General Low Carb Pregnancy Discussion

[I<3splenda]

:wave: Anyone else pregnant & struggling with the lack of information regarding low carb pregnancies? Let's support each other here!

I am pregnant with my second, due in March but totally look 6 months pregnant already :p

I haven't been counting carbs as much lately - I was eating a lot of fruit when I was feeling sick but it quickly transformed into an aversion. I've just been so hungry. For some reason I thought the low carb would curb that, but nope! Just as hungry as the next pregnant lady!!

The OB I saw briefly (for my "official" pregnancy test) told me to stop taking my Metformin which I take for Metabolic Syndrome/Insulin Resistance, so I did - but now I'm reading that many women continue taking it for insulin issues! I have a note in to my Pdoc, so we'll see.

I found new midwives (my midwives from my daughter's birth are on sabbatical) & they are AWESOME! One was actually an intern with my other midwives & we loved her then. It's really kissmet! I'm looking forward to midwifery care again. There is such a difference!

I pretty much want eggs with bacon or ham and cheese ALL the time. Grilled meat is a yummy treat for dinner and I've had peanutbutter & celery as a snack once a day for over a week. Mostly it's eggs and some smoked pork product. Mmmm. Eggs. Can't get enough. One night I went face down in a bowl of popcorn, but I don't really know what to say about that

Nausea is WAY better & easily remedied by eating something (which is usually eggs with bacon or ham and cheese :lol ) All around I'm feeling pretty much back to "normal" save for my ginormous uterus that seems WAY bigger this second time around.

Except... today, after a month of fixation, I made a chocolate layer cake with cream cheese frosting using This (http://healthyindulgences.blogspot.com/search/label/black%20beans) recipe. It was effing amazing, let me tell you! Actually, I made the basic batter, but I used cannalini [white] beans - as a long time beanconfection skeptic, I just couldn't ditch the disgusting image of black beans in a cake. For some reason white beans seemed more approachable.

Then I split the batter in half and made 3 vanilla cupcakes & 3 lemon cupcakes with 1 half & 1 mini chocolate layer cake with the other :lol My husband and daughter (& ME, of course!) were THRILLED to have such delightful tasty treats in the house!

I frosted the vanilla with chocolate cream cheese frosting, the lemon with lemon zest cream cheese frosting & the chocolate with vanilla cream cheese frosting. OMGZ!

The amazing woman who writes the blog has a delicious coconut milk glaze recipe, I just decided not to use it I had to go for it or my fixation on confections was sure to reach dangerous heights.

So yeah - carby beans and cheesey goodness... I'm having a REALLY hard time feeling guilty about it if you know what I mean Man! That was every pregnant lady's fantasy without the sugar rush and carb coma.


Anyway! If anyone else is out there I'd love to chat!

xo

[ambimorph]

I *am* 6 months pregnant! Unfortunately for me, even though I tried to stay very low carb (zero-carb, in fact), I was way too sick, with the most intense carb cravings I've ever had, to do it. I've been eating lots of carbs for months. Just in the last week or so did I start to try cutting carbs again. The cravings are not a big problem now, but I'm still very easily nauseated. In fact, I just threw up. :-(

I would love it if were craving eggs and meat all the time! I'm just trying to get it down the best I can.

What do your midwives think of LCing? I haven't brought it up with mine yet, but will have to next appt, because of the glucose tolerance test.

I'm glad that you are feeling relatively normal. I hope that keeps up!

[fireballgi]

I'd love to have some LC pregnant buddies! I followed a LC woe about 10 years ago and lost about 90 pounds. Then I got sucked into the "LC is bad for you" stuff and tried to follow a "healthy, balanced diet" and ended up putting most of it back on. Last winter/spring, I read Gary Taubes' Good Calories, Bad Calories (has anyone read it? amazing!) and was convinced that this is the way to go. I started "induction" and then found out that I was pregnant with #3.

I got really sick (sinus, flu, etc.; thank goodness no morning sickness) for about a month and it is really hard for me to eat anything, especially protein when I have a cold. Then I came to visit my mom for 6 weeks, and have been binging (partly lack of sleep, partly just too many nasty, good tasting things around). To add to the temptations, I have been concerned about ketones and their negative effect on fetal brain development, and have also used this as an excuse. (I did have ketones in my urine at my last appointment, even though I was following a moderate carb diet.)

So, does anyone have any reliable information on ketones and how they affect brain development? There are some concerns that ketones do not allow proper brain development. The best I've been able to come up with is from the MFM doctor who finished my ultrasound last week. She said that she's only heard of it as a concern with someone whose diabetes is out of control and is in a state of ketoacidosis. In that case, she would recommend more protein and fat. So it seems like the information out there may be similar to the concern about ketosis--where people confuse ketosis with ketoacidosis. Does this make sense? Based on that, I'm going to go ahead with my diet.

This next week I'm going to a conference, so it should be a pretty good week to start, as long as I plan ahead and take good things to eat.

I<3Splenda...yay for your midwives!! I had a hospital based midwife that I absolutely loved for the first two babies. She was a 45 minute drive, but amazing and worth it. But then I found out that she had left the practice and thought it would be a good time to find someone (and hospital) close to home (ie 5 minutes away). So far, I've tried an OB and Family Practice and am not happy with either. So I tracked down my old midwife at her new practice and am going to switch to her when I get home. Even though she's 45 minutes and the hospital is an hour away, I would rather be with someone that I really trust.

Looking forward to supporting all of you and getting to know you!

Amberly

[ambimorph]

To add to the temptations, I have been concerned about ketones and their negative effect on fetal brain development, and have also used this as an excuse. (I did have ketones in my urine at my last appointment, even though I was following a moderate carb diet.)

So, does anyone have any reliable information on ketones and how they affect brain development? There are some concerns that ketones do not allow proper brain development. The best I've been able to come up with is from the MFM doctor who finished my ultrasound last week. She said that she's only heard of it as a concern with someone whose diabetes is out of control and is in a state of ketoacidosis. In that case, she would recommend more protein and fat. So it seems like the information out there may be similar to the concern about ketosis--where people confuse ketosis with ketoacidosis. Does this make sense? Based on that, I'm going to go ahead with my diet

Here's a post I wrote about that a couple of months ago (http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?t=391315&page=3&pp=15), see #35

[bestrange]

hi ladies, congrats on your pregnancies! I'm not pregant, just broody at the moment :) I have an almost 3yr old daughter right now, and will trying for another in the next year or so.

ie ketones and fetal development. I have hear different things, some say ketones are optimal for brain growth, other say it is to be avoided. often pregnant women will go in and out of ketosis naturally without trying to on a regular pregnancy.

