingredients and would like to use them.
This has saved me on Atkin because I cannot face eggs or meat in the mornings.
Is there anyway I could eat the same breakfast as a CM and have my CM lunch then my RM at supper?
I have a bad feeling about this question.
I do not have the book yet .

Thanks :)

[RedLisaP]

Shelly,

I add a tiny bit of Splenda to the mate in the beginning, when it is a little bitter. As I keep filling the cup with water, I stop adding the Splenda.

The mate is drunk from a small cup (mate is cup in spanish) using a little silver straw with a strainer on the end, called a "bombilla". You keep filling the cup with water until it is "lavado", or literally, washed out. ;) By then I've had enough anyway.

Lisa

[nawchem]

Hi Penelope,
I can relate to your question. First I did Atkins, then Zone and now CALP so I have all these different foods from the different plans. Does your protein powder have/or do you add sweetners of any kind to it? That is something you reduce on CALP but I think 3 pkg are allowed. I've been using up my zone vegetables that have carrots, beans etc. I used all the AS I wanted this week and I used teriyaki sauce on my veges. Most of my CM meals probably have at least 15 net carbs. When you first start there are 3 guidelines that you follow and then you can become more tight (insulin controlled) as you go. That's how I look at it, because I can't stand to "waste" food. You probably won't lose as fast with these things in your diet, but you can try it. Also (maybe the weekends?) you could make breakfast the reward meal and just use those foods then.

I have had some cravings and not done well the last 2 days of this week but my averaged weight loss was 3.9 pounds.

I also have 3 large containers of artificially sweetened protein powders and 100 pkgs of meal replacement shakes that are 20carbs each. Even though its a lot I figure the reward meal is the best place for that stuff.

Let us know what you decide.

Nancy

[Tiggerlou]

I haven't been able to read this entire thread YET, but I surely will!!! Could it be my answer as well??? I initially lost 9 lbs on Atkins 8 months ago. Gained half of it back and now bounce up and down in a 5 lb range, HAVE done that for 4 months!!!
Something's gotta happen!!

[Zuleikaa]

Could be. You sound like a lot of people here.

[nawchem]

Hi Zule,
I saw your light on. I was wondering when I get to the options of CALP where do you think I should start? My 'bad veges' should be gone by then. Do you think I should try to get my CMs lower carb. I love the teriyaki sauce but I could try stirfry or something else to give the veges some flavor. Or I was thinking of relaxation. I am such a stress eater its unbelievable. My AS consumption isn't too good either but I feel like I need the crutch right now, coffee isn't any good to me without it.

Do you have any ideas?

thanks Nancy

[Zuleikaa]

Nancy

You have to read through the options to see if they apply to/affect you. One of the first things I would do is limit MSG and sugar replacements but again, these don't affect everyone.

Keeping your CM's on the low side is key. If you need all three CM/snacks it's usually a sign that something is not working right and it's usually a sign of hidden carbs. If you are losing 1-2 pounds a week, I wouldn't worry. If not, check the teriyaki sauce for MSG, it usually has it in it. If so, I would find a replacement.

See carb addicts react to MSG with cravings and to sugar replacements as if they were real sugar. For a CAD, if it tastes sweet, your body reacts as if it's real sugar. Some people don't understand how this can happan but believe me it can. At the same time, as I said, it doesn't particularly bother some people. To be safe keep your sugar substitutes to 3 total a day. That means count all used in coffees, sodas, and otherwise.

Hope this helps.

[nawchem]

thanks very much Zule- I guess I need to get my carbs lower on my meals first, maybe that's why I'm hungry and you all have no appetites.

nancy

[shemelts]

Hi everyone!
I am so happy that I found you. :p Today was my second successful day on the CALP plan. I too was on Atkins for about 3 months, and ended up GAINING a few pounds. I am now at an all time high of 178 pounds, and my goal is 130. It feels like I have so far to go, but I'm just gonna take one day at a time. I really think this plan is going to work for me. I already feel so in control, and satisfied. On Atkins I always felt deprived and would overeat the legal foods to try and compensate for such limited carbs. The funny thing is that I did Atkins because I thought it would take the fat off quicker than anything else, and it totally backfired. I've learned that it's better to be slow and steady. Anyway, I'll take to you later. :wave:
-Kay

[nawchem]

Hi Kay,
I'm glad you found us too. After gaining weight on the zone I was totally demoralized and actually cried when I weighed in 9 days ago. Just having some hope that something will take this weight off is so good for our spirits. I hope CALP works out great for you.

Nancy

[roche]

Ahhhh.......this is the life. I just finished off a fabulous RM of grilled chicken (marinated in italian dressing - try it!), pasta with alfredo sauce, green beans, garlic bread, and even as I am typing away I am munching on some chocolate chip cookies and have drank two large glasses of diet pepsi. Sorry Dr. Atkins, but it's OVER between us! And don't even THINK of begging me to come back! Nothing you say will convince me. (Well, actually, maybe the SCALE will convince me and I'll come crawling back with my tail between my legs, but hopefully it won't come to that! ;) )

The thing that makes me happiest is that today I had a late br. of sausage and eggs and wasn't hungry so didn't eat until RM. I really didn't think I could this plan cuz of the no snacking rule. I am so glad I was wrong!!

Hope everyone is having a great CAD/CALP week! Roche

[penelope]

Thank you for your reply.
My protein powder is sweetened with Stevia and I have 4 big containers left .Pretty expensive stuff.
I am afraid to experiment.
I have not cheated yet on Atkins since I started almost six months ago,but my weight loss has been so slow.
I really want a change ,to live in a more normal fashion food wise.
What is the minimum carb on CM?
I fear cravings.

Shemelts! We have the same goal weight I will be watching you . I hope to get the courage to follow in your footsteps

Zuleikaa! Sugar substitute kept as low as 3, do you count cream etc..to what total for a CM meal?Snacks...any carbs in that?
I really have to find this book in my little town. Thank you. :wave:

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by Zuleikaa
Nancy

You have to read through the options to see if they apply to/affect you. One of the first things I would do is limit MSG and sugar replacements but again, these don't affect everyone.

Keeping your CM's on the low side is key. If you need all three CM/snacks it's usually a sign that something is not working right and it's usually a sign of hidden carbs. If you are losing 1-2 pounds a week, I wouldn't worry. If not, check the teriyaki sauce for MSG, it usually has it in it. If so, I would find a replacement.

snip
Hope this helps.

Do't forget that teriyaki sauce usually has sugar or some other carby sweetener in it, and that soy sauce has naturally-occurring MSG that is not required to be named on the label. If you are having trouble w/ cravings, look at your menus to see if you used more teriyaki sauce right about then.

And I, too, hope this helps. :lol:

[skyspinner]

For anyone who might like it, here (http://www.carbohydrateaddicts.com/) is the link to the Hellers' website....it has the basic plan concepts and a lot of other information as well.....

[skyspinner]

Hi, I'm so glad you found us, and I hope that you find what you're looking for in this plan. Please feel free to ask anything about anything in this forum....most of us are learning the ropes as we go along here.

The good news is that this plan is easy to "get"...in a couple of weeks you'll be an old hand at CAD/CALP. Be sure that you read your books and re-read them...there's lots of good stuff in there that you just don't get in a single reading.

I would be happy if you decide that you'd like to post your menus here for a while, so everyone can take a look and offer you feedback. Or you can post in your own journal if you prefer, it's totally up to you. :)

Come by often and visit.....take care now, you hear?

[penelope]

Thank you Skyspinner .
After reading the info on the Heller website,I have decided to wait a few months until my Whey protein supply is no more. :)

[Tiggerlou]

Since I found this thread yesterday, I couldn't sleep and spent the past few hours reading it entirely. Off to the bookstore as soon as it opens! I am in as well! You all make so much sense to me. 8 months on Atkins with a total loss of only 5 lbs is not worth the deprivation and continuous binges I have experienced on a regular basis! I want to feel 'normal' and in control!! You are a great support team, I would love to be part of it!

[plum]

thanks to everyone who has posted here because its been an education.

I will be buying CAD at the w/e..... not doing it yet..... very nervous about the RW as I think carbs affect me so badly...... ( ie hungry) I just cant believe what Im reading Im hopeful about this.

today I may have reached a turning point. 14 1/2 months of effort, every tweak I can at Atkins and Ive got more and more desperate..... today I said "Atkins doesnt work " For me, I mean. I dont understand why or what I am doing wrong. I mean no disrespect to anyone, I admire every single person who is losing, and has helped me out so much, but since induction, something has been wrong with me.

surely I cant be insulin resistant cos I lost 12 lb on induction. Currently Im doing without eggs for 3 wk trial.. and feel brighter.... but ??????????

I did the little internet quizzes and got 10/10 each time.
Im so scared to eat any sort of carb..
thanks again

[GatorGal93]

You think that a 5 pound loss in 8 months on Atkins is poor? Look at my stats after being on Atkins since February 2002.
207/226/160

That's right. A nice, healthy gain!

Good luck on your new adventure in CAD/CALP! We can do this! I think you are making the right choice!

Julie

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by Tiggerlou

snip 8 months on Atkins with a total loss of only 5 lbs is not worth the deprivation and continuous binges I have experienced on a regular basis! I want to feel 'normal' and in control!!
snip

I'm with you, Tigger! 3 months on Atkins and I lost 3.8 pounds.....that sucks!! I gotta have much better results than that to put up w/ the weird WOE Atkins promised would work for me.

I think we can feel "normal", and I know we can feel "in control".

[skyspinner]

For Plum and everyone else who is leery of eating carbs.....don't forget that by using the tool to control your insulin levels, you can enjoy real carbohydrate-rich foods. Not "diet" stuff, not frankenfoods, not artificial this and that. Real food . That's what CAD/CALP is all about.

