PDA

View Full Version : Why Virgin Coconut Oil Is Best


Welcome to the Active Low-Carber Forums

Support for Atkins diet, Protein Power, Neanderthin (Paleo Diet), CAD/CALP, Dr. Bernstein Diabetes Solution and any other healthy low-carb diet or plan, all are welcome in our lowcarb community. Forget starvation and fad diets -- join the healthy eating crowd! You may register by clicking here, it's free!



Taka
Sun, Jan-27-08, 06:16
NewsTarget.com printable article Originally published November
30 2007 The Great Fat Debate - Why Virgin Coconut Oil Is Best
by Teya Skae

(NewsTarget) There is so much media hype from the mainstream
media and leading health authorities, including the
naturopathic community, suggesting the many ill effects of
consuming Trans Fatty Acids (TFA's) that the topic of the
Great Fat Debate deserves a closer look for the sake of our
heath and understanding.

Whilst there is unanimous agreement that TFA's are problematic
and are to be avoided at all costs, some explanations are
confusing at best or misleading at worst. It is time for more
clarity so we can all choose the fats that are good and avoid
those that are bad.

Let's look at some of these warnings:

Rekha Balu, writing for the Wall Street Journal, states that
TFA's are like saturated fats "which raise bad cholesterol,
causing a build-up of fatty deposits in the arteries." That is
incorrect as saturated fats raise both the good and the bad
cholesterol and they do not cause fatty deposits in the
arteries. An under-active thyroid coupled with stress and a
diet high in polyunsaturated oils cause a build-up of fatty
deposits in the arteries.

Lynn Roblin, writing for the Toronto Star, advises consumers
to avoid TFA's by consuming more vegetable oils, such as olive
oil and canola oil, in preference to butter and coconut oil.
Let's remember that vegetable oils such as canola and
safflower are rich in omega-6 fatty acids which have now been
proven to cause oxidation of our cells. This reaction leads to
inflammation which in turn promotes degenerative conditions
and premature aging.

Harvard nutritionist Frank Hu, featured in an article for the
Washington Post, says butter is better than margarine, but tub
or liquid margarine made from commercial vegetable oils is "a
more healthful choice than butter." What Mr. Hu is promoting
is the omega-6 fatty acids which have been hydrogenated and
these are technically TFA's. Quite confusing indeed!

Why is there so much confusion amongst health authorities in
relation to fats?

This is because in 1961, the American Heart Association
published its first dietary guidelines aimed at the public.
The authors, Dr. Ancel Keys, Irving Page, Jeremiah Stamler and
Frederick Stare, called for the substitution of
polyunsaturated oils for saturated fat. This was put forth
even though Keys, Stare and Page had all previously noted in
their published papers that the increase in Heart Disease was
due to increasing consumption of vegetable oils. The 1961
report did not publish this fact, even after a 1956 paper by
Dr. Keys suggested that the increasing use of partially
hydrogenated vegetable oils (which is what TFA's technically
are) is one of the culprits in the heart disease epidemic.

Why was Dr. Keys report ignored?

For obvious economic reasons the vegetable oil industry then
squashed the reports on the dangers of vegetable oils and
stealthily began their phony attack on making saturated fats -
meat, eggs, cheese, butter and coconut oil responsible for
heart disease.

In actuality, saturated fats are shown to help in preventing
heart disease. If we examine the health statistics along with
the research on saturated fats consumption from the nations
that consume large amounts of saturated fats in their diet, we
find that they are among the healthiest nations
/tribes/cultures in the world. Herein lies the big 'fat'
confusion.

Let's look closer at the FAT debate:

TFA's are typically found in processed foods such as cookies,
margarine, fried foods, fried potatoes, potato chips,
crackers, breaded chicken, and fast food. McDonald's has
admitted its french fries contain a third more TFA's than they
had thought. In New York City, there are hefty fines imposed
upon restaurants if they are not compliant with avoiding TFA's
in their cooking; this ordinance took effect as of July 2007.