I think I will not try to be in it, or fear ketosis when I'm pregnant. Keeping my carbs low enough really helps me stay on track, so I will just try and stick with a general low carb diet.

Our ancestors evolved on a ketogenic meat based diet, and that is often tributed to why our brains got so large, so I don't think there's much to be afraid of. Problem is testing pregnant women in a controlled environment, so there's not enough scientific evidence. Anecdotally, however, I really don't think it is a problem.

I do think that people confuse ketoacidosis with ketosis, my mil recently thought that we were talking about an epileptic ketogenic diet as opposed to that natural ketosis that happens on low carb. sheesh, i think people like to just make assumptions and be nay-sayers some times!

[ambimorph]

An epileptic ketogenic diet *is* natural ketosis, isn't it? They eat low carb and high fat. It's true they add MCT oils.

[I<3splenda]

I tried to stay very low carb (zero-carb, in fact), I was way too sick, with the most intense carb cravings I've ever had, to do it.


What do your midwives think of LCing? I haven't brought it up with mine yet, but will have to next appt, because of the glucose tolerance test.

I'm glad that you are feeling relatively normal. I hope that keeps up!

Hey!!! That reminds me of my first pregnancy. I was vegan & ended up SO sick with the craziest meat cravings ever - RAW meat, specifically. There have been studies that correlate and those that don't correlate pregnant cravings with defeciencies, but as soon as I started eating meat my cravings & the deadly sickness (opposed to the normal queasy sickness) dissappeared.

This time around my sickness is definitely better. I definitely got sick & had days during which I was vomiting pretty uncontrollably (I even managed to puke down the sleeve of my sweater at a restaurant - classy!) but in general it's been way better.

I still get pretty nauseated when it comes to eating time, but if I push myself through it & cook something nutritious (which I did NOT do my first pregnancy - I succumbed to take-out a LOT!) once I stuff it down my face I feel better :) I think that's the egg thing - super quick to make, so there's immediate relief of vomitous rex!

I haven't met with my midwives yet, we have an appointment in a few weeks! I'm not sure how it's going to go. They're big into Nourishing Traditions style nutrition, so if anything they'll be more open minded than the medical SOT of pregnancy. They might refer me to a naturopath or RD, which would be fine by me! I'm basically stumbling through this anyway! :lol:


fireballgi - I'm also concerned about ketones and their effect on a fetus. I'm only convinced of one thing: Nobody freaking knows. I'm just trying to eat according to what I'm comfortable with. I know I am definitely not comfortable with my typical >20c ketogenic diet while pregnant. My carb counts have been all over the place - 40-150g! I go day to day - I definitely find my more moderate carb days are my best days, but sometimes my ravenous hunger dictates such a large quantity of food that the carb count naturally rises.

My midwives with my daughter were incredible. The care is just so different - I feel for women who don't know there are options out there, you know?

I had a home/water birth with my daughter, and after a BRIEF experience with an OB this time around I'm definitely going to set it up that way again.

For me the best part about planning to labor at home FIRST are the options I have. Once you go to a hospital you're there, no matter how long you have left to labor. At home I could decide at any time to go to the hospital or not go to the hospital whenever I wanted. I could go for a walk, sit outside, sit in the shower, sit in the tub, pace around my own home, have my own food & drinks - it was awesome! I should note I had 2 midwives, 2 doulas and my husband there for support.

There are 2 rental tub companies in Seattle (we're lucky ducks!) and you can call them to set up/take down at your home OR a hospital, so really where I actually give birth is pretty up in the air until it happens! I just like having the options AND the personal space I need to labor. Everyone is totally different, but I would be pretty distracted and uncomfortable if I were laboring normally and in a hospital.

Of course, my labor was really long! 48 hours of prodromal labor followed by 24 hours of active labor! I don't know how that would have gone in a hospital setting - I hear they can get impatient.

Anyway!! YAY!!!! Preggers low carbin ladies!!!! :cool: :cool: :cool:

[erinleigh]

Hey Girls! Congrats on your pregnancies! I just had my first and she turns 2 months tomorrow!

I did LC for different parts of my pregnancy...I did however eat pasta when the craving hit me! :lol:

For about the last month or two I started to cut carbs down way low so that I wouldn't be hit hard with the 'flu" when it came to sticking to LC aftwards! The day my daughter was born I was right back on full blown LC.

My doctor did say when I asked when I found out if it was ok to stay LC she said yes but to stay around 40-60 carbs!

[LC-Laur]

I wish all my fellow low carb preggos lots of luck! My name is Lauren and I'm 32 weeks pregnant with my first!

Personally, I was soooooo good in the first half of my pregnancy! I allowed some fruit and the occasional whole grain, but otherwise it was all the usual low-carb fare. Then when I hit the halfway mark I slowly started to slide downhill and have since picked up speed *sigh* I'm definitely still healthier than your typical American, but I'm far from where I want to be. It's like once I started to get into that uncomfortable "I can't sleep, nothing sounds good, I hate everyone" stage of pregnancy I just stopped caring as much. :lol: I need to get better about that because I have less than 2 months to go and I don't need to go into shock after I have this baby and cut out the carbs! Luckily even with the extra carbs, I've still been quite "healthy" and haven't been overeating, so my weight gain is right on track. Phew!

I'm jealous of all of you with midwives. I think the nearest midwife is like 2 hours away from me! But I love my family practitioner and she's totally on page with what I want my birth to be like, so it should all work out. Luckily I don't live in a huge city, so our hospital is a little more laid back with how long you labor and all that, instead of just trying to rush you out the door. Small victories I guess.

[I<3splenda]

Then when I hit the halfway mark I slowly started to slide downhill and have since picked up speed *sigh* It's like once I started to get into that uncomfortable "I can't sleep, nothing sounds good, I hate everyone" stage of pregnancy I just stopped caring as much. :lol:


:lol: Hey - you're eating well! That's what's important! I hit the "I can't sleep, nothing sounds good, I hate everyone" stage of pregnancy at about 4 weeks with my first, so you're doing GREAT! ;)


erinleigh THANK YOU for sharing your doctor's advice! 40-60 carbs is way lower than my average I think - I was so afraid to keep it "too low" (not that anyone knows what "too low" for pregnancy is). I'll definitely kick it down a notch.