You achieve this by keeping your carb intake low all day EXCEPT during your daily one-hour RM meal, when you are free to eat all the luscious, rich, satisfying foods you've told yourself you can never, never have again in your lifetime. :lol:

When you follow this plan you will be amazed that you easily stop eating at the end of your hour of RM. That you don't pick at those brownies, fantasize about that ice cream, drool over the pudding that your kids are scarfing down, dream about eating not only the toppings but the crust on the pizza.....it just does not interest you.

Why? Because you have kept your carbs low all day, and because you have stopped eating at the end of your hour. These two simple actions lower your insulin levels and allow you to peacefully ignore those goodies because you simply don't crave them. High insulin levels is what forces you to eat. It's that simple.

And if you do want to eat something like those goodies, you know that you are never more than 24 hours away from being perfectly free to dig in!

Read the simple requirements and then follow them. It will work! You no longer have to fear carbs....they are not the enemy. They are your reward! :)

Take care all.....

[RedLisaP]

Very well said, SkySpinner!

Cheers!

[roche]

Sixth day on CAD. Posted this in my journal today, but thought I would post it here too:

I weighed myself today. With tape measure not having budged, I didn't think I would see a gain OR a loss And guess what? The scale still says 170 lbs. I can't be really disappointed. On the up side, I have had some of the most kickbutt RMs you can think of, with chocolate chip cookies almost every day, and except for being somewhat hungry on Tuesday, I can honestly say I haven't had sugar cravings or had a hard time with this eating plan. In my mind, it actually doesn't make sense that I didn't GAIN. Wow. So maybe there is something to this eating plan. I did give in and buy a scale yesterday. I'll be weighing everyday now.

My plans are to stay with entry plan for another week and reevalualet if stay on entry plan.

Everyone have a great CAD/CALP day. Roche

[Tiggerlou]

You are an awesome bunch in here!!! Sooo glad I found you!
Heading to the book store in a few minutes. This is what already happened to me....disastrous day on Atkins yesterday!! Several(!) pounds extra overnight, I am basically back to square one! I actually think of that as a positive thing, as it tells me that Atkins is just not working for me and that this is a very good time to 'start anew'! The mere thought of my new venture in CALP, starting today, AND the thought of my very first RM put me into such a 'High', that I got more accomplished in the first two hours of the day than I had all day yesterday. Someone in here said it best - it is like a newly found freedom - the thought alone! I do know 90% of life is attitude - attitude wise I am already 'there' - the positive facts will follow, that I am sure of! And thanks to all of you I am sure of my succes - who wouldn't be, with a support group like you!!! Thanks sooo much!!!!
Martina

[Zuleikaa]

Sky

You are so eloquent. Couldn't have said it better myself, you CAD cheerleader you. Everyone, remember on this diet, you can't cheat or the magic stops!

This is for you Sky
:cheer: :cheer: :cheer:

[slimmin]

I too was afraid of carb binges, and worried about going without my Atkins-sanctioned snacks (nuts, LC choc bars, etc.)

Although it's only been a few days, I can honestly say that having a carb-laden RM has NOT set off a binge. I stop eating after dinner, and that's it. All I have for the rest of the evening is club soda and herbal tea. But, although it's hard to imagine ... I have no cravings for anything else.

And I honestly haven't felt the urge to snack, which on Atkins, hit every day at 3:00 sharp.

I don't care if my weight loss is slower than Atkins (although I don't see how it's possible - I was stalled for 3 months on Atkins). And if I stall on CAD, at least I stall getting to eat anything I want!!

[GatorGal93]

Just a philosophical note from me

My brain has changed. That's right, changed. I was down every day and didn't even know it. I didn't look foward to eating anymore. Eating was a chore. That's right. It had become work to continue to eat on my plan.

Everyday at work when we would decide what to order, I dreaded it. Deciding which protein and/or which veggie to eat today . Not just ordering what I wanted . The only way I can explain it is that my WOE was turning against me. It was making me unhappy and mad.

So mad, that some days, I would just throw in the towel. "I have been strict for 5 days with no loss or a gain. To hell with this WOE, I am ordering a pizza!"

The following day, I would have the guilt of going off plan. Usually no gain, just guilt. Back to the WOE and being unhappy.

Now, after nine months on Atkins (successfully losing weight down to goal in the past) and gaining weight, I believe I have seen the light.

Being strict all day, limiting meals and having some pizza, NOT an entire one, combined with salad, protein and veggies at RM has made my brain all better.

That's right. I am no longer obsessed with losing weight. Now, I am obsessed with being happy. Having a set structure regarding the CM's and RM has helped me.

I will not say that I don't care if I lose weight. Of course I do, but I rather have my brain fixed first. Improving the attitude improves my desire to lose weight.

I am not saying which plan is right for you. I am just letting other newbies to CAD/CALP know how it feels...at least for me.

Take care,
Julie

[Tigra1965]

Hi Everyone

Well its day two on the CAD entry plan and I'm mega worried (as my daughter would say).

I got weighed this morning and according to the scales I've put a pound on - is this normal? :eek:

I have how ever continued today just in case its my body getting used to it. So here is todays menu:-

Brekkie
spinach omelette (3 eggs)
herbal tea

herbal tea X 2

Lunch

2 scoops of cabbage
turkey burger
diet pepsi
herbal tea

Herbal tea

Dinner
1 half of a roast potato (I still dont like the taste) :confused:
brussel sprouts
2 small pork chops
herbal tea
150g of chocolate

More herbal tea x 2

I really cannot believe that I dont like the taste of potato. Before I began LCing, I used to have a jacket potato every dinner time without fail.

I also have not managed to drink as much as I should today - but thats because I have been covering other I.T classes at school - so its been a busy day.

I have noticed people are worried about the bingeing with the RM. I have to say this did worry me too - but I've usually finished eating my RM about 15 minutes before I need too and I have also found that now I can have what I want - I dont know what to have or I dont want it at all. Confused - well I am :confused:

I suppose its like the old saying - you always want what you cant have and now I can have it - I'm happy, but not that bothered. I just hope I can keep to this way of thinking.

So I would appreciate if anyone can give me advice about the weight gain if at all possible.

Thanks for listening and also for the private messages ( you know who you are ) - I appreciate all the advice and help.

bye for now and happy LCing everyone :wave:

[nawchem]

Hi Julie,
This is just my opinion. The reason we weigh everyday is to smooth out the inaccuracies of our scales. I work in a lab where measurement accuracy is key and every scale is off and a lot of factors influence weight. I think you need to go for a full week and average your weights to get a truly meaningful measurement.

Nancy

[Zuleikaa]

Nancy is right. In addition, even just switching plans can make your body gain weight. It's way of saying "What's up now?"

[Tigra1965]

Thanks Nancy and Zuleika

I really appreciate your quick replies. I think actually I will stick to my once a week weigh in.

I actually do not own a set of scales - because I know me !!! I know for a fact I would be scale hopping most of the day and this is not the healthy thing to do. I do in fact get weighed on the same set of scales at a chemist and wont get weighed else where - so I think I will stick to my already set routine.

:q: BTW - was my menu ok today? I did'nt actually have any cravings today which surprised me.

:q: Also if I cannot drink my water, will the herbal tea's be ok?

Sorry about all the questions girls and thank you.

bye for now :wave:

[roche]

Hey Julie, I read a post by Sheila that whenever she switched from Atkins to CAD, she always gained a bit at first, then she lost it. And she sure lost it! She is now 152 lbs.----only 2 lbs. from goal. I think the next week or so will even out.

Roche

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by Tigra1965
snip

:q: BTW - was my menu ok today? I did'nt actually have any cravings today which surprised me.

snip

Sorry about all the questions girls and thank you.

bye for now :wave:

I think the best thing is to ask your body how it feels.....if you are not hungry, and you are not craving, it's right ..... for you.

Don't be sorry....there are never too many questions! :D

On the issue of gaining on changing your plan.....I think this is rather common. At least I've seen references to it happening to others. Don't worry about it...it'll come off, I promise! :)

[need2bthi2]

:daze: *************************************** :daze:

I have found I am retaining more fluid then Atkins and last time I thought I was putting on weight and jumped back on Atkins. This time I will perserve and see what happens.

[Tiggerlou]

WOW! (again!)
Yesterday was my first day on CALP. I was in an awesome mood all day, just the mere thought.... One CM in the early afternoon, then dinner came.... The preparation in itself was fun already. I made sure, I had everything available and set up BEFORE I began to eat, out of fear I would 'waste' my time gathering more food. WHAT a silly thought in the aftermath.... However, I believe I did everything right on. Had even gone out and gotten my all time favorite cookies, which I hadn't been able to have in over 8 months....Oh, the anticipation!!! Dinner was the most rewarding and satisfying meal/time I have had in a long, long time. Afterward I did feel a little leery about the chocolate and cookies I had but decided to change my attitude to 'let's se what happens'. I did jump on the scale before bed time and was a little shocked to see it having gone up from the usual, but once again adjusted my attitude. Then came this morning..... 1.5 lbs DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am soooooooooooo happy!!!!!!!! Still reading the book and thanks to all of you was able to start the plan before having read it entirely (working on it!). I can't put into words what a relieve I feel, as if the entire world changed since yesterday! I do know I need to give it a lot more time, but this just feels so right!

~Tigra1965:
I think you will be just fine in another day or so! Trust this plan! My only advice is to really, really stick with the recommended amount of water in addition to your tea. In my case I completely eliminate all 'dangerous-for-some' foods, especially AS! NONE whatsoever other than during the RM!!! Give it a try! But you have already expereinced positives by not having cravings!
I am sorry I elaborated and probably should have done so in my journal, but my excitement is so intense, just had a need to share it! I am soo happy I found this... Thanks for 'listening'!