Polyunsaturated Fats Defined

Polyunsaturated oils are liquid at room temperature.
Polyunsaturated fats such as Safflower, Corn, Sunflower,
Soybean and Cottonseed Oils all contain over 50% omega-6 fatty
acids. Safflower oil contains almost 80% omega-6. Researchers
have now discovered there are dangers in consuming more of
omega-6 oils in our diet then we need. The ideal ratio of
omega-6 to omega-3 (the essential fatty acid) is 1:1. This is
easily achieved if one avoids the use of vegetable oils as
omega-6 is far more abundant in our diet then omega-3
essential fatty acids, which is found in cold water fish -
salmon, sardines and mackerel.

TFA's Defined

In order to have polyunsaturated fats last longer and make
them look more appealing, food manufacturers use a process
called "hydrogenation". Hydrogenation is a process that takes
unsaturated liquid fat (usually some kind of vegetable oil)
and adds hydrogen. The result is a TFA.

During hydrogenation, oil is heated to an extremely high
temperature; this causes the oil to rapidly oxidize and create
free-radicals. In basic chemistry 101, free radicals cause
prolific cell damage and is responsible for premature aging.

Even using the so called "healthiest" organic vegetable oils,
which includes olive oil, in baking and frying creates free
radicals. This is because all vegetable oils oxidize;
especially when used in cooking. They not only produce TFA's
but form free radicals - lethal combination for our bodies.
The only oil that does not oxidize, even at 170 degree
Celsius, is Organic Virgin Coconut oil which is a saturated
fat. Amazing!

Avoiding TFA's at all costs is a must according to the WHO
(World Health Organization). This is because TFA's are
injurious to the heart and have been linked to cancer,
atherosclerosis, diabetes, obesity, immune system dysfunction,
birth defects, difficulty in lactation, and problems with
bones and tendons. So we want to exclude them from our diet,
yet it is difficult when some of the most tempting foods such
as commercial cakes, biscuits, chocolates, and potato chips
are laden with TFA's.

Why Saturated fats are not TFA's

TFA's have similar properties to saturated fatty acids when
used in baked goods, but the claim that TFA's are like
saturated fatty acids is incorrect in view of their molecular
bonding/structure and their biological effect in our bodies.
This is the area that has been mostly ignored by mainstream
media and even among the naturopathic community according to
lipid and nutritional expert Dr. Mary G. Enig. Enig campaigned
against TFA's back in the late 1970's after completing her
most extensive research on the analysis of all fats. For more
extensive information, see Mary G. Enig's PhD Nourishing
Traditions: The Cookbook that Challenges Politically Correct
Nutrition (www.newtrendspublishing.com)

So which oils do we use now? A good option is Organic Virgin
Coconut oil. This is a saturated fat that is unlike any other
fat and truly deserves a classification of its own. With all
the research and studies on saturated fats to date, health
authorities still group TFA's with healthy saturated fats like
coconut oil. Coconut oil is not only the healthiest saturated
fat but is one of the healthiest foods we can consume on a
daily basis. Let's examine the most misunderstood fat that is
actually a super food.

Why is Coconut oil unique and unlike any other fat?

Coconut oil is made up of medium-chain fatty acids (MCFA's).
Two- thirds of the saturated fat in coconut oil is a
medium-chain saturated fat. This important fact deserves
clarification as MCFA's actually helps us to lose weight,
lower cholesterol, improve diabetic conditions and reduce the
risk of heart disease.

One of the most outstanding benefits of consuming MCFA's is
that they do not require the liver and gallbladder to digest
and emulsify them. This means instant energy and increased
thermogenesis (increased metabolic rate in the body) which
leads to more heat production as well as improved circulation.
For anyone with impaired fat digestion or a removed
gallbladder, coconut oil is the only oil to consume as it is
very easily digested. MCFA's are also known for having
antimicrobial and anti-fungal properties, so they are
beneficial to our immune system. In addition, coconut oil
assists people with under-active thyroids by increasing the
metabolic rate of the body and creating more energy.