This pregnancy is totally different since I have a metabolic disorder this time around. My first I wasn't taking the medications I'm on now & was pretty much free to "F-it all" when it came to my diet. I "had an aversion to cooking" and ordered out nearly EVERY night!

This time around I'm pretty much bound to a diet that is compatible with insulin resistance / metabolic syndrome. I think it's a blessing in disguise :lol: I can't stop for that delicious looking ham and cheese croissant in the window because I know it'll do awful things to my blood sugar (& the last thing I need is gestational diabetes) Now I know that an "aversion to cooking" can be remedied by cooking anyway - he-llooooo low carb layer cakes! :lol: "Lesser of all evils" right? ;)

[erinleigh]

I think they say as long as you are not in deep ketosis during your pregnancy you are fine. I had ketones in my urine through out my whole pregnancy...they sometime will suggest to higher them to 100 to avoid tricking the sticks from the fat or protein in your urine.

[duchesse]

Hello and good luck to everyone, I am so glad you started this thread I<3splenda. :)

I am at 25 weeks and have been feeling really well. No nausea to start with, no headaches or anything like that.

Like Lauren, I started off really well, I think I still eat a fairly healthy diet but definitely way more carbs than I used to. I never show ketones but would love to have more information about pregnancy and ketones in general.

I am not eating any sugar at all, mostly lost of fruits, vegetables and only limited amount of grains. At the beginning I was more careful, especially with the amount of fruit, now I eat as much as I want. :) I log my food into fitday almost everyday and most days I am around a 100 net carbs.

My doctor is pretty good, she listens and she understands some of my concerns. For example, I really didn't want to do the glucose tolerance test and she came up with what I think is a fair compromise. She asked me to keep a journal for a week to ten days checking my blood glucose levels with a machine at home about seven times a day. Before and after meals, when I first wake up and before I go to bed.

By the way, I still managed to gain about 15 pounds in 25 weeks...

[Nancy LC]

I read Gary Taubes' Good Calories, Bad Calories (has anyone read it? amazing!) and was convinced that this is the way to go. I started "induction" and then found out that I was pregnant with #3.

It's a real popular book around here. :thup:
I even managed to puke down the sleeve of my sweater at a restaurant - classy!)
LOL! This is hilarious. Were you trying to vomit discretely or did it just catch you off guard and end up in your sweater sleeve somehow? :lol: I can only just imagine...

[LC-Laur]

I was wondering about the sweater too. :lol:

[I<3splenda]

Hey Nancy!!! Ha - yes! I had to emergency exit my table (for the second time) & ran for the bathroom - I have NO idea how it got up my sleeve though, I suspect it had the opportunity while I was holding my hair out of my face. It was quite the projectile vomit. Really, astounding!

I didn't even notice it was there until I started washing my hands... "what is.. omg!" Soooooo gnarly! At that point there was no return. We had to leave the restaurant :p

:cool: I'm so glad I/we have more of a support system. I want to make sure none of us view this as some accountability group - it's for emotional support, supportive discussion and supportive exchange of ideas only! No judgement or arguing the superiority of any "plan," only empathy, commisery & love! The last thing mothers need is additional guilt. This is a no guilt zone, ok?

I actually started this thread because I posted my DELICIOUS "confession" of my bean layer cake with cream cheese frosting in the "Paleo-pregnancy" thread in the Paleo forum sect I usually frequent.

Then - get this - an unpregnant MAN decides to chime in that I should quit the dairy. Freaking hillarious! Next time you're pregnant, dude, you can eat however you want!

Anyway! THIS thread is for WOMEN only, pregnant or not, who want to support each other on whatever plan they may or may not be in!

I love you ladies! Loving our adventure together thusfar!

[I<3splenda]

Lauryn!!! Is that ticker a joke?? You are supposed to gain 1lb/week...!

[ambimorph]

I gained about 20lbs in my second month, and then stayed about the same since. I've fantasized that I'll stay the same for the last 10 weeks, meaning baby gains + I lose, by eating low carb from now on, but whatever. I'll just do the best I can, and soon enough I'll be back on track.

Re the paleo guy: I think people don't realize how touch and go it can be. Not all pregnant women can just eat exactly what they believe is healthiest, whether that's paleo, or VLC, or even SAD. If body says no, it means no, and will reject food if it wants to. And the cravings I've had, at least, have been way stronger than the "plain old" cravings I've had after a sugar binge. I don't want to say I'm not responsible for my actions, but I do think it's a different game than, say, keto-adapting, where you struggle for 4 or 5 days and then it's mostly easy.

[I<3splenda]

I think any man who gives a pregnant woman advice regarding ANYTHING is asking for it ;)

I gained 80 with my first (all that take-out!) and lost it all and then some. Try not to let it get to you too much, ESPECIALLY if you're planning on breastfeeding. That's the best diet ever!

There I go giving advice right after I declared this an advice free zone... we'll see if I can take it myself ;)

[I<3splenda]

Not all pregnant women can just eat exactly what they believe is healthiest, whether that's paleo, or VLC, or even SAD. If body says no, it means no, and will reject food if it wants to. And the cravings I've had, at least, have been way stronger than the "plain old" cravings I've had after a sugar binge. I don't want to say I'm not responsible for my actions, but I do think it's a different game than, say, keto-adapting, where you struggle for 4 or 5 days and then it's mostly easy.


Hey - I've been thinking about this since I read it. I know there are studies both that support and negate the idea of cravings as a means for the body to meet nutritional needs, but for me, ESPECIALLY when I'm pregnant, it's important for me to pay attention to what might lurk beneath.

When I was vegan and experienced such strong cravings for meat (& equally strong aversions to EVERYTHING else, including vegetables & fruits!) - my body really told me how it was going to be.

For a while around week 6 all I wanted was meat and fruit - anything else was wrong wrong wrong! I even ate a yam and black beans at one point because I NEEDED them - and I think I really did! Right now I wouldn't eat a steak if it were in my face, but I could probably eat 20 chicken breasts with mushrooms, onions and bbq sauce. Skinless breasts, at that (laughable considering what a fat fiend I usually am).

So yeah - we're responsible for our actions, but that doesn't mean our actions, though maybe contrary to our "normal" "ideal," are wrong.