[RedLisaP]

Tiggerlou,

I am so happy for you. I remember feeling the same way - that feeling of liberation and that I finally found something that would work!

You did everything right. Keep it up - you will see it continue.

No need to apologize for your elaboration - the success stories of others is what keeps us all motivated.

Cheers!

Lisa

[skyspinner]

I think it's just great how this thread has become the point around which we all gather to share and learn. It's just the best!

http://www.click-smilie.de/sammlung/natur/natur019.gif

[JudyTrue]

Wow, I went away for one day, and it's taken me 15 minutes of reading here to catch up!!

I agree, Sky, here's where the information is and available to all of us. I'm so happy on this plan and it tickles me to see everyone else's successes!!

Hang in there, all you CAD/CALPers and have a great FRIDAY!! :wave:

[Zuleikaa]

There are a lot of warm hearts and helping hands around here! Keep it up! Keep the success stories going!

[Tigra1965]

Hi Everyone

Thanks for any speedy replies to questions I ask - they are appreciated believe me.

Well its day three and I think I may have over done it on the RM - so here goes :-

Brekkie
3 slices of bacon - 2 eggs
herbal tea

herbal tea

lunch
chicken
tiny bit of mushroom
herbal tea

2 x herbal tea

Dinner
finished chocolate bar from last night
2 lamb grill steaks
swede
brocolli
5 crispy roll biscuits (about size of little finger each)
2 small sticky toffee sponges with toffee sauce
herbal tea

2 x herbal tea

Its been a really stressful day today at school and I think my RM reflects that. I have always turned to sweet stuff when I've not been 'right' - so thank god I am able to do that legally now.

I've not been weighed today - so I dont know how I'm doing. I have to say I have a colleague at work who totally doubts this plan and she is doing her best to convince me that it cannot possibly work right now. Maybe its wrong of me - but a little of that doubt has crept in my mind. Even so - I am still determined to give it the two weeks as I promised and then I will see then.

Sorry folks but major reassurance is needed right now that I've done the right thing.

Thank you so much for listening and most importantly for caring - you really are a great bunch.

bye for now :wave:

[roche]

Julie, I know people who are skeptical too. I think it's the sixty minute RM that is hard to believe. I have a hard time thinking I can lose weight too, so let's just forget about the others and just do our plan. We'll show them! (I think ). :D

Roche

[slimmin]

And the plan will work for you! :D

Julie, this WILL WORK! It's worked for many others in the past (including our own Sheila and Zuliekaa). You owe it to yourself to go for the full 2 weeks. But remember -- you can't cheat! There aren't many rules, but you need to stick to them.

If it gets your friends off your back, just tell them that you're taking a break from dieting for a couple of weeks ... because of the stress at work or whatever. As you know, when you're eating a RM it's hard for anyone else to see the difference between that and a carb-fest!

[Zuleikaa]

Slimmin

You're so right. There aren't many rules, but you can't break them and you can't cheat. If you feel stuffed and satisfied with no hunger or cravings, your doing it right. If you're doing it right don't worry.

A lot of times people might mean well (I hope) but they can sabotage you nevertheless. Believe me I've been there a few times. Keep to the plan for two weeks.

[Tigra1965]

Thanks everyone

Well just had a conversation on messenger with a member of carblife forum.

He's been trying also to convince me not to do this - said it confuses our body. One minute we give it no carbs and the next hit it with loads.

Never mind - I will go get weighed tomorrow and see how I'm going on. I will stick with this for the two weeks and give it my all.

:q: can someone tell me if I've gone over board in my RM today? maybe its the guilty feelings I'm having thats having this negative affect on me.

Also it would be nice if we 'not quite doubters' could see some examples of menu's of our experienced CADers - if possible please.

Thank you again
:wave:

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by Tigra1965

snip I have to say I have a colleague at work who totally doubts this plan and she is doing her best to convince me that it cannot possibly work right now.
snip

GRRRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!! Tell that saboteur to p**s off! The last thing anyone needs when starting something new is someone whispering in her ear that it can't possibly work!

Just don't tell her what you are doing...then she can't try to prevent you from succeeding. If she won't shut up, tell her that you are under physician's orders to keep your stress level down and she can't nag at you. Doctor's orders! :lol:

Your RM looks fine to me.....those "sticky toffee" spongy things sound delish! What are they? Did you make them or does some wonderful store where you live sell them?

I think you are doing fine, and two weeks is a good committment to make. By that time, you will be so comfortable on this plan you will know it inside and out. Promise!! :)

And if you're not hungry all the time or craving carbs, and you maybe lose a bit of weight, you're doing it right. It's that simple.

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by Tigra1965

snip
:q: can someone tell me if I've gone over board in my RM today? maybe its the guilty feelings I'm having thats having this negative affect on me.

Also it would be nice if we 'not quite doubters' could see some examples of menu's of our experienced CADers - if possible please.

Thank you again
:wave:

I can't tell you, but your body can. Pay close attention to how you feel, whether you get hungry again soon after eating and whether you feel satisfied enough that you have no need to eat. That will tell you how you are doing much more clearly than the scale or any other person can possibly do.

If you want to see what I eat, check out my journal. Everyday I post a single post that has my day's activities.....you'll find them in between visits from friends. Feel free to browse to your heart's content. I'd put them here, but it's rather redundant. :)

[Tigra1965]

Thanks Skyspinner

I'm off to look at your journal now and the sticky toffee puds are from frozen food company. You just pop them in the microwave and 2 mins later they are ready.

bye for now :wave:

[roche]

Hm.......so far I have gained a lb., but I AM wearing my size 14 jeans, my wedding ring can still come off, and I am not bloated. Also, I had two people tell me today that I look really good. One of them asked if I had lost more weight. These are the first two comments I have had since finishing Induction towards the middle/end of August. After induction, SIL asked if I had lost weight. I find this ve.......ry interesting.

Anyway, what I find most unusual is my lack of cravings. I experience a little hunger, but NOT VERY MUCH! I was slightly hungry this morning, but was too busy, so ate a Whopper w/o bun at BK about 1:00 ish. Am somewhat hungry and will eat RM in a bit.

I have had chocolate chip cookies, brownies, and now banana bread sitting on my counter all week, and I haven't cheated. Okay, so WHAT'S UP? IT'S CYBER VOO DOO I TELL YOU!

First, I read about Skyspinner and JudyTrue not being hungry, and I found it hard to believe. Surely it was a psychological sort of placebo effect, right? Anyway, now that I am not that hungry, I decided that it is CYBER VOO DOO. WE ARE ALL ONE......

(Sitting in lotus position with room dimmed and incense burning: "Om............Om.......Om........Om.......")

Later, Roche

[Zuleikaa]

Roche, Roche

Stop! My stomach is hurting I'm laughing so hard. VooDoo. CAD VooDoo! IT'S HOW NORMAL PEOPLE FEEL!!!!

tigra1965
There really is no right reward meal. It's whatever you want. Really! Just try to throw in some veggies for balance. Otherwise, go for it! Trust me! Trust CAD!!!

[roche]

TRUST THE WAY.........("Om........Om.......Om......Om....")

[slimmin]

Roche, what are you doing up at 1:30 in the morning! Oh, I see ... you're meditating ...

[roche]

1:30 a.m? ......NO WAY GIRLFRIEND! I don't know what area the board is posted at (....for example....Mountain Standard), but I promise I was in bed by midnight. At least I "think" I was....maybe I was in such a meditative trance I didn't realize I was online....HA HA HA.

Everyone have a great CAD/CALP weekend. Roche

[skyspinner]

Good morning, all.....I'm a Happy Camper this AM...back down to 226.0 again. Was over 228 yesterday. I really think I had two things at CM I should not have.....broccoli and cooking sherry. Can't imagine what else caused my weight to go up 2 pounds.

Hope everyone has a great CAD weekend.....:)

[nawchem]

Hey Everyone,
I can't keep away from this site. Yesterday was a disaster pretty much an all day reward day without the salad and veges!

My goals today have been simple, don't eat AS or MSG. What a difference no cravings at all so far. I had my RM a few hours ago. I'm sad to say it did have msg but hasn't caused any hunger/cravings so far. There was msg in my mustard, garlic salt and I had a regular milkshake, not lowcarb or high protein. It had soybean oil in it. MSG was at least the 5th ingredient listed in all those products so hopefully it was a small quantity.

No AS in my coffee and didn't miss it at all. I put in the cream and a tsp of coconut oil which is a strong flavor. Anything bad about coconut oil?

I met this guy on the internet that sounds so nice. We've been chatting for a few weeks. I set my weight goal at 128 because I figure that's the very most I can weigh and feel good about myself. I decided to be honest with him. I told him last year I started taking a beta-blocker for my heart, I gained weight uncontrollably, and I want to lose weight and some of my perfectionistic attitude toward my weight before I get involved with someone. He didn't say anything about the weight, he just said he didn't have a time table and that I was only person he had met and liked. I know it sounds weird but I met this guy a few weeks ago that I could tell he wasn't attracted to me the first glance. I know there isn't always chemistry between people but i don't want to feel like I'm being rejected because my hips are too big. Here I am blabbing on a Sat. afternoon, procrastinating going to exercise I think.

Take care everybody.
Nancy

[roche]

Hey Skyspinner.....great news on getting to 226! I am so glad that I have you and Sheila to see your guys' progress. You take care now, Roche

[skyspinner]

Thanks, Roche. I'm pretty pumped! Now if it just stays down. :lol:

We both can consider Sheila the one to follow...she's done amazingly well.....only TWO pounds from goal. Eeeeek!

[skyspinner]

Congratulations, Nancy, on finding two of your triggers! It'll be much easier now.....

Have a great weekend.....