Ray Peat Ph.D., a physiologist who has worked with
progesterone and related hormones since 1968, says that the
sudden surge of polyunsaturated oils in the food chain post
World War II has caused many changes in hormones. He writes:

Their [polyunsaturated oils] best understood effect is their
interference with the function of the thyroid gland.
Polyunsaturated oils block thyroid hormone secretion, its
movement in the circulatory system, and the response of
tissues to the hormone. When the thyroid hormone is deficient,
the body is generally exposed to increased levels of
oestrogen. The thyroid hormone is essential for making the
'protective hormones' progesterone and pregnenolone, so these
hormones are lowered when anything interferes with the
function of the thyroid. The thyroid hormone is required for
using and eliminating cholesterol, so cholesterol is likely to
be raised by anything that blocks the thyroid function ( [link
to www.efn.org] It is very interesting to note that high
cholesterol is not a sign of eating too much saturated fat.
High cholesterol in a lot of the cases is due to an
under-active thyroid which affects the liver as well as the
many loops and feedback systems within the endocrine system.
Stress and the over consumption of carbohydrates/sugars also
form high levels of cholesterol.

What are saturated fats and why do we need them?

Saturated fats are semi solid at room temperature and are
found in animal products such as meat, poultry, lard, poultry
skin, whole milk, cheese, eggs, butter and tropical oils such
as coconut and palm oil.

Our body actually needs saturated fats to stay healthy. Why?

1) Saturated fats constitute at least 50% of our cell's
membranes - the phospholipid component of every cell.
Saturated fatty acids are what gives our cells
structural integrity, so the cell walls are not weak and
can protect the inside of the cells.

2) Saturated fatty acids play a vital role in the health of
our bones. For calcium to be effectively utilized by the
bones, at least 50% of the dietary fats should be
saturated.

3) Saturated fatty acids actually lower Lipoprotein (a),
a substance in the blood that leads to heart disease,
whereas excess consumption of vegetable oils
increases it.

4) Saturated fatty acids protect the liver from alcohol and
other toxins, including Tylenol, a pain reliever.

5) Saturated fatty acids are needed for the proper
utilization of omega-3 essential fatty acids because
omega-3's are better retained in the tissues when the
diet is rich in saturated fats (particularly organic
virgin coconut oil)

6) Saturated stearic acid found in beef and cocoa, and
palmitic acid found in coconut oil are the preferred
foods for the heart; which is why the fat around the
heart muscle is highly saturated. The heart draws on
this reserve of fat in times of stress.

7) Saturated fatty acids such as caprylic acid found
abundantly in coconut oil, is anti fungal and helps
combat candida (yeast overgrowth that is common in
our society).

8) While saturated fats raise both the bad and the good
cholesterol, TFA's as well as excess consumption of
omega-6 fatty acids raise the bad Low Density
Lipo-protein (LDL) and suppress the good High Density
Lipo-protein (HDL) cholesterol, making it even worse.

In conclusion, avoiding TFA's is a must. There are no
tolerance levels. They are serious culprits of degenerative
conditions disguised in some of the most tempting foods to
date. Avoiding over consumption of polyunsaturated oils
(omega-6 fatty acids) such as flax oil and completely avoiding
corn, soy, safflower and canola is a great start, as
polyunsaturated oils have been shown to contribute to heart
disease, inflammation, under-active thyroid and weight gain.

Use virgin organic coconut oil. I stress the importance of
using only virgin organic coconut oil because the refined
version of coconut oil no longer has the same structure and
same health benefits as the virgin organic coconut oil. In
fact, consuming plain coconut oil can even give someone a
headache or nausea.

The food manufacturers will not willingly return to using
naturally saturated fats such as coconut oil, palm oil,
butter and lard because they are more expensive. Only a
concerted demand by educated consumers will bring traditional
healthy fats back into our commercial food supply and
restaurant cooking.

Using organic coconut oil in all cooking and baking is the
best choice for a healthy alternative. Because virgin coconut
oil is completely saturated and no TFA's can be made from it,
it is therefore harmless. In addition, it does not oxidize,
even at 170 degrees Celsius.

Virgin Coconut oil is the fat of fats as it also helps us burn
body fat for energy because of its unique molecular structure
of medium chain fatty acids. So do enjoy eating more organic
virgin coconut oil, drinking organic coconut milk/cr=E8me in
your teas as well as pouring it over your porridge and
munching on macaroons made from organic cocoa and desiccated
organic coconut for health and longevity.