I also know the difference between my obsession with layer cakes and a serious fixation on raw beef or the NEED of a yam, but I think they both deserve credit where credit is due ;)

Regardless, adaptation is excellent practice for parenting :lol: I know I had LOTS of ideas on the "how to's" of parenting until I actually got in the thick of it :D

We'll see what happens! I'm pretty good at rolling with it... I've already accepted that I'm "in for it" with 2!

[bestrange]

I have been wondering about the glucose test thing, how does that work on a low carb diet? will it spike up because you haven't been used to having that much carbs? i would hate to have been really good at keeping my insulin and what not inline, and then blow it by the actual test itself! last time, i remember it was like a sickly sweet orange fanta... that just sounds disgusting to me now!

[bestrange]

you know, the other side to cravings during pregnancy is the emotional comfort we get, and I don't think that should be over looked. Emotional eating isn't always bad. If done in excess and to a point where it's disastrous, then of course. But if indulging every now and then in something that while not maybe optimal for your waistline (or dietary dogma) or whatever, the emotional comfort can sustain you to get through the long term, you know? And a happy mom does trickle down to happy kids most of the time.

[duchesse]

I have been wondering about the glucose test thing, how does that work on a low carb diet? will it spike up because you haven't been used to having that much carbs? i would hate to have been really good at keeping my insulin and what not inline, and then blow it by the actual test itself! last time, i remember it was like a sickly sweet orange fanta... that just sounds disgusting to me now!

I think they advise to eat at least 150 carbs a day for three days prior to the test to get accurate results.

[cindydanle]

HI Ladies,

I have been LCing off and on for years now ...I am 10 weeks pregnant with my 2nd child and would like this to be a low carb pregnancy but I just don't know what to eat. Most meat makes me gag these days. All I crave are plain things with little seasoning. Mac and Cheese, PB and J sandwiches, baked Potatoes with cottage cheese. Nothing is very low carb. What did you all eat? What are some LC comfort food ideas? Is this just a 1st trimester thing? (my aversion to meat and the nausea)

Also...I have been hearing stories about Moms who had LC pregnancies....and their babies sleeping through the night right from the very beginning. How true is this????

Thanks for the help


Cindy

[ambimorph]

I think they advise to eat at least 150 carbs a day for three days prior to the test to get accurate results.

That's right. I found a paper showing how the results will be affected: Glucose tolerance test standardization simplified by urinary ketone testing (http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1919578). The point of the article, I think, is that you should check for ketones before bothering to do the test, but it could also potentially be used to adjust the numbers.

[ambimorph]

I have been LCing off and on for years now ...I am 10 weeks pregnant with my 2nd child and would like this to be a low carb pregnancy but I just don't know what to eat. Most meat makes me gag these days. All I crave are plain things with little seasoning. Mac and Cheese, PB and J sandwiches, baked Potatoes with cottage cheese. Nothing is very low carb. What did you all eat? What are some LC comfort food ideas? Is this just a 1st trimester thing? (my aversion to meat and the nausea)


Sounds like me, but it was for more than 2 trimesters. And I was eating worse than that, if you can believe it. I can *usually* eat meat now, but I can't usually deal with handling it raw or cooking it. I still vomit every week or two, and want to almost daily. I hope you have better luck!

[I<3splenda]

Most meat makes me gag these days. All I crave are plain things with little seasoning. Mac and Cheese, PB and J sandwiches, baked Potatoes with cottage cheese. Nothing is very low carb. What did you all eat? What are some LC comfort food ideas? Is this just a 1st trimester thing? (my aversion to meat and the nausea)

Also...I have been hearing stories about Moms who had LC pregnancies....and their babies sleeping through the night right from the very beginning. How true is this????



Hey! For me pushing through the gag is only thing that works. I force myself to cook and eat it. Once I stuff my face full of food (seriously, sometimes I literally have to shovel it in & not think about it) I feel better & can live.

It might work for you, it might not. I know that my last pregnancy I "couldn't stand cooking" etc etc so I succumbed to take-out. I was sick my whole pregnancy (yet still managed to gain 80lbs)! I had a nice healthy baby, but I felt like crappola.

Forcing myself to cook & eat has saved me money for sure. WHO KNOWS if it's related (i.e. I am DEFINITELY not saying it is related!!!) but my sickness is way better than my last pregnancy, so it's working for me! I'm sooo glad I found something that works for me, because last pregnancy was killer.

As far as comfort food goes, once or twice a week I'll make homemade ice cream or something fabulous from http://healthyindulgences.blogspot.com/ Mac n cheese & potato would be easy to replicate with cauliflower & processed cheese if you can handle cooking. Do you like ricotta or strained (aka Greek) yogurt (aka yogurt cheese)? They're kind of like cottage cheese. You can also make your own cottage cheese (or just go buy some?).

Anyway! Good luck... everyone's gotta do what they gotta do!!!

As for that last idea... sounds too good to be true, doesn't it? ;) I've heard people say that about all sorts of things. I dunno... in my experience there's no magic answer in parenting (unfortunately). If you find one, let me know!~ :lol:

[bestrange]

hmm... low carb comfort food. well i guess you could find lowcarb version of noodles on the internet and smother them with cheese, or maybe even use wholegrain, rice, or ezekiel (sprouted noodles), that you can find at a lot of grocery stores now. they are still pretty carby, but aren't going to wreak as much havoc on your insulin as white flour.
you can substitute turnips for potatoes, they are nice and carby tasting, but with very few carbs in comparison.
eggs are great if you are having a hard time with meat. you can make big egg casseroles and then just keep leftovers in the fridge to either eat cold or reheat in a microwave or toaster oven.

I drank a lot of smoothies last time I was pregnant, you can make really nutritious and lowcarb ones with greens, almond milk, and berries. an avocado or banana makes it rich and creamy... (though the banana would make it higher in carbs). we had a hand-crank blender, like the kind you use for camping, in an effort to be eco-friendly. yeah... i wouldn't recommend that. I now love my electric Oster :)

[fireballgi]

Cindy ...

Ditto to what everyone else has said. I really do not want to eat protein, but feel so much better when I do. I'm 19 weeks now, and just trying to move back to eating what is right, and I hope to do it now, not later. I don't know if you're a sweets person, but one of my LC comfort foods is chocolate mousse--whipping cream mixed with cocoa powder and splenda.