[Tiggerlou]

Gee, less than 24 hrs off-line and soo much to catch up in reading this thread! How awesome! Congrats on all those wonderful accomplishements and discoveries! And now my own 2 cents. After day #1, I had lost 1.5 lbs - thrilled!! Did a repeat of that on the second day and found I had gained the 1.5 lbs back the following morning. This is the evening of day #3, just finished my RM (soooo pleasantly full and satiated...). Still got that weird kind of a feeling creeping up, somewhat like a little guilt for having had carbs...This will go away - rrrright????? I am just about finished with the CALP book...very reaffirming! Had only 2 CM SNACKS today and couldn't believe when I had no urge to finish the CM (that's why I call them CM snacks...) Even for the RM, I wasn't very hungry. I do admit, however, that I was after some goodies so I made sure I had protein salad and veggies FIRST! I do believe it is something like 'cathching up' on the things I hadn't been able to have for the past 8 months on Atkins...That, too, will go away, will it? I could (and probably SHOULD) have gone for less.....But I hope that it will set in soon, that this is no joke, no fluke and that I can have this every day and don't have to eat it all at once....did that happen to anyone out there as well? Curious and somewhat scared of what the scale will say in the morning, but just reading this thread has really eased my mind already and gave me a few good laughs as well! As always, very much looking forward to the next time I open this thread to see what everyone's been up to! Have a wonderful weekend, everyone!

[Zuleikaa]

Tiggerlou

Don't worry. That feeling should pass. It's kinda like being a kid in a candy store. YOU WANT EVERYTHING NOW. When you realize that what you didn't get today, you can have tomorrow, you calm down. Promise. Just ask Sheila!!!

No, you won't gain weight eating this way when this is your way. Trust the Way!! (oom oom)

Have a great weekend.

[JudyTrue]

Hi Everyone:

Isn't it amazing how many times we all say, "This is too good to be true?" I think it's especially hard since we switched from Atkins. I honestly think that if I'd just started on CAD/CALP from the beginning, I'd be feeling some sort of deprivation at the CM meals. But having the RM to look forward to every single day is like Nirvana itself! I was bored out of my mind on Atkins and thought I may start Moooooing if I stayed with it too long!!

Roche--I'm into Cyber VooDoo if it means that Sky and I are beaming the lack of hunger fairies your way! Isn't that a great thought?

Nawchem and Tiggerlou: You guys are doing great! You go girls!

Sky: WOOHOO!! 226!!

[Tiggerlou]

Please tell me who/where Sheila is!! Does she have a journal? I would love to read it!!
Thanks!

[JudyTrue]

Hi Tiggerlou:

It's "sheilaraye's journal" in the journals section.

She's been on both Atkins and CAD and is almost at her goal. The journal is long but great reading!!

[luv67fire]

Hey Everyone!!

I just wanted to jump in and join the bandwagon. I saw the this thread was started about the same time I started Lowcarbing with CAD, so I know you guys have some common grounds. CAD is my first low carb diet experience, and so far it is awesome!

You're totally right, hunger and cravings have almost vanished! I don't feel like eating a bunch of carbs anymore... my appetite has almost disappeared.

I feel like jumping for joy in the mornings when I just lost one or two pounds. Even when I see no change that day I think, ok, what did i have for dinner last night, and how much SHOULD I have gained on a lowfat diet?

Hehehe, like two nights ago, I went a bit overboard. I had my salad, but someone ordered pizza. I was a bit freaked, cause I LOVE pizza, and even though it is RM, it is not balanced with just the pizza. So what did I do? I scarfed down a one serving deli turkery package (about 4 oz of meat) and shoved in a bunch of grean beans, and had THREE slices of pizza. And had a diet cream soda. The whole time I was thinking, there is no way in he!! that I will lose any weight tomorrow.

Welll..... THe next morning I wake up and get on the scales. TWO POUNDS DOWN!!! HOLY COW!! I felt like going up to every low fat diet person around and screaming it at them (been eating low fat for over a year strictly and no loss... hated it with a passion).

The best thing about this diet, is that it is something that neither lowcarbers nor low fat people can do. We can have a high fat high carb treat, EVERY DAY.

Ok, just wanted to let everyone know my success story, and that I am here to stay!

Oh btw, I've lost 12.5 pounds in less than three weeks. Oh ya baby!!! Hahahaha! (sorry, I feel liberated at the moment)

[Zuleikaa]

Congratulations Cassie!

Superb weight loss!

Welcome to the family!

[JudyTrue]

Hi Cassie!!

It's so nice to read your story--your enthusiasm is contagious!!

Have you started a journal yet? It's a great way to chart your food, talk to yourself and have friends stop by to offer encouragement and advice. You might want to read some of ours to get you started.

Keep up the good work!! :)

[roche]

Oh btw, I've lost 12.5 pounds in less than three weeks. Holy Moly, Cassie! That is awesome! Sounds like you found something that really works for you! :cheer: :cheer:

Roche

[Tigra1965]

Hi Everyone

I just wanted to pop by and see how your all doing now that I've had my RM.

I went over by 3 mins - wont do it again I promise - unfortunately it was a tin of rice pudding that did it. As soon as I noticed the time I gave the rest to my cat - so she got a treat too bless her.

Well I had a great Rm today:-

3 types of veggies
chicken
a piece of roast potato ( still dont like it )
1 small yorkshire pudding
gravy

flapjack
white chocolate buttons
3/4 tin of rice pudding

a big RM - but worth it. I really must try to eat 2 CM's though because last night I was hungry. I ignored it and went to bed, but I dont want to get myself into any danger zones (so to speak).

Anyway time for me to hand the computer over to my daughter - this is her by the way with me at a family get together. Bless her she will not eat anything high carb in front of me at all now.

Dont you just love kids !!!!!!!!!
See ya :wave:

[nawchem]

Hey Cassie
So glad you joined us.

Julie
Your daughter is so sweet-nothing says love like someone not eating carbs around you.

Yesterday no arificial sweetner all day! I had my RM at 10am and I wasn't hungry until 8pm and I even exercised. Today my weight was down 1.5lbs yippee!

I'm trying to have 2 CMs also.

I read my book and discovered we can have ketchup and pickles, oh joy. I bought ketchup, it was so weird but I could smell it before I even opened it. The ketchup tasted so good. I better go check it for msg.

Nancy

[slimmin]

Good news on the loss, Nancy.

I am also trying to stay away from AS - so no diet Jello or diet Crush, even at RM.

What kind of exercise routine do you have? I tend to workout most mornings when I first get up. And I think that another advantage of the RM is that, unlike Atkins, when I workout in the morning my muscles are still loaded with glycogen from the night before - my workouts are feeling really good lately!

[BrightSky8]

That's another reason why switching from Atkins to CAD is necessary for me..--exercising. Before Atkins I used to do tae-bo for half an hour, and run two miles 5 days a week (okay so it isn't THAT great! but it was something; considering I work and go to school). But I haven't been following my exercise routine since I started the Atkins Induction. I just don't feel like my body is up to it; all I want to do is lie down. Hopefully the problem is that I wasn't getting any carbs to get my body going, and CAD's RM will be the solution!

[Tiggerlou]

Hmmmm... this is my 4th day on CALP, took the weekend of (exercise wise) and I am curious to see what happens in the morning when I am back on my routine. Would LOVE it if my muscles got a little kick! Oh, one little personal success to share... Started Pilates classes about 3-4 weeks ago. Last week, the regional 'guru' came to check how we were doing and after class asked me if I would like to become one of her instructors.... apprentice ship under her! If 2 years and 70 lbs ago, someone would have told me this would happen, I would have had that person institutionalized!!! Could have screramed - I was literally speechless....just my little tid bit for the day, and an incredible motivator to keep on going right where I'm headed!
Oh, 2 lbs down this morning, but still, after tonight's RM, doubtful about that scale in the morning. Thanks to all your wonderful successes though, I do BELIEVE and KNOW it'll be alright. If all else fails I'll just .....om.......om.....om.........
Keep up the good 'work' everyone!

[JudyTrue]

I AM ABSOLUTELY LOVING THIS THREAD!!

The successes are increasing every day and it's so encouraging! 2 pounds here...2 pounds there...all add up to a happy bunch of CAD/CALPers!!

Here's a big cheer for everyone!! :cheer:

[Zuleikaa]

Julie
You daugher is beautiful. You know, if you don't like the potato, you don't have to eat it.

CAD and exercise

That's also one of the benefits. You have enough carbs in your system to give you energy and strength for lifting and exercise. Sort of a natural carb up.

AS is a very varying thing body chemistry wise. But if you're sensitive to it. Look out! It can even slow you down at RM some people say. For some reason, reaction is better with regular sugar.

Keep to the path, everyone (oom, oom)

[Tiggerlou]

oom-ing, oom-ing............

[need2bthi2]

ooming ooming I went overboard today with my rm. Not to worry tomorrow is a new day.

Did everyone still loose weight around TOM? I lost my initial 2 pounds and now the scales bounce up and down. Hopefully it is just TOM. How much does everyone loose after. And does everyone tend to put on pounds just before?

Sorry about all the questions. It has been awhile since I have done CALP and am not sure what to expect.

:spin: :cheer: :cheer: :cheer: :cheer: :cheer: :cheer: :spin:

[Tigra1965]

Hi All

Just a quick post while I'm on my break. As regards the potato zulieka I dont think I will be bothering anymore - as I now find the taste weird.

Thank you for your comments on my daughter - they were sweet and yes she is good for not doing or eating anything high carb in front of me. Although I've now told her this is ok when I'm eating my RM.

:q: Can I ask - does anyone still get headaches?

I have found since starting CAD that I get a dull headache most days - I've always noticed this before when I've had more carbs than I should have. Is this normal for CADers?