References

Keys, A., "Diet and Development of Coronary Heart
Disease", J. Chron.
Dis. 4(4):364-380, October 1956 Rekha Balu, "Trans Fat: Taste
Buds Cry 'Yes!' but Arteries Demur," The Wall Street
Journal, June 8, 1998 Lynn Roblin, "Not all fats are
created equal," The Toronto Star Health Talk, June 24,
1998 Fred Tasker, "A Churning Controversy," The
Washington Post Health, June 2, 1997 Mary G. Enig PhD.
Know Your Fats: The Complete Primer for Understanding the
Nutrition of Fats, Oils and Cholesterol(Bethesda Press
2000) Sally Fallon and Mary G. Enig, PhD Nourishing
Traditions: The Cookbook that Challenges Politically
Correct Nutrition and the Diet Dictocrats (NewTrends
Publishing 2000, www.newtrendspublishing.com www.mercola-
.com/2006/dec/26/the-health-harming-confusion-a bout-
saturated-fats.htm The Healing Miracles of Coconut Oil,
by Bruce Fife (Piccadilly Books,
2001). Eat Fat Look Thin by Bruce Fife (Piccadilly
Books, 2002).

About the author Teya Skae M.A., B.A.,Dip Health Sciences, Dip
Clinical Nutrition Kinesiologist/Nutritionist/Writer
Health/Life Coach and Educator Teya is the founder of
Empowered Living www.empowered-living.com.au specialising in
Metabolic Typing Nutrition and Results Fat Loss. Teya writes
article for various publications and runs courses in health
and human potential.

Mr. Natura
Sun, Jan-27-08, 17:16
Extra Virgin Olive Oil Is Best

Just thought that you might want to know. :)

Zzzxtreme@
Wed, Jan-30-08, 06:15
what other oils are comparable to virgin coconut oil? i can't
use it to cook everyday, the taste is "boring"