I've never heard about babies sleeping right through the night, and honestly, if mine did (esp if bf), I'd be concerned. After 2-3 months, it would be great, but I don't think babies are supposed to go 8-10 hours without food as a newborn.

[~centa*of*]

Unless you've been low carbing (or Paleo in my case) for a significant time before getting pregnant, then you are going to find it very difficult to do it while pregnant. As you have no control over the sugar downers (carb cravings) with those hormones.

[~centa*of*]

HI Ladies,
Also...I have been hearing stories about Moms who had LC pregnancies....and their babies sleeping through the night right from the very beginning. How true is this????

I have done two very low carb pregnancies (Paleo). My second one was more strict. Neither child slept through (7pm-7am - no dream feeds/dummy returns etc) until about 6 months of age. I had sleeping from 7pm-4am (no dream feeds/dummy returns etc) from about 3 months of age.

I think it had more to do with strict routine... though the low sugar in my diet (and thus their milk - I am still breastfeeding my 2 year old and 6 month old) did contribute.

I have heard of a child sleeping through from a couple of weeks though, but neither of their parents (not that the dad counts in that sense) were eating low carb.

[~centa*of*]

I have been wondering about the glucose test thing, how does that work on a low carb diet? will it spike up because you haven't been used to having that much carbs? i would hate to have been really good at keeping my insulin and what not inline, and then blow it by the actual test itself! last time, i remember it was like a sickly sweet orange fanta... that just sounds disgusting to me now!

Eating low carb makes no difference to the glucose test. I too worried about this as they made me do the big glucose test as I was at high risk (other family members have had gestational diabetes). The doctor told me that it doesn't make any difference at all. It is testing the way your body responds to sugar and not having sugar (or having lots of sugar) for x amount of time before the test does not alter the result... I still don't know/understand how it works, but that's what my doctor said. (although I had been eating low carb for over 7 months with my 1st pregnancy and 2 years with my second pregnancy and throughout the pregnancy and both times I didn't get GD but got told my results were exceptionally good).

[bestrange]

as far as sleeping through the night, my daughter did, but she was cosleeping with me and nursing while she and I both slept!

[bestrange]

Eating low carb makes no difference to the glucose test. I too worried about this as they made me do the big glucose test as I was at high risk (other family members have had gestational diabetes). The doctor told me that it doesn't make any difference at all. It is testing the way your body responds to sugar and not having sugar (or having lots of sugar) for x amount of time before the test does not alter the result... I still don't know/understand how it works, but that's what my doctor said. (although I had been eating low carb for over 7 months with my 1st pregnancy and 2 years with my second pregnancy and throughout the pregnancy and both times I didn't get GD but got told my results were exceptionally good).
thanks for this! as terrible as my diet was last time, I still passed the test, so hopefully I will be even better next time around..

[~centa*of*]

as far as sleeping through the night, my daughter did, but she was cosleeping with me and nursing while she and I both slept!

Yeah, I didn't think about co-sleeping. I tried it for a couple of nights and couldn't sleep (even though my bub was) so had to change over to the cot. I love the idea of co-sleeping and could see how that would assist with sleeping through the night.

[ambimorph]

Eating low carb makes no difference to the glucose test.

I'm glad your results were good, but I've seen lots of medical sites claiming that there is an effect, as well as the very concrete results in that paper I posted. Maybe it depends on how long you have been low carbing.

[Nancy LC]

I think they advise to eat at least 150 carbs a day for three days prior to the test to get accurate results.Yes this is true, at least according to Dr. Eades.
Following a low-carb diet makes one a little glucose intolerant, which is the reason that the instructions for a glucose tolerance test always include the admonition to eat plenty of carbs in the week before the test. Why? Because all the macronutrients–glucose, fat and protein–are broken down by enzymes during the metabolic process. And all the enzymes necessary for the metabolism of the various macronutrients are made on demand but not immediately. If you are on a high carbohydrate diet, then you will have plenty of enzymes on hand to deal with the carbohydrates you consume. If you switch to a low-carbohydrate diet, it takes a while to manufacture the enzymes in the quantities needed to deal with the extra fat and protein that your metabolic system hadn’t been exposed to. This deficiency of protein/fat metabolizing enzymes is the reason people starting a low-carb diet become so easily fatigued–they’ve got plenty of enzymes on hand to break down carbs, they just don’t have the carbs to metabolize. Once they produce the enzymes necessary to deal with the load of protein and fat, which takes a few days, they become low-carb adapted and no longer feel fatigued.
http://www.proteinpower.com/drmike/uncategorized/low-carb-caveat/

[bestrange]

hmm, so maybe that could be my excuse to carb-up for a few days and indulge in some delicious honey and things. but doesn't dr eades also reccommend avoiding ketosis while pregnant? I'm not sure I'm on board with that entirely.

[Gypsybyrd]

Not being pregnant, nor having ever been pregnant, how is it that the results of the glucose test are supposed to be skewed by low-carbing and not carbing up for a few days before the test? For example, is it more likely to show the patient as being intolerant/diabetic/etc.?

[LC-Laur]

I had been a really low-carber in the week before my first glucose test and I ended up failing it. Only by like 5 points, but enough that they made me do the 3 hour test (and that really sucks, but at least I passed it with flying colors). I'd had my blood sugar checked several times through my pregnancy and it was always low/normal, so my doctor was completely baffled as to how I failed it at all! :lol: I wouldn't be surprised if my low-carbing had at least a little something to do with it since my body was probably like "WTF!?" when I drank that syrup drink! :lol:

[meghen22]

Hello everyone,

I am a breastfeeding mom, hope you don't mind me joining in, it is hard to find info on LC and pregnancy/breastfeeding. I am currently eating 60-80 carbs/day since I don't want to lose the weight too fast, but I did terrible while I was pregnant. I think that GTT threw me off. I was eating fairly LC and then I took the test, flunked it by only a few points, took the 3 hour and like LC-laur, I passed it with no problem. It seems like after that I just couldn't get back to LC. Once I taste the sugar, I am hooked and it is so hard to get off of it. I hope to lose this baby weight and stick to LC for life, I just can't handle sugar and a lot of people do not understand.

Best of luck to all you pregnant ladies!
Meg

[I<3splenda]

^I totally know what you mean about sugar. I wish I could be "normal," but I am really sensitive to it! I can't even have tic tacs or breathmints! I'll eat them all!