Anyway better go - will OMM OMM on my break - unfortunately it does not make the children any pleasanter on a monday school day lol

bye for now :wave:

[need2bthi2]

:D :thup: Yes I still get headaches but not as bad as last week. I did not think I would go through it because I had come off Atkins to CALP.

[plum]

hi, all.
*plum nervously steps officially into CAD*
day 2 today. Up 2 lb but feeling good.........
I dont understand this at all.... :daze: but we'll see :) I do feel better than I have for a long time.......mood wise that is.
Following all your fortunes with interest... thanks.

[skyspinner]

Welcome, Plum! Feeling "good" is one of the benefits of CAD/CALD. And it doesn't go away!

Take care....

[Tiggerlou]

A welcome from me as well, Plum! Glad to read you're feeling well on this!
I am on day 5 and back up 2 lbs. Was wondering about those little headaches...never had them before.
Here's my plan for the coming days.... I think I got over the initial rush of being able to eat ANYTHING and EVERYTHING during RM, and believe me, I DID!!! After soooo long without... Time to get a handle on things again and slow down a little on the simple carbs. I think I was carbo-drifting just a bit too much! So that's the plan for today, but I am so greatful for having gotten my cravings under control WHILE eating all those wonderful things in the past few days. That in itself is worth more to me than a lost pound right now! So, on to the next step and getting the portoins just a little bit down now! Has anyone else experienced this at the beginning as well? Do tell, pleeeezz! And have a great day, everyone!!!

[skyspinner]

Boy, I sure did! The first few days I overate so badly my stomach hurt!!! But it was fun. I am trying to cut back to a more reasonable amount of food now, and some days hit it pretty well.

[Tiggerlou]

Thanks for the reassurance, Skyspinner!
I feel pretty severe residual guilt from my Atkins times right now, especially since I can also feel the extra water in my body. I need to quit this damn self-punishment :-( I really need some help getting over that! 10 am , no hunger, no appetite....

[slimmin]

Tiggerlou,

Congratulations on being asked to apprentice with the Pilates instructor - are you going to do it? I've been taking a Pilates class myself for the last couple of months - it's only once a week - next session I'm going to sign up to go twice/week - I don't think once a week is enough.

As for overdoing it at the RM - I have had the same reaction to starting CAD as you - I post my menus in my journal - you should see some of the stuff that I eat at my RM :D Thank goodness I exercise a lot! On the other hand, on Atkins I used to snack a lot - always on LC stuff, but it was nuts and LC choc etc. I haven't used fitday since switching to CAD, but I'm thinking of entering the numbers for yesterday just to compare the total cals on the two plans - if I do, I'll post the results.

I'm hoping that as I become increasingly comfortable with this plan that I will naturally cut back on the RM.

[slimmin]

I posted this in Zuleikaa's journal, but it may be of interest to others moving from Atkins to CAD.


Usually a CA can lose on induction, it's continued induction or after induction that can cause stalls/weight gain.

This is exactly what happened to me. The first time I did induction, I lost 8 pounds (down to 143). Then nothing for 2-3 months, even though I kept my carbs low (below 30) and followed Atkins religiously. So, I went back on induction. Lost another 4 pounds (taking me to 139). As soon as I went off induction (only slightly), I gained 6 pounds (145). Then I sort of lost it - started eating fruit in the mornings, and found that I consistently ate too many carbs each day.

When I switched to CAD, my initial weigh-in was 147. Gained 2 pounds the first day, which may have been as a result of switching plans. Since then, the scale has slowly been moving down. And, best of all, I'm not hungry, and I have no cravings between meals.

[plum]

slimmin
Iwas so excited to find this , this morning I posted it in my journal, too !!
where did it originally come from ??

You see, Ive done 2 Atkins inductions, 1st a few years ago - good loss on induction then nothing for 4 - 5 months, then I gave up.

This time, Aug 2001 - 12 lb on induction, and little since. Its been driving me mad ;) Why did I lose on induction and then get stuck, both times..... I didnt cheat. It was so discouraging but I was setermined not to give up.

Then you post this little gem, which is ME.

what a relief. I thought it was only me.

:) :) :)
thanks for the welcome :)

EDIT to add: Oh I see we copied it from the same place LOL... all is clear now....Funny how we both copied it into our journals today!

[Zuleikaa]

Overeating at RM is a natural reaction, sort of like a kid in a candy store. It does get back under control eventually. At this point you're sort of testing your parameters and seeing how much you can get away with. You are also kind of giddy. Don't panic and don't leave the plan, just slowly rein yourself in. You will find the level of food at which you start losing at a satisfactory rate.

[slimmin]

OK, so out of curiosity, I checked my totals in fitday (have I mentioned that one of the things that I love about CAd is not needing to use fitday to track carbs, etc?)

Here's yesterday:

Total eaten: 2746
Fat: 149 1341 49%
Sat: 50 449 17%
Poly: 37 330 12%
Mono: 50 453 17%
Carbs: 216 813 30%
Fiber: 13 0 0%
Protein: 140 561 21%


Total burned: 2812
Basal: 1374 49%
Lifestyle: 845 30%
Activities: 593 21%

As you can see, I am still working off more than I eat. The really interesting thing to me, however, was that the 2 helpings of cake and ice cream that I had yesterday were worth about 1,000 calories - if I hadn't had any, I would have been at about 1800, and even with one helping, I would have been at only 2300. These totals aren't far from what I was eating on Atkins. So, for me, it's clearly not the difference in the number of calories that I am eating, but when and how I am eating them.

[tokenyanke]

What great info.... I made make a change, too. I know I am a carb addict! I have the CAD and CALP books, but have been on Atkins only, and just cannot lose weight regardless as to exercise and lots of water and following all the "rules". I also eat often on it... just out of habit and because it's allowed. I hadn't stopped to think about the release of insulin with even small amounts of carbs. I will have to give this some serious thought!
:thup:

[Tiggerlou]

How awesome is THAT info! Great girls, and thanks! I do feel a lot better now... love coming back here for a little motivational kick!!
Slimmin', what's the name of your journal, would love to read it. I need to update mine as well. I had the same idea with the FitDay comparison. Ssooo interesting, how we are doing all those parallel things - remember, you wrote in my journal? Only difference is the age.
Thanks for the pat on the shoulder with my Pilates classes. Yes, I am going to do it. It is an 18 months long apprentice ship. After I come back from our holiday vacation, I am going to dive in head first! Oh, and yes - 1x a week is not enough. You need to do a MINIMUM of twice a week to really feel great and get results.

[slimmin]

Tiggerlou, my journal is called "Slimmin's journal" or something like that. Or, you can just click the journal icon at the bottom of any one of my posts, and you'll go straight there.

And yes, please update your journal ... I dropped in this morning, but I could see that you hadn't posted in it for a while.

[Tigra1965]

Hi All

Is'nt it strange how we mostly seem to fit into the same dietary characteristics. I too have lost on my inductions only to stall for months after.

I also have been like a kid in a sweet shop, as I'm only on day 6 of entry plan. I'm now starting to lose interest in blowing it on the RM, but still like abit of a treat or it does not feel like a reward meal to me.

Anyway must go - bed is calling.

bye for now :wave:

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by Tigra1965
Hi All

Is'nt it strange how we mostly seem to fit into the same dietary characteristics. I too have lost on my inductions only to stall for months after.

snip :wave:

I think it's more like proof that the Hellers know what they're talking about. We act alike because we are alike.....:)

[Tiggerlou]

Proud and thrilled to report a very succesful day on CALP yesterday!!! I very, very intendly listened to my body, had a very decent RM, no overstuffing, no guilt, just soooo pleasantly satiated and satisfied afterwards. Tried not to pay too much attention to the clock (I set a timer just in case...), and when I deemed my meal to be finished, just went to the timer and turned it off, therefore officiallay ending my meal, even though I still had 15 or 20 mins left. Grabbed one last cup of coffe, spiked with egg nog (or was it egg nog with a little coffee.....LOL!), slowly enjoyed it with my husband and, boy, did I feel good!!! Also had 2 huge cups of water while preparing my plate, 4 while I was eating. Just little tricks I want to use to get used to the idea that I can have this every day and don't have to stuff myself at every RM....worked for me!
Oh - and the reward of the effort????? 2.5 lbs gone this morning....

[Zuleikaa]

Tiggerlou

Congratulations!!! WTG :thup:

[nawchem]

Yesterday I had my last msg for 21 days at the RM. I was absolutely miserable yesterday and last night from the heart palpitations.

I've started eating only fresh foods for 21 days to test if I am really msg and aspartame sensitive. Today I have felt top of the world (except for pms!).

I have been stunned to discover there is msg in every food I like- except butter, thank God.

My weight has been down and up all week. I'm almost back to where I started, but I'm not worrying about that today.

I guess if I am msg sensitive I will have to learn to make my own chocolate-cause I'm not living without that!
Nancy

[skyspinner]

This is your OPPORTUNITY to search out and find foods you love w/o this nasty additive! Try the health food stores in your area.....anything labeled "organic" is going to be much better labeled than ordinary foods. You won't see the "natural flavors" and junk there, but you will see everything that is in that food.

I'll just bet you're going to find lots of clean and healthy foods to add back into your diet.

Hope your heart settles down real soon!

[nawchem]

thanks sky,
I know its all working to the best health wise and I'm discovering all kinds of interesting new foods and also about the way my body reacts to food.

[RedLisaP]

Oh my goodness -- I leave for 3 days and have to read *five* pages of posts to catch up! It is so great to see how this thread has taken off, and how well everyone is doing.

I just wanted to add my 2 cents to skyspinner's post about organic foods. I agree with my whole heart and soul. They are more expensive but they are definitely worth it.