On Jan 27, 11:31=A0am, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
> NewsTarget.com printable article Originally published
> November 30 2007 The Great Fat Debate - Why Virgin Coconut
> Oil Is Best by Teya Skae
>
> (NewsTarget) There is so much media hype from the mainstream
> media and leading health authorities, including the
> naturopathic community, suggesting the many ill effects of
> consuming Trans Fatty Acids (TFA's) that the topic of the
> Great Fat Debate deserves a closer look for the sake of our
> heath and understanding.
>
> Whilst there is unanimous agreement that TFA's are
> problematic and are to be avoided at all costs, some
> explanations are confusing at best or misleading at worst.
> It is time for more clarity so we can all choose the fats
> that are good and avoid those that are bad.
>
> Let's look at some of these warnings:
>
> Rekha Balu, writing for the Wall Street Journal, states that
> TFA's are like saturated fats "which raise bad cholesterol,
> causing a build-up of fatty deposits in the arteries." That
> is incorrect as saturated fats raise both the good and the
> bad cholesterol and they do not cause fatty deposits in the
> arteries. An under-active thyroid coupled with stress and a
> diet high in polyunsaturated oils cause a build-up of fatty
> deposits in the arteries.
>
> Lynn Roblin, writing for the Toronto Star, advises consumers
> to avoid TFA's by consuming more vegetable oils, such as
> olive oil and canola oil, in preference to butter and
> coconut oil. Let's remember that vegetable oils such as
> canola and safflower are rich in omega-6 fatty acids which
> have now been proven to cause oxidation of our cells. This
> reaction leads to inflammation which in turn promotes
> degenerative conditions and premature aging.
>
> Harvard nutritionist Frank Hu, featured in an article for
> the Washington Post, says butter is better than margarine,
> but tub or liquid margarine made from commercial vegetable
> oils is "a more healthful choice than butter." What Mr. Hu
> is promoting is the omega-6 fatty acids which have been
> hydrogenated and these are technically TFA's. Quite
> confusing indeed!
>
> Why is there so much confusion amongst health authorities in
> relation to fats?
>
> This is because in 1961, the American Heart Association
> published its first dietary guidelines aimed at the public.
> The authors, Dr. Ancel Keys, Irving Page, Jeremiah Stamler
> and Frederick Stare, called for the substitution of
> polyunsaturated oils for saturated fat. This was put forth
> even though Keys, Stare and Page had all previously noted in
> their published papers that the increase in Heart Disease
> was due to increasing consumption of vegetable oils. The
> 1961 report did not publish this fact, even after a 1956
> paper by Dr. Keys suggested that the increasing use of
> partially hydrogenated vegetable oils (which is what TFA's
> technically are) is one of the culprits in the heart disease
> epidemic.
>
> Why was Dr. Keys report ignored?
>
> For obvious economic reasons the vegetable oil industry then
> squashed the reports on the dangers of vegetable oils and
> stealthily began their phony attack on making saturated fats
> - meat, eggs, cheese, butter and coconut oil responsible for
> heart disease.
>
> In actuality, saturated fats are shown to help in preventing
> heart disease. If we examine the health statistics along
> with the research on saturated fats consumption from the
> nations that consume large amounts of saturated fats in
> their diet, we find that they are among the healthiest
> nations /tribes/cultures in the world. Herein lies the big
> 'fat' confusion.
>
> Let's look closer at the FAT debate:
>
> TFA's are typically found in processed foods such as
> cookies, margarine, fried foods, fried potatoes, potato
> chips, crackers, breaded chicken, and fast food. McDonald's
> has admitted its french fries contain a third more TFA's
> than they had thought. In New York City, there are hefty
> fines imposed upon restaurants if they are not compliant
> with avoiding TFA's in their cooking; this ordinance took
> effect as of July 2007.
>
> Polyunsaturated Fats Defined
>
> Polyunsaturated oils are liquid at room temperature.
> Polyunsaturated fats such as Safflower, Corn, Sunflower,
> Soybean and Cottonseed Oils all contain over 50% omega-6
> fatty acids. Safflower oil contains almost 80% omega-6.
> Researchers have now discovered there are dangers in
> consuming more of omega-6 oils in our diet then we need. The
> ideal ratio of omega-6 to omega-3 (the essential fatty acid)
> is 1:1. This is easily achieved if one avoids the use of
> vegetable oils as omega-6 is far more abundant in our diet
> then omega-3 essential fatty acids, which is found in cold
> water fish - salmon, sardines and mackerel.
>
> TFA's Defined
>
> In order to have polyunsaturated fats last longer and make
> them look more appealing, food manufacturers use a process
> called "hydrogenation". Hydrogenation is a process that
> takes unsaturated liquid fat (usually some kind of vegetable
> oil) and adds hydrogen. The result is a TFA.
>
> During hydrogenation, oil is heated to an extremely high
> temperature; this causes the oil to rapidly oxidize and
> create free-radicals. In basic chemistry 101, free
> radicals cause prolific cell damage and is responsible for
> premature aging.
>
> Even using the so called "healthiest" organic vegetable
> oils, which includes olive oil, in baking and frying creates
> free radicals. This is because all vegetable oils oxidize;
> especially when used in cooking. They not only produce TFA's
> but form free radicals - lethal combination for our bodies.
> The only oil that does not oxidize, even at 170 degree
> Celsius, is Organic Virgin Coconut oil which is a saturated
> fat. Amazing!
>
> Avoiding TFA's at all costs is a must according to the WHO
> (World Health Organization). This is because TFA's are
> injurious to the heart and have been linked to cancer,
> atherosclerosis, diabetes, obesity, immune system
> dysfunction, birth defects, difficulty in lactation, and
> problems with bones and tendons. So we want to exclude them
> from our diet, yet it is difficult when some of the most
> tempting foods such as commercial cakes, biscuits,
> chocolates, and potato chips are laden with TFA's.
>
> Why Saturated fats are not TFA's
>
> TFA's have similar properties to saturated fatty acids when
> used in baked goods, but the claim that TFA's are like
> saturated fatty acids is incorrect in view of their
> molecular bonding/structure and their biological effect in
> our bodies. This is the area that has been mostly ignored by
> mainstream media and even among the naturopathic community
> according to lipid and nutritional expert Dr. Mary G. Enig.
> Enig campaigned against TFA's back in the late 1970's after
> completing her most extensive research on the analysis of
> all fats. For more extensive information, see Mary G. Enig's
> PhD Nourishing Traditions: The Cookbook that Challenges
> Politically Correct Nutrition (www.newtrendspublishing.com)
>
> So which oils do we use now? A good option is Organic Virgin
> Coconut oil. This is a saturated fat that is unlike any
> other fat and truly deserves a classification of its own.
> With all the research and studies on saturated fats to date,
> health authorities still group TFA's with healthy saturated
> fats like coconut oil. Coconut oil is not only the
> healthiest saturated fat but is one of the healthiest foods
> we can consume on a daily basis. Let's examine the most
> misunderstood fat that is actually a super food.
>
> Why is Coconut oil unique and unlike any other fat?
>
> Coconut oil is made up of medium-chain fatty acids (MCFA's).
> Two- thirds of the saturated fat in coconut oil is a
> medium-chain saturated fat. This important fact deserves
> clarification as MCFA's actually helps us to lose weight,
> lower cholesterol, improve diabetic conditions and reduce
> the risk of heart disease.
>
> One of the most outstanding benefits of consuming MCFA's is
> that they do not require the liver and gallbladder to digest
> and emulsify them. This means instant energy and increased
> thermogenesis (increased metabolic rate in the body) which
> leads to more heat production as well as improved
> circulation. For anyone with impaired fat digestion or a
> removed gallbladder, coconut oil is the only oil to consume
> as it is very easily digested. MCFA's are also known for
> having antimicrobial and anti-fungal properties, so they are
> beneficial to our immune system. In addition, coconut oil
> assists people with under-active thyroids by increasing the
> metabolic rate of the body and creating more energy.
>
> Ray Peat Ph.D., a physiologist who has worked with
> progesterone and related hormones since 1968, says that the
> sudden surge of polyunsaturated oils in the food chain post
> World War II has caused many changes in hormones. He writes:
>
> Their [polyunsaturated oils] best understood effect is their
> interference with the function of the thyroid gland.
> Polyunsaturated oils block thyroid hormone secretion, its
> movement in the circulatory system, and the response of
> tissues to the hormone. When the thyroid hormone is
> deficient, the body is generally exposed to increased levels
> of oestrogen. The thyroid hormone is essential for making
> the 'protective hormones' progesterone and pregnenolone, so
> these hormones are lowered when anything interferes with the
> function of the thyroid. The thyroid hormone is required for
> using and eliminating cholesterol, so cholesterol is likely
> to be raised by anything that blocks the thyroid function (
> [link towww.efn.org] It is very interesting to note that
> high cholesterol is not a sign of eating too much saturated
> fat. High cholesterol in a lot of the cases is due to an
> under-active thyroid which affects the liver as well as the
> many loops and feedback systems within the endocrine system.
> Stress and the over consumption of carbohydrates/sugars also
> form high levels of cholesterol.
>
> What are saturated fats and why do we need them?
>
> Saturated fats are semi solid at room temperature and are
> found in animal products such as meat, poultry, lard,
> poultry skin, whole milk, cheese, eggs, butter and tropical
> oils such as coconut and palm oil.
>
> Our body actually needs saturated fats to stay healthy. Why?
>
> 1) Saturated fats ...
>
> read more =BB