So I'm freaking starving! Gosh! SO hungry! ALL the time! :yum: I'm even dreaming about food, which is frightening. This morning I woke up horrified thinking I had eaten an entire Ritter Sport marzipan candy bar! Of all things!

My first pregnancy I started out at an unhealthy 110ish (vegan nutrition *shivers*). This pregnancy I started out at 130 - holy cow! I look like I did at 6 months pregnant the first time!

My abdominal seperation has come completely apart already. After 3 years of training I was finally able to do leg lifts & full sit ups etc. Oh well :p I guess I know what it takes to repair!

Anyway! Totally starving!!!

What were your favourite snacks and meals while you were pregnant ladies? Again - no judgement zone!

For a while I was on a chicken tenders sauteed with mushrooms in a lettuce wrap kick - but the last couple of days I've just been wanting scrambled eggs again (and toast, but you know how that goes :p ) I've almost eaten a dozen eggs since yesterday!!!

[duchesse]

What were your favourite snacks and meals while you were pregnant ladies? Again - no judgement zone!

For a while I was on a chicken tenders sauteed with mushrooms in a lettuce wrap kick - but the last couple of days I've just been wanting scrambled eggs again (and toast, but you know how that goes :p ) I've almost eaten a dozen eggs since yesterday!!!

Right now my favorite snack/meal is greek salad and I also like to snack on blueberries.

[LC-Laur]

I keep wanting PB&J (on low-carb bread at least - that 45 Calories and Delightful stuff). Still, I could eat a PB&J every day! Only with strawberry preserves, though. :lol:

I totally agree about that stupid glucose test throwing me off! I was a good low-carber before then. I may have had an off bite of this or that, but never much... After that test is when I fell HARD and haven't been able to get all the way back. Stupid sugar.

[~centa*of*]

I couldn't get enough bacon and eggs... I don't know what it is about that greasy bacon! I also had to make a ton of chocolate cakes and prune balls.
I did have some unusual cravings too... like bacon fat with chocolate... And I wanted a ton of chocolate in general (I was eating 86% cocoa chocolate at the time, to keep the sugar down) and almonds.

[I<3splenda]

Right now my favorite snack/meal is greek salad and I also like to snack on blueberries.

Oh man! :lol: You sound so well balanced! The idea of a salad (or any raw vegetable) has put me off since pregnancy. The same thing happened last time! I don't know what it is. VERY strange!

At least this time I've been able to find a few heads of lettuce / bunches of chard that don't send my pregnant senses into a flight & have used them as wraps, but it's so touch & go. I can't go into the store guaranteeing I'll come back with lettuce. I can also eat scrubbed celery, for whatever reason (perhaps because it's a vehicle for peanutbutter? Hmmm... ;) ) but ALL of the outer stalks must come off. Only the seriously blanched interior is "Safe"


Oh lord - PB&J!!! YUM! A few weeks ago I was so desperate for a PB sandwich I sandwiched it between lettuce leaves. No kidding! I have a zillion raspberries outside right now - maybe I'll add some! Mmmm!

That reminds me... when I was a kid one of my favourite special breakfasts was a "jelly omlette" with my Meemaw's preserves :yum: Sure it sounds disgusting, but man! I'm telling you! That was delicious! Maybe I'll try it with raspberries instead. OMG - or peanut butter and raspberry omlette!!!!!!!!!!! GENIUS! (/you know you're pregnant when...)


Senta :lol: I KNOW! I used to even like my bacon crispy - now I want it like 1/2 done just so I can chew the fat! Dripping in grease :yum:

I would LOVE any recipes you have - ESPECIALLY prune balls. I am in serious need of prunes! The psyllium just isn't cutting it. I'd been afraid to touch them since they're so sugary, but I think the benefits outweigh the cost at this point. I'll just be careful with my blood sugar accordingly. I haven't had dried fruit in so long, it will be an interesting experiment with the blood glucose meter. I'll call it preparation for the ominous glucose test :p

For that matter, any sample daily menu (if you can remember) would be so helpful! I feel like I'm in a rut already - I want to try to mix it up before I throw everything to the wind & get some french fries. Ohhhh how I want some french fries! Right out of the grease! Alongside my scrambled eggs & bacon! :lol:


Allright - last anecdote: Can I also say that I'm pretty sure bacon and chocolate are one of God's most perfect creations? It's become a really popular combination around here. You can find chocolate bars with bacon bits & chocolate (and maple) glazed doughnuts with bacon sprinkles! The chocolate bars are easy enough to recreate – but OH how I’ve wanted one of those doughnuts! It’s a cruel world. Any ideas on how to make a low carb doughnut?


Love to my ladies!

[kutaylor]

I've just hit that I can eat again point in my pregnancy and you are making me sooooo HUNGRY!!! For last couple of weeks the babe has been high and in my stomach, but now that I can eat I am starving!!!

What I would do for a pound of blueberries right now!

[duchesse]

I've just hit that I can eat again point in my pregnancy and you are making me sooooo HUNGRY!!! For last couple of weeks the babe has been high and in my stomach, but now that I can eat I am starving!!!

What I would do for a pound of blueberries right now!

Wow, you are almost at the end of your journey. :) How exciting! I hope you have a smooth labour and delivery.

When did you hit the point where you couldn't eat? I wonder if I'll experience it too?

maggie

[meghen22]

Okay, I love bacon and chocolate, but I have yet to try them together. I saw on TV just the other day at a festival they were serving chocolate covered bacon. I just can't go there. But, I am not pregnant either. I don't know about a LC donut. Here is a link, but I haven't tried them. They sound pretty good:
http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/breads/r/lowcarbdonuts.htm

I like LC pancakes with sugar-free syrup, too. You make them with egg whites

http://www.genaw.com/lowcarb/pancakes.html
This website has some great recipes!


Oh, and I just wanted to say that I began LC dieting 6 weeks after my daughter was born. She slept through the night from then on. She occasionally gets up to nurse at 4am, but usually sleeps 8-9 hours at night. I do not know if it is the diet or just that she is a really really good baby. They say that if you eat a lot of empty calories, like I did on WW with my last daughter, then your milk is not as filling to the baby and they are fussy because they get hungry more often. I do have to watch what I eat, some things really bother her, like nuts, tea, some raw vegetables and spices.