Just walk into your pantry (or open your food cupboard) and pull out a box of prepared food. It can be anything - macaroni and cheese or canned soup or scalloped potato mix or whatever. Read the label. Just LOOK at all that junk in there - how many ingredients have four or more syllables? YUCK! And we are putting that into our bodies. No wonder the weight goes up and down - who knows what kinds of sensitivitites people have to all these artificial ingredients and chemicals and preservatives?

Nawchem, I applaud you for eating only fresh foods - your body will love you for it. I have been preparing fresh vegetables since I started on Atkins in May (switched to CAD in June). And now when, in an emergency, I prepare frozen vegetables, I just don't like them - they taste fake and have no flavor. Blech.

[getting off soapbox]

Have a great night everyone.

Lisa

[adnil53]

I can't beleive I found this thread... I too have switched to CALP!!! I lost on regular LC for awhile and then either couldn't make myself stay on it or just quit losing! Now I have been on CALP for a little over a week and have dropped a pound. I average my weight each week as the Hellers asks us to do because my weight changes from day to day... Not only that, but I feel in CONTROL , something I haven't felt in months of regular LCing!

[Tigra1965]

Hi Everyone

just thought I'd pop by while my students are doing powerpoint presentations.

Its day 8 for me and all is going well so far - although have to say the headaches have not gone all together and I have been feeling a little more tired of late. Mind you I have been covering lessons for nearly a week and thats tiring with your own work too.

My RM is starting to calm down now - I only had a chocolate muffin with double cream last night for a treat - but up until then I have been going mad. Maybe the 'kid in the sweet shop' is getting fed up of sweets now.

I need to ask a question please:-

:q: last night my partner cooked pasta with a mince and cheese topping and then I had my chocolate muffin with cream. I never had any veggies at all - could this slow down my weight loss? I was only once but I thought I'd better check.

Hope everyone has a good day - I will be getting weighed tonight so will let you all know.

bye for now :wave:

[plum]

Tiggerlou : well done on that 2.5
nawchem : wish you luck with the msg. thing. I only use fresh stuff but cant always afford organic. however I always buy things I dont peel - carrots, apples - organic cos somehow I feel its better for my kids. things I can peel I get by with ordinary. Probably irrelevant but makes me feel good.
adnil : Im so encouraged by your Lb. Isnt that great ? Specially when youve had a long struggle.
Tigra : Zuleikaa was saying to me else where that some have to be perfectly balanced, some can get away with not so balanced (on my "higher carb veg Q" on this forum) trial and error I guess. I cant wait to see if youve lost a bit. Good luck !


I am very happy today cos I feel so well. And I wrote in my diary today, a lot of my Atkins problems have been explained by what I read in my CAD book. Now I am beginning to believe there is an Atkins type and a CAD type. Maybe people can do well on both, of course. But today I feel "a square peg in a square hole" if you get what I mean.

[Tiggerlou]

I am just so amazed each time I open this thread that soo many others have had the same issues as I have....that feeling of finally being in control when it comes to food.... I honestly thought IT WAS ME!! Felt at times I was ready to be institutionalized - kid you not!! I could not comprehend, why I repeatedly 'lost'it' while on Atkins, always after 2 or 3 days of control...Now I know! It feels strange, because I still get up in the mornings thinking I might loose it again - this can't be IT! But each and every day so far, IT IS IT!! The cravings and simple appetite are just not coming back! Oh, and here's something I have discovered that I would like to pass along.... Last night I had Pilates, at 5:30. I didn't want to have my RM too late (afterwards at 7:30) so I opted to have it before. BIG MISTAKE!! My body decided to completely focus on digesting my food instead of feeding the muscles I was working and I ended up with major cramps in my legs, besides the fact that that work out was a complete waste! So, remember that, all you CAD/CALPers....NO RM BEFORE A WORK OUT! Next time I will switch my RM to lunch time and opt for another CM later in the day should I get hungry (which is actually quite doubtful). Have another most awesome CAD/CALP day, everyone!

PS: was up 0.5lbs this morning, but am pleased that it doesn't seem to bother me. This is a new day and another new start. I vow to not overeat nor carbo drift TODAY!)

[JudyTrue]

Hi All:

It's so encouraging to see how well everyone is doing and how good we all feel! Isn't being in control amazing? I think this is the first time ever for me!!

I wanted to share what's happened to me in the last few days. On Sunday, I was 176, Monday 177 and Tuesday 179.5!! OUCH! Then TOM came yesterday and this morning I'm back to 176. Isn't that a huge swing in weight--3.5 pounds? Has anyone else experienced this? It didn't happen to me on Atkins.

Thanks and have a great day!!

[luv67fire]

Judy,

Right before my TOM, I usually gain anywhere from 3-6 lbs. I think it is mostly water retention though.

My second or third day into TOM, I usually drop it all at once. I wouldn't worry too much.



You know, even if I stayed the same weight (which I don't want to do, but IF), I would probably continue eating like this because I've never felt so much control before. Even when I was a "normal" person. I have ALWAYS had cravings. My parents tell me that even as a little kid, I'd always be craving something.

So this is really the first time in my life that when someone asks me what I feel like having for a meal, I honestly could not tell them. Even when I am hungry, there is no particular food I "feel" like having. Before it'd be like, "Oh I REALLY feel like having chinese/pizza/italian/etc." But now... all I can say is WOW!

Glad you guys feel it too!!!

[roche]

Okay, fourth day without diet soda. First three days were REALLY rough, now I just kind of "long for" a diet pepsi. Amazing how that stuff is so addicting. Went to library today to recheck out CAD for like the third or fourth time. Got to part about how we really shouldn't mess around with rules (don't laugh at me, now Zules) and then I read a part about how there will be some people who may not show a loss for a few weeks or even a month....but if they stick to the plan they WILL start losing.

On page 168 of CAD, Dieter's Dilemma Number One: "I'm Not Losing Any Weight" is written about. Talks about that initial possible lack of loss and how body is probably adjusting and may be slowing your metabolism in order to conserve enery.

Weight loss plateuas as the body's response to what it perceives as a starvation situatin. Too rapid weight loss in the past, a pattern of yoyo dieting or in some individuals, an inherited tendency can lead to this failure to lose weight in teh earliest phase of CAD. Don't despair, CAD will combat such efficiency palateus adn help a slowed metabolism. Through use of RMs, your metabolic processes will perceive that the situation is not one of starvation, your metabolism will adjut, and you will begin to lose weight. blah blah blah......REmeber that this is a lifelong program....give it a change to correct the many times that you insulted your body with past diets. blah blah blah......Enjoy your RM, stay within guidelines. Weight loss will follow.

Okay, after rereading page 168, I am in this for the long run. I am with you gals that say it is so great not to obsess about food, enjoy our RMs and not have cravings during the day. So if it takes me a month to lose one pound, then so be it.

Okay, ladies, as Zules says....."Trust the Way" and let's keep on "oming." (Om........Om......Om......)

Roche

[Tiggerlou]

ooming.....ooming... right along!!!!!...and loving it!

[Tigra1965]

Hi Everyone

Just thought I'd report in before going to bed - its an early one tonight again. Am just so tired at the moment.

I have to say I really like this section of the forum and these threads. Everytime I log on - theres a new reply or a whitty comment or some good sound advice. Lets keep this thread going peeps - cos its good.

Hope everyone's in tip top shape and OOMING along quite happily.

bye for now :wave:

Ps) not had chance to get weighed yet - sorry.

[JudyTrue]

I'm with ya too, Roche!!

OM..............OM...............OM................ :bhug:

[Zuleikaa]

I'm with you guys

Oom...Oom...Oom

[skyspinner]

Hi, guys......everybody's doing SO well! Yay, us!!! :)

I gotta go read that section Roche was quoting, 'cause I didn't lose enough last week. I think one CM and one RM might be too much for me. And maybe I should cut out the coffee and see what happens. And cutting down on the portions is always a good idea. :lol:

Take care all.....

[roche]

And cutting down on the portions is always a good idea.
Hey Skyspinner, I hear you on that one. Most of my RMs I have really eaten large portoins, and second ones at that. Today I thought I would try another experiment (but this one is LEGAL, Zules!). I ate one portoin of rotisserie chicken, some green beans, some mustard greens, and two tator tots. I could have eaten more dinner, and I WANTED to eat more dinner, but I decided to forego the seconds and just have dessert (rootbeer float) for carbs. Man, I am really full. To think I didn't need seconds of dinner to satisfy me is amazing. Anyway, from now if I seem to think I am okay with first servings then I won't go with seconds.

And btw, Skyspinner, why do you think that one CM and one RM might be too much for you? Just wondering.

Roche

[adnil53]

I was HUNGRY to day. I don't know if it was because I just did not eat enough or it was something I ate to trigger it. And it may be I need more because of my work out. I had 3 snacks [all lc of course :D ] after lunch today. I felt fine after my RM though. I am going to try and up my calories and protein tomorrow and see if I do better. Just thought of this... I had regular coffee today too... maybe that was the culprit! I like this thread also... good going :)

[nawchem]

Linda just wanted to say hi and welcome. You've lost quite a bit of weight did you do it all on CALP? As far as your hunger goes think about how balanced your last meal was. If it was heavish on the carbs it might have left you hungry from the insulin gush. Otherwise you probably didn't eat enough. I think you should be able to go at least 4-6 hours between meals without hunger even if you exercised, if you eat enough.

Roche-what is it with carbonated drinks? This is my 2nd day of quitting, I always have a diet coke after I exercise and I miss it. It was my reward. I don't really need that now! I'm glad it gets easier. That was really interesting about the weight loss. Does CAD have a lot of info that CALP doesn't have? I'm thinking of buying it so I can see what you all are talking about. Is it worth it?

Today was just another good day on CALP for me. No starvation and no cravings. :cool:
Nancy

[luv67fire]

Linda,

The lc treats actually could be the culprit.