Ron Peters
Wed, Jan-30-08, 17:16
On Jan 29, 9:45=A0pm, "zzzxtr...@gmail.com"
<zzzxtr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> what other oils are comparable to virgin coconut oil? i
> can't use it to cook everyday, the taste is "boring"

Palm oil and palm kernel oil are the other two tropical oils
that contain a high percentage of saturated fatty acids and
are widely used for candies, cookies, and chocolate coatings.
Most health experts warn against tropical oils as not being
heart healthy.

--
Ron

Ron Peters
Wed, Jan-30-08, 17:16
On Jan 30, 11:34=A0am, Pramesh Rutaji
<p297tongue6...@newsguy.com> wrote:

> Yea, and don't cross the path of black cat either. =A0Most
> health experts have been brainwashed that fats are bad for
> you and that low fat diets are good for you.

Most experts know that there is a difference in the effects
of different types of fatty acids and your argument that
some diet gurus didn't make the distinction doesn't mean
that substituting saturated fatty acids for carbohydrates
is healthy.

Dean Ornish, a low carb advocate, stated in a talk show that
omega 3 fatty acids are healthy.

--
Ron

Pramesh Ru
Wed, Jan-30-08, 17:16
Ron Peterson wrote:
> On Jan 29, 9:45 pm, "zzzxtr...@gmail.com"
> <zzzxtr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> what other oils are comparable to virgin coconut oil? i
>> can't use it to cook everyday, the taste is "boring"
>
> Palm oil and palm kernel oil are the other two tropical oils
> that contain a high percentage of saturated fatty acids and
> are widely used for candies, cookies, and chocolate
> coatings. Most health experts warn against tropical oils as
> not being heart healthy.
>
> --
> Ron
>

Yea, and don't cross the path of black cat either. Most health
experts have been brainwashed that fats are bad for you and
that low fat diets are good for you.