[fireballgi]

Oh, and I just wanted to say that I began LC dieting 6 weeks after my daughter was born. She slept through the night from then on. She occasionally gets up to nurse at 4am, but usually sleeps 8-9 hours at night. I do not know if it is the diet or just that she is a really really good baby. They say that if you eat a lot of empty calories, like I did on WW with my last daughter, then your milk is not as filling to the baby and they are fussy because they get hungry more often. I do have to watch what I eat, some things really bother her, like nuts, tea, some raw vegetables and spices.

Ahhhh breastfeeding ... this is what I'm most nervous about. With both of my boys, the only way I could produce enough milk was by eating lots of junk. I know this sounds crazy, but I had to eat chocolate chip cookies, fast food, etc. I was working full time and pumping, and I know that pumping is not exactly the same, but my milk supply would dramatically drop off. With the last one, I even went to a breastfeeding clinic at the hospital where they weighed the baby, I fed him, then they weighed him again. He ate 13 ounces. They analyzed my milk to see what percent was carb, protein, fat, etc. Then I went on a "healthy" 2600 calorie eating plan for a week and repeated it at the same time the next week. He didn't gain any weight that week, and he only ate 6 ounces (although the composition of my milk stayed the same). That confirmed my pumping observations, which were that when I cut out the junk, my milk supply dropped :tears: I ended up gaining 25 pounds breastfeeding him.

My only hope for this time is that perhaps I was doing what GCBC and Dr. Eades talks about -- even though there are plenty of calories going in (and hanging on), since there is a problem with my fat metabolism, I'm starving at a cellular level, and therefore my body won't make enough milk. I'm hoping to get steady enough on the LC woe now that I can continue it and have access to my fat stores.

meghen22--when you say that you "started" at 6 weeks, what does that mean? Were you limiting carbs at all before then? How low carb (or what plan) did you start? Did you notice a milk supply problem?

Has anyone else had any problems with LC/milk supply/gaining weight while bfing? (By the way, I was doing all the milk supply increase things--fenugreek (lots of it!), oatmeal, etc.

[I<3splenda]

^I was totally lucky with my DD & lost weigh overnight by breastfeeding. It was magic. Not expecting it to happen again, though!


Today was kind of a carb fiasco! I ate a bunch of potato chips! I have NEVER liked potato chips. We were at the park & I was starving & on the verge of spewage - my daughter's potato chips saved me! The weirdest part was - they were SO delicious!

Que sera... still under 100 carbs... :yum:

[meghen22]

Wow fireball, your breastfeeding experience is interesting. It seems before LC and breastfeeding with my other 4 children, I did keep on about 10 extra pounds and they would not come off. My weight loss is steady now, around 2 pounds a week, I don't want to lose faster than that, but some weeks I do lose about 3-4 pounds.

I lost 32 pounds LC eating-on Atkins and worked into more of a south beach type diet before pregnancy. I ate relatively LC until about 28-30 weeks of pregnancy, then my diet went to high carb-h&** and I was pigging out on everything in site until I was 6 weeks post-partum. I started with just 2 days of Atkins induction because I have a really hard time getting off the sugars if I don't but I slowly added in more healthy carbs. Now I eat about 60-80 carbs/day. Sometimes more but usually never above 100. I eat dairy, whole wheat, oatmeal, and veggies and mostly lean meats. I eat potatoes/sweet potatoes on occasion, but never more than once a day and a very small amount. I only notice that in the beginning of my change of diet, if I didn't eat enough calories then I would not produce as much milk. I have to eat around 1800 calories or it seems to diminish a little bit, and let down doesn't come until she is actually nursing. Usually it comes down before then if I am eating and drinking enough. I think milk and eggs are a big help in milk production and seems to agree well with her. She started out at 7.8 oz and now is 12.5 pounds at 2 months.

It seemed when I was eating more sugar, she was fussy. Even now, she is fussy at times but I can usually pinpoint what it is that is bothering her and eliminate it.

I never have to pump, though. My milk supply might be less if I did. I would think if you keep your fats up then your milk would be fine. I keep my ration 60% fat, 20% carbs and 20% protein. I usually record everything I eat, too.

[tiredangel]

I lost tons of weight breastfeeding for the first year, afterwards my body seemed to adjust (plus, of course, they weren't nursing nearly as much). Supply was never an issue either. The more they nursed, the more I made -- most women I know who had supply issues supplemented because they were concerned about not making enough milk. Though some women genuinely don't make enough milk I'm sure -- that would be hormonal in nature. I would think a low carb diet would promote more milk production, not less, and better quality milk. We'll provide for our babies before ourselves nutritionally, but if our cells are starving, we won't be making good milk anyway.

[mommy-2-3]

Hey Ladies, well i have a question...I am 10 weeks pregnant with baby # 4, My youngest is turning 1 this Saturday.....I have alot of weight still on me from the first 3 and I had Gestational Diabetes with my last pregnancy, and did pretty well the last half of my pregnancy doing low carb, my question is do you think it would be safe doing low carb and not gaining weight through this pregnancy..........Im already 40 -50 pound over weight.

[I<3splenda]

Hey!! Congratulations! That's definitely a question for your doc lady! I would imagine that especially because you had GD so recently they'll want to discuss nutrition with you, or even have you see a RD!

In other news - I put up a new set of my homebirth that features real live birth! So don't pick that album if you don't want to see where life comes from ;)

Edited: http://www.flickr.com/photos/41951551~N00/sets/72057594126693964/


Unedited/nudity: http://www.flickr.com/photos/41951551~N00/sets/72157622159760282/

[ambimorph]

I would think LC would not only be safe, but the best prevention of GD recurring.

[ambimorph]

I<3splenda: I get "bad link" messages with those...

[~centa*of*]

The biggest contributing factor to increasing my milk supply was to increase my fluid intake (especially plain water). I didn't have any trouble with the breastfeeding, but found it very difficult to express milk (with #1). It took over 2 hours to get enough for even half a feed. If I drank 1 cup of water and ate a small box of sultanas, then I was able to pump a couple of bottles in less than 1/2 hour.

This time 'round, I am tandem feeding (my now 2 year old and 6 month old). Having the two of them sucking has definitely made my supply good. (Plus I am eating a lot better and drinking a lot better this time around, which I think helps).

Splenda-I'll scrounge around for some good recipes for you... the prune balls are:

Blend (or mash with a fork) 250g Prunes. Mix in 2teaspoons of Cocoa powder, 2 tablespoons of dessicated coconut and 3 Tablespoons of almond meal until consistent (I find using your hand to kneed it works best). Add 1 cup of chopped nuts (I use pecans, but walnuts have worked well too) and mix in well.
Roll into balls and roll in dessicated coconut.