Even though you are not eating many carbs, any at all will release insulin. Not sure if CALP says this as well, but in CAD you are not supposed to have ANYTHING in between meals (unless you are losing weight too fast after the first two weeks, in which case you can have a Complementary Snack).

I know my body will do the same thing. I tried have a lc cookie (3g carb) in between lunch and RM dinner a few days ago, and I felt hungry the rest of the day. However, since then, I don't eat anything in between like the plan says, and have to remind myself that I need to eat.

I just keep experimenting on what foods my body reacts to. So far, I get insulin rushes from sugar-free foods, higher carb veggies (even in small amounts) and ANY snack in between meals.

I'd suggest you do the same, just keep testing the waters, and see where you float the most comfortably :) It looks like your body is reacting to the lc treats, so you might want to confine those to one of your meal times. That way, the insulin is released all during that time, instead of periodically throughout the day.

[adnil53]

Nancy... Thanks for the welcome. I just started CALP about a week and a half ago... I have lost and regained so many time... I did Atkins for years, off and on... just couldn't stay with it. And more importantly I quit losing. I think now I have found something I can do. I think my hunger came from plain and simply not eating enough... I think CAD is just the basic diet and CALP is the same thing with more info and it stands for lifespan diet plan. But there are those that could tell you more, I'm just a "newbe" here... ;)

[adnil53]

luv67fire... thanks for the imput. My hunger started right after breakfast and basicly lasted all day. I don't have any LC treats... ummm... I guess I didn't say what I had eaten right... I only eat "normally" at meals and no carb anything EXCEPTat the reward meal. To day I did after lunch because I was really hungry. Well I do eat veggies that are allowed with the craving-reducing meals. Soooo I was thinking... I forgot, I drank two cup of regular coffee this morning and I think that maybe what did it... I will keep "testing the waters, and see where I float the most comfortably". Thanks so much for your help... I really am new at this CAD/CALP thing and can use all the help I can get... :D

[Tiggerlou]

Adnil,
good job actually! You are really getting to know your body and system and are fine-tuning! That in itself is an accomplishment. Also, please keep in mind that you CAN HAVE 2 full CMs AND a snack per day! Eat at your CMs until you are no longer hungry! I am amazed sometimes at how much I can eat during the day besides my RM. Have a healthy helping, big omelett or such. If hungry again after 2-3 hours, have another full CM and eat until no longer hungry! If you can them bridge the time until your RM with a snack, keeping in mind that the RM is coming, (.....oooooom....ooooom.....), you 'll be out of the woods. But whatever you do, KEEP going! You're doing great! I also found for me that I lose better if my RM is not too late in the evening. Thinking about switching it to lunch with a small CM in the eve. See, we're all still fine-tuning!

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by roche
snip
I ate one portoin of rotisserie chicken, some green beans, some mustard greens, and two tator tots.
snip

And btw, Skyspinner, why do you think that one CM and one RM might be too much for you? Just wondering.

Roche

Did you cook the mustard greens? I have never figgered out how.....please share! :)

I think two meals is too much because I stopped losing when I added the second meal. Yesterday I had only my RM and today I'm down 0.2.

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by adnil53

snip I think CAD is just the basic diet and CALP is the same thing with more info and it stands for lifespan diet plan. But there are those that could tell you more, I'm just a "newbe" here... ;)

I have read all of the Hellers' books, and the basic plan does not vary much from what they described in "The Carbohydrate Addict's Diet" (CAD). They have simply rewritten each book for a slightly different audience...hence the "Healthy Heart Program" and "Lifespan Program" (CALP), "Healthy for Life" and the rest of them.

In addition to the RM and CM basics, CAD has the concept of changing your plan in reaction to your loss. Each week you can pick from Entry or Plans A, B, C, or D as needed to either lose or maintain your weight. CAD has the concept of a balanced RM, but doesn't mandate it as CALP does.

As far as I can see, when they wrote CALP they took Plan D from CAD and made it the RM plan, then added the balancing rule. That's where you eat a salad first at RM, then 1/3, 1/3, 1/3. And CALP includes some Options that you may add to speed loss along. This is stuff like taking chromium, exercising, eliminating AS and caffeine, timing your regular medications to decrease insulin spikes, etc. If you are interested in these, do go find CALP and see if it works for you.

Their research has not changed, only their experience, so each book will get you where you want to go. The basic are eat RM once a day, completed in 60 continuous minutes. Eat CM no more that twice a day. Eat CM snack no more than once a day. Coffee or tea w/ cream once a day, drunk in 15 minutes. No other oral intake permitted.

I think that's why so many refer to the WOL as "CAD/CALP".....they really are not very different at all. :) Hope this helps, but do read the books for yourself. This is just my interpretation of what I have read.

[roche]

Hey Skyspinner, I don't know how other people make mustard or turnip greens, but this is how I make them, and I really like it!

I start some water boiling and put some washed greens in there to cook.

While that is cooking, I fry up a couple pieces of bacon, and after mostly cooked I drain the grease. (grease will keep accumulating). Add 1/2 can mushrooms and perhaps some sliced onions. Saute that all together. After greens are somewhat wilted then I drain those and throw them in the pan with the bacon, mushrooms and onions. I also add perhaps a tb. of white vinegar and some salt and pepper. I absolutely love it!

Sometimes I go through the same process with green beans, I add all that stuff with green beans, and so yummy.

Hi Nancy, fifth day no diet soda. It is getting somewhat easier, but I still want it. I know I can't give in , though, or I'll just start guzzling the stuff. I actually drank almost one whole liter at one of my RMs. Not Good. I really need to just get rid of it. I have never read CALP, so I can't make any comments on it, but I have been reading CAD from library. I'm giong to go with suggestions from CALP (I read from other posts, like Skyspinner) to portoin out RM into one-thirds. I think I might have started out carboloading just a tad too much. It might be why I am on like 12th day (or more) with no loss.

Take care, Roche

[RedLisaP]

Roche,

Thanks for posting the info about how you make the greens. I'm always looking for new LC vegetables to try. I never tried those because they "sound yucky," sorta like collard greens or bok choy.

I recently discovered that I love squash - both spaghetti squash and butternut squash (and probably others too). Unfortunately, even though they WERE allowed on Atkins, they are NOT on CAD :nono: .

Lisa

[adnil53]

skyspinner... thanks for the information. I do have the CALP book and am following it. I think I may get the CAD book also, it seems to have some things in it that was left out of CALP...

roche... your greens recipe sounds very good... I love greens, but my favorite is Kale and wild Lambs Quarters...

Tiggerlou... Thanks... thing is yesterday I DID EAT TILL I WAS FULL!!! But didn't stay full for long. But today is a new day. I haven't eaten breakfast yet and it is after 10:00am, and now I am getting hungry so will go make me something to eat... I think I will have a cheese omolet this morning... I am trying to eat only when I am hungry, because I have a tendency to stuff myself, or I did before... we will see.

Thanks everyone for all your help... keep it comming!! :D :wave:

[luv67fire]

Is this just me or what?

If I eat mostly lc veggies for a CM (like a salad or something), I get hungry before it is time for me to eat again. Even if I eat a lot of it.

However, if I eat something that has a lot of fat in it, or if I have a good portion of meat, than I am full forever.

I've never eaten as much meat in the last two years, than I have in the last three weeks. Then again, I've never felt in so control, either.

Anyone else feel this way too? Or is it just me?

[roche]

If I eat mostly lc veggies for a CM (like a salad or something), I get hungry before it is time for me to eat again. Even if I eat a lot of it.

That is so me too! The days I eat salad for lunch, even with lots of protein, I am hungry soon after. It happened when I ate both a homemade salad and the day I ate salad at Mcdonalds. That is why I consistently eat sausage and eggs for br., it tides me over for a long time.

Hey Lisa, I love bok choy and napa cabbage. There is a recipe on the Atkins web site for chicken chowmein. (Obviously yu eat it without rice). It calls for napa cabbage and I absolutely love it. If you guys wanna try it, I'll post the recipe. I prepare it with lots of chicken.

roche

[RedLisaP]

Thanks Roche, I'd love to try it. :yum:

[Zuleikaa]

I'm that way too. The only salad that satisfies is chef salad or with lots of meat. And it has to have lots of dressing or mayonnaise too. Otherwise I'm hungry again.

[roche]

When looking up the recipe, realized that each serving had 6.5 gr. carb. Guess that would exceed the 4 grams recommended by CAD.

Hey Zules, what is your opinion on this for a CM?


www.atkinscenter.com/food/recipes/all/Chicken_Chow_Mein_with_Almonds.html

Roche

[Zuleikaa]

Substitute scallions for the onions, take out the almonds and it's legal.

[adnil53]

Cassie... (luv67fire) If I eat mostly lc veggies for a CM (like a salad or something), I get hungry before it is time for me to eat again. Even if I eat a lot of it. Yup, me too! I think that is why I was so hungry yesterday! I use to eat a lot of fat on regular LC, but the last couple of days I haven't eaten much fat... I drank coffee today and last night I had nuts, so I don't think my hunger was because of those things... that is why I said I thought I needed to up my calories and protein and I didn't feel I had ate enough...

[JudyTrue]

I'm the same way, guys, but I really do lose if I only do a small salad (or nothing) at noontime. I feel awfully empty by dinner, though, and then have a very hard time having salad for dinner, too. Once a day is about all I can handle, even though I really do like salad.

Had a salad at Subway today, and I asked for their ranch dressing. Just before opening the packet, I noticed that it said Fat Free, and it had 14 grams of carbs! Went back to the counter and got oil and vinegar. That would have really wrecked my CM!

Have a good evening!

[RedLisaP]

Yay Zuleikaa!!! :cheer:

Always thinkin' LC. We should all be so focused!

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by luv67fire
Is this just me or what?