--

Pramesh Rutaji

p297tongue6221@newsguy.com - remove tongue to reply

Pramesh Ru
Thu, Jan-31-08, 06:15
Ron Peterson wrote:
> On Jan 30, 11:34 am, Pramesh Rutaji
> <p297tongue6...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>
>> Yea, and don't cross the path of black cat either. Most
>> health experts have been brainwashed that fats are bad for
>> you and that low fat diets are good for you.
>
> Most experts know that there is a difference in the effects
> of different types of fatty acids and your argument that
> some diet gurus didn't make the distinction doesn't mean
> that substituting saturated fatty acids for carbohydrates is
> healthy.
>
> Dean Ornish, a low carb advocate, stated in a talk show that
> omega 3 fatty acids are healthy.
>
> --
> Ron
>

I've read Dean Ornish and have found him to be misinformed
generally on the subject of fat and diet. For one third of the
people on his recommended low fat diet, their LDL will
decrease in size, a very bad thing. The only upside to his low
fat diet was the decrease in trans-fats which was a side
effect that he was clueless about.

A better look at the research has been done by Gary Taubes in
"Good Calories Bad Calories".

Dean Ornish doesn't strike me as a "low carb advocate" as he
was not too fond of meat. Perhaps he has changed his stripes
in the past year or two. Saturated fat has it's place in good
health. I take the paleo diet generally as my guide in these
matters and when modern "experts" deviate far from paleo, they
are moving in an unhealthy direction.

I no longer find Dean Ornish credible since his ego is
committed to a course of action that has clearly been
found lacking.

--

Pramesh Rutaji

p297tongue6221@newsguy.com - remove tongue to reply

allr1
Thu, Jan-31-08, 17:16
taka0038@gmail.com (Taka) wrote:

" For obvious economic reasons the vegetable oil industry then
squashed the reports on the dangers of vegetable oils and
stealthily began their phony attack on making saturated fats -
meat, eggs, cheese, butter and coconut oil responsible for
heart disease.

In actuality, saturated fats are shown to help in preventing
heart disease. If we examine the health statistics along with
the research on saturated fats consumption from the nations
that consume large amounts of saturated fats in their diet, we
find that they are among the healthiest nations
/tribes/cultures in the world. Herein lies the big 'fat'
confusion. "

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Economic reasons are why most 'studies' are nothing more than
corporate propaganda.

Btw, I've found that Coconut Oil is pro-inflammatory, for me
at least. (may be from an indirect effect)

Pramesh Ru
Sun, Feb-10-08, 06:15
Ron Peterson wrote:
> On Jan 30, 7:02 pm, Pramesh Rutaji
> <p297tongue6...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>> Ron Peterson wrote:
>
>>> Dean Ornish, a low carb advocate, stated in a talk show
>>> that omega 3 fatty acids are healthy.
>
>> I've read Dean Ornish and have found him to be misinformed
>> generally on the subject of fat and diet. For one third of
>> the people on his recommended low fat diet, their LDL will
>> decrease in size, a very bad thing. The only upside to his
>> low fat diet was the decrease in trans-fats which was a
>> side effect that he was clueless about.
>
> AFIK, Ornish's diet does get good results. Did you read
> something indicating that people on his diet had the wrong
> type of LDL cholesterol?

As you lower fat consumption, about 1/3 of people, perhaps
more, tend to end up with lower LDL particle size leading
towards faster cardiovascular disease progression. Trans-fats
also lower particle size. So Ornish by cutting fat generally
got the benefit of LDL particle size increases from lowering
trans-fat consumption while getting the negative of lowering
LDL particle size by cutting other healthy fats. There was a
general win there but not because of the low-fat diet. Cutting
trans fats AND maintaining fat consumption would have
generated much better results. (I find that polyunsaturated
fats - PUFAs - are best avoided and that mono and saturated
fats are preferred, but thats another discussion.)

Effect of a low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diet program compared
to a low-fat diet on fasting lipoprotein subclasses. Westman
EC, Yancy WS Jr, Olsen MK, Dudley T, Guyton JR.