I sometimes roll the whole thing (or split the batch into 3 and roll each section) into a sausage and then cut pieces off to roll into balls. I usually make them 10g each (sorry not sure of weight conversion) but did some 5g ones for my son's birthday on the weekend just gone and they went down a treat.

[ambimorph]

That's interesting about fluid and milk supply. I had to supplement both my previous times, and I'm not sure if I was mindful of how much I was drinking. I'll pay attention this time around.

[I<3splenda]

I<3splenda: I get "bad link" messages with those...


I know! It's a mysterious lowcarber forum problem - everyone else on the Internet goes through!


So hey everyone! I don't know if anyone is still feeling sickypants, but this link was posted to natural parenting forum I'm on - I thought you'd find it interesting!

After testing the two dominant theories (one adaptive and the other non-adaptive) for why two-thirds of women around the world -- but seemingly no other mammals -- experience nausea and vomiting in pregnancy, only one holds water, says Paul Sherman, Cornell professor of neurobiology and behavior and a Weiss Presidential Fellow.

"Our study, which tested theories and predictions about the nature of parent-offspring conflict in human pregnancy, shows that nausea and vomiting in pregnancy is beneficial by expelling such foods as meat and strong-tasting vegetables that historically and still may contain harmful toxins and microorganisms that could potentially sicken the woman and damage her fetus just when its organs are developing and are most vulnerable to chemicals," said Sherman, who is an expert in Darwinian medicine -- viewing diseases from an evolutionary perspective.

His study, conducted with University of Colorado evolutionary behaviorist Samuel M. Flaxman '98, Ph.D. '05, who worked as a postdoctoral researcher at Cornell from 2005 to 2007, is published in the July issue of The American Naturalist.


http://www.physorg.com/news134143992.html


Centa thank you so much for the prune ball recipe - they sound delicious!! It's kissmet - I just bought prunes yesterday!!! :yum:

[bekkers]

hello all, due at the end of March here with my 3rd. I have to say walnuts have been a handy snack for me, if I can chew a few up without vomiting I feel much better for quite a while. Also, even if it isn't appetizing I snack on fat (salami w/creamcheese, almonds, walnuts, etc...) and feel better after a few minutes as well. I was super fatigued until about a week ago (and much worse nausea than previous pregnancies) but in the last few days of really making an effort to eat more nutritionally dense things I have felt SO much better. I am back to pretty low carb, but not as low as I was last pregnancy (and that baby is very healthy and happy, 16 month old now, btw). I am eating a little bit of potato, or even bread, but not much and it hasn't derailed me like it would if I binged or was not accompanying it with super high fat ratios. The other big difference is I am not overdoing the protein like I was before, I used to consider it a "free" food to eat as much of as I could, but I have changed my thinking on that and now I think adequate protein is important obviously, but FAT is the most important thing. Carbs are kind of just to taste for me.

I'm also showing a lot more than I had hoped for at this point, though I'm sure to most people it still just looks like fat, I am finding it more difficult to wear shirts that don't make me look much much further along than I am. wtf? The tiny baby bump is pushing my pasta/cookie bump out enough to look obviously preggers, sigh.

[ambimorph]

Our study, which tested theories and predictions about the nature of parent-offspring conflict in human pregnancy, shows that nausea and vomiting in pregnancy is beneficial by expelling such foods as meat and strong-tasting vegetables that historically and still may contain harmful toxins and microorganisms that could potentially sicken the woman and damage her fetus just when its organs are developing and are most vulnerable to chemicals," said Sherman, who is an expert in Darwinian medicine -- viewing diseases from an evolutionary perspective.

Thanks for the link, but this makes no sense to me. We evolved on meat. Why would that be the primary suspect? I personally feel sickest when I eat refined sugar or fruit, although avoiding those foods hasn't made me feel well, either.

[bekkers]

I agree that the meat and veggies causing vomiting b/c the "might" be toxic makes no sense, BUT, maybe the constant nausea/heightened sense of smell make you more likely to upchuck something that was slightly off, or just SO picky about what you try to eat that you only get the freshest most appealing nutrient dense foods available.

I also feel worst on carby crap, but, ironically that is the only thing that seems appealing once I am feeling crappy unless I really work hard to focus on something healthy and convince myself otherwise. I would love to know if women who grew up eating hunter gatherer style (and their mothers before them) actually have nausea regularly in their pregnancies or if it is a modern thing from generations of screwing up our genes with grains, etc... I know it is a hormonal thing and obvioulsly they would need the same hormones to carry a baby, but maybe they were not affected the same way. It just doesn't make sense to me evolutionarily speaking.

[spongebutt]

Hi, ladies. I'd love to join you! :D

Just a quick intro:
I gained back 40 lbs in 2 months (yes, two!) after having lost 68 with atkins, never could lose it with anything again (granted, I didn't try atkins again). I did SBD, CAD/CALP, blahblahblah.

Now I'm pregnant with #2 (due 02/21 so I'm almost 16 wks) and am still breastfeeding my 19 month old big boy. I'm thinking of doing LC during this pregnancy. Since I'm 5'1" and started at 168, I figure I can gain about 20 lbs and be alright. I'd prefer not to gain anything but we all know how that is! ;)

I know I'm eating way too much sugar. Last pg I ate anything; I was within 5 points of not passing my GTT. I don't want extra weight gain.
I gained 36 lbs with my son. Granted, I lost all the preggo weight but never lost anything else. Sigh.

So how do you guys handle it? The only things I seem to be craving are dairy and fruit.

[MommaTo3]

Anyone want to refresh this thread with me?
I am 4 weeks 1 day pregnant with baby #4 and am planning on low carbing it as much as I can! I am looking forward to a much healthier pregnancy, labor and delivery than my previous 3!
Anyone else out there still in their 1st trimester?

[bestrange]

hi there! congrats on your pregnancy! I am not pregnant right now, but have a 3 yr old, and will be trying for #2 in August. How are you feeling so far?

[MommaTo3]

I'm feeling pretty good! Its still early, but I'm cramping like usual, and have been having headaches (hormones) and also my lower back has been hurting! Oh, yeah and I started breaking out on my forehead and the left side of my face! Despite all this, I'm SOO excited! I hope you get pregnant in August! Good luck!