If I eat mostly lc veggies for a CM (like a salad or something), I get hungry before it is time for me to eat again. Even if I eat a lot of it.

However, if I eat something that has a lot of fat in it, or if I have a good portion of meat, than I am full forever.

snip

Anyone else feel this way too? Or is it just me?

It's a physiological fact that fat eaten delays stomach emptying, which keeps you from feeling hungry longer. It's not just you, it's just your marvelous body, doing its thing! :)

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by roche

snipIf you guys wanna try it, I'll post the recipe.
snip
roche

Great idea! I'd love to try that chicken chow mein.

Say, why don't we start a new thread called "Great CM Recipes"? It could be the place to keep all our recipes just for CM. I've seen folks asking for these recipes.....whaddaya think? Should we do that?

[AmberAA1]

I switched from Atkins to CAD about a week and a half ago. I have lost my first pound on CAD. I was stuck at the same weight for 3 almost four weeks. I am glad I made the switch. It actually was Roche who got me to CAD I was looking at a few other plans. I had the CAD book before I had the Atkins book and should have just started with this.

[roche]

Hey Skyspinner, I am assuming the pages for this thread are the same for all of us. Go back one page to page 15 and there is the web address for the Atkins ChowMein. I find it really yummy.

Roche

[Tigra1965]

Hi Everyone

I did'nt get around to posting yesterday - just too many things going on at school and when I did get five minutes peace - I put my feet up.

Well have been weighed today and have put a 1lb on this week - but considering all the stuff I've had at RM's I'm not surprised really. I will now cut down the amount of treats I give myself I think. To be honest I opened some icecream yesterday and before I knew it - it had all disappeared. So that wont be happening again :rolleyes:

I have to say though - I do enjoy this WOL and will continue it - I realise I have to look at what I eat on my RM and tailour it to fit me. So its a matter of tweaking this week I think and finding what does and does not work for me.

:q: I've asked before about the headaches - I'm still getting a dull headache everyday and am really tired. Yes I have been working harder - but could it also be due to the amount of treats I've been allowing myself in RM? Honesty appreciated guys !!!!

Well I've got a free period now - so I'm off to look around.

Happy CADing everyone :wave:

[plum]

Tigra
Im not an expert yet but I have my book to hand....

I dont know if being from Atkins... we should give it 2 weeks in total entry.... but on Page 98 of my cad it says..

" if you gained weight during the past week..
and you want to lose weight
follow plan D for the next week "

so thats an option I suppose. Personally in your shoes I may well give it another couple of days to bring you to full 2/52 before doing plan D. ???you may need a full 2 week adjustment period.

Theres been talk of " going in the sweet shop ", well I think you needed to get that out of your system, I guess your body needs to settle down, thats all.

the other consideration of course is that the 1 LB may be a normal fluctuation, and you may find that averaging the weights over the 2 week period may give a more reliable result ?? 2-4 more days might just crack it.


as for the headache :confused: could MSG do it ? too much sugar ?.

let us know what you decide.

[plum]

Hmmmmm Tigra , I have re read my post to you and wonder if it makes sense to anyone but me :daze: :)

seriously tho I peeked in your journal at your RM and I bet if you balance the next couple into 1/3 rds that will do it.

In my copy of CAD theres no mention of this "balance" and I am very glad I read about it here.

Amber WOW what a good start, Im pleased for you.

[RedLisaP]

I thought there was some mention of the 1/3 balance in the CAD book. Although I loaned the book to my sister so I can't look it up.

I do remember being confused about that part of the plan when I read the book, so I don't think it was very clear...

[RedLisaP]

Tigra,

I looked in your journal and noticed that you are eating lots of carbs at your RM. You may want to try to be a little more diligent of the 1/3, 1/3, 1/3 balance of low carb veggies, protein, and high carb food. It might help you with the headaches, and will probably even help promote better weight loss.

I have found that on those nights where I don't keep the RM balance in check, I tend not to lose (and even gain) at the next morning's weighing.

Just a thought...

Lisa

[Tiggerlou]

Morning y'all!
Sounds to me it is best we all have knowledge of both, the CAD and the CALP book and use them to supplement the information missing in one of or the other. OR then again, there is this wonderful thread where we can just ask...LOL!
Getting a handle on my RM, down a total of 3 lbs since starting CAD/CALP 9 days ago!!! But what really, really gets me is the positive 'side effects'!!!!!! I am not longer pre-occupied with the thought of food, then the lack of cravings and appetite as well as the missing fluctuations I had while on Atkins (4-5 lb bounces from one day to another happened all the time - no longer!)
Wishing happy low-carbing to all and to all a good day!

[nawchem]

Tiggerlou :thup:

I don't know how to draw html little cheery guys with pompoms but the 3lbs is great. What are your tips for success so far?
nancy

[nawchem]

I was just wondering, I'm not supposed to actually have chocolate, the caffeine is a heart irritant. Have you ever heard of decaffeinated chocolate being sold anywhere?

[luv67fire]

Nawchem,

Not any that I am aware of. But with this woe, you can't eat too much chocolate anyways, and with the small amount of caffiene in chocolate, a little bit shouldn't hurt. It has never effected me, and my body is overly sensitive, especially with the MVP. Every little difference is noticed!! Lol!

Tiggra,

If you were previously on Atkins, than your body is probably screaming from so much sugar. Your head must be relaying the message ;)

I agree with others, a balanced RM is the best way to go, so you don't get the intense amount of sugars. Even though your insulin is not being released from it, there are still other body parts that have to deal with it! Lol!



Everyone Else,

I have the CAD book (probably the newer version, but most definitely not CALP), and it says in there specifically that the RM must be portioned, not a free-for-all.

[Tigra1965]

Dear All

thank you for your advice today - I've made sure I've had a good portion of veggies and meat, before my treat today - so hopefully the headache will have disappeared before the weekend is over.

I'm still on my 14 day entry plan - so cannot consult my book as regards which week to follow yet, but will be doing on tuesday.

I think another factor was my BM - I have felt really sluggish due to non show of BM for two days - but thankfully that has now been resolved too.

:q: what is MSG that everyone talks about? is this sweetner?

I do not use sweetners at all or sugar - unless its already in shop bought food for my RM.

Anyway happy LCing everyone and have a good weekend

bye :wave:

[RedLisaP]

Julie,

MSG is Monosodium Glutamate. It's a "naturally occuring" chemical found in certain foods, and manufacturers use it as an additive to enhance the flavor of foods.

The actual composition of this is fairly complicated (certainly above my head) but many people have adverse reactions to it. I recently found a web site that does a pretty good job of explaining the reasons people react to it in plain language. It's at http://www.nomsg.com/.

If anyone else can explain it in less than 5,000 words, please jump in :-) !

Lisa

[RedLisaP]

Actually, I just re-read my post and need to make a correction...

MSG is the processed form of glutamate, which is the naturally occurring substance found in foods like soybeans and tomatoes.

Manufacturers use MSG in their products so they can use cheaper ingredients and make a higher profit on their products.

In other words, it's a bad thing. :thdown:

-- L

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by AmberAA1
I switched from Atkins to CAD about a week and a half ago. I have lost my first pound on CAD. I was stuck at the same weight for 3 almost four weeks. I am glad I made the switch. It actually was Roche who got me to CAD I was looking at a few other plans. I had the CAD book before I had the Atkins book and should have just started with this.

Yay, Amber! This is just the first of many pounds you will lose!!

And three cheers for Roche! Way to go, woman.

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by plum
snip

In my copy of CAD theres no mention of this "balance" and I am very glad I read about it here.

snip

In CAD the only mention about "balance" is that you should chose from all four food groups. That was the FDA recommendations at that time...anyone remember the "four food groups"? :)

When the Hellers published CALP a few years later they introduced the plan of salad to start, then /13 protein, 1/3 craving-reducing foods (vegetables) and 1/3 carbohydrate-rich foods.

That's why you don't find it in CAD.

[skyspinner]

Originally posted by nawchem
I was just wondering, I'm not supposed to actually have chocolate, the caffeine is a heart irritant. Have you ever heard of decaffeinated chocolate being sold anywhere?

I went web-crawling and didn't find much, but you may want to contact Hershey's...if anybody makes it I would think it would be them. :)

From their website: "If you have questions or comments about HERSHEY'S products call us toll-free weekdays 9-4 EST:
1-800-468-1714"

The only other thing I can think of is an organic chocolate.....you might want to look in health food stores.

And if you find it, please let us know, okay? :)

[nawchem]

thanks for your info and input on the caffeine. I think its kind of strange that its a no no. Coffee has about 135mg of caffeine, sodas about 50mg, and a candy bar only has 5mg. It doesn't seem that big a deal but I would really like to feel top-of -the world again.

I sure will let you know if I find my caffeine free chocolate. Someone suggested carob to me. Has anyone tried this and is it a healthy choice?

Nancy

[roche]

Phew. After gaining one lb. on CAD (and not really worring about it), but then eating cookies past my RM and gaining two lbs. (and DEFINITELY worrying about that!), I am finally back to 170. Am really hoping that no diet soda, saving carbs for some dessert instead of starches, not having 2-3 servings (oink, oink) at each RM and eating RM earlier in day helps out with loss now.

Yesterday ate late br. of sausage and eggs and then late lunch (RM) about 3:00 p.m. Didn't eat after that. I'll be doing something like that Sat. and Sun. too, just because of how schedule works out. Am really intersted to see how reflects.

TTFN, Roche

[AmberAA1]

THE CHOCOLATE MANUFACTURERS ASSOCIATION SAYS THERE IS NO CAFFEINE-FREE CHOCOLATE BECAUSE THERE'S NO NEED FOR IT. THE ASSOCIATION SAYS IT'S A COMMON MYTH THAT CHOCOLATE CONTAINS A LOT OF CAFFEINE.