Department of Medicine, Duke University Medical Center,
Durham, NC 27705, USA. ewestman@duke.edu

BACKGROUND: Low-carbohydrate, ketogenic diets (LCKD) are
effective for weight loss, but concerns remain regarding
cardiovascular risk. The purpose of this study was to
determine the effect of an LCKD program on serum lipoprotein
subclasses. METHODS: This was a randomized, two-arm clinical
trial in an outpatient research clinic involving overweight,
hyperlipidemic community volunteers motivated to lose weight.
Subjects were randomized to either an LCKD (n = 59) and
nutritional supplementation (including fish, borage and
flaxseed oil), or a low-fat, reduced-calorie diet (LFD, n =
60). The main outcomes were fasting serum lipoprotein
subclasses determined by nuclear magnetic resonance analysis.
RESULTS: The mean age of subjects was 44.9 years, the mean BMI
was 34.4 kg/m(2), and 76% were women. Comparing baseline to 6
months, the LCKD group had significant changes in large VLDL
(-78%), medium VLDL (-60%), small VLDL (-57%), LDL particle
size (+2%), large LDL (+54%), medium LDL (-42%), small LDL
(-78%), HDL particle size (+5%), large HDL (+21%), and LDL
particle concentration (-11%). Compared with the LFD group,
the LCKD group had greater reductions in medium VLDL (p =
0.01), small VLDL (p = 0.01) and medium LDL (p = 0.02), and
greater increases in VLDL particle size (p = 0.01), large LDL
(p = 0.004), and HDL particle size (p = 0.05). CONCLUSIONS:
The LCKD with nutritional supplementation led to beneficial
changes in serum lipid subclasses during weight loss. While
the LCKD did not lower total LDL cholesterol, it did result in
a shift from small, dense LDL to large, buoyant LDL, which
could lower cardiovascular disease risk.

Low-density-lipoprotein subclasses and response to a low-fat
diet in healthy men. Krauss RM, Dreon DM.

Donner Laboratory, Lawrence Berkeley Laboratory, University of
California, Berkeley 94720, USA.

Lipid and lipoprotein responses to reduced dietary fat intake
were investigated in relation to differences in distribution
of low-density-lipoprotein (LDL) subclasses among 105 healthy
men consuming high-fat (46% fat) and low-fat (24% fat) diets
in random order for 6 wk each. With high-fat diets, 87
subjects had predominantly large, buoyant LDL (pattern A),
whereas the remainder had primarily smaller, denser LDL
(pattern B). With low-fat diets, 36 men changed from pattern A
to B. Compared with the 51 men with pattern A with both diets
(stable A group), men in the stable B group (n = 18) had
significantly greater reductions in plasma LDL cholesterol,
apolipoprotein B, and mass of mid-sized (LDL II) and small
(LDL III) LDL subfractions. In both the stable A and change
groups, there was a shift in LDL particle mass from larger,
lipid-enriched (LDL I and II) to smaller, lipid-depleted (LDL
III and IV) subfractions, suggestive of change in LDL
composition with minimal change in particle number, and
consistent with the observation of reduced plasma LDL
cholesterol without reduced apolipoprotein B. Stable B
subjects had significantly greater increases in the largest
very-low-density-lipoprotein subfraction with the low-fat diet
than the stable A group, and also had greater decreases in the
high-density-lipoprotein (HDL) subclass HDL3 but smaller
reductions in HDL2. Genetic and environmental factors
influencing LDL subclass distributions thus may also
contribute substantially to interindividual variation in
plasma lipoprotein response to a low-fat diet.

PMID: 7625363 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

> Ornish now seems to be aware of the harmful effects of
> trans fats.

Perhaps now but I've never read where he factored that into
his "low fat" vegetarian style diet as the source of the
benefit he obtained. I'm still convinced from the mounds of
research abstracts I've read over the years that ornish was
lucky simply because he cut trans-fats and that greater
benefits would have come from merely eliminating trans-fats,
not cutting fat or meat (and getting fat from other than
PUFA sources).

>> A better look at the research has been done by Gary Taubes
>> in "Good Calories Bad Calories".
>
> Taubes strikes me as not having the expertise that is needed
> for good dietary advice.

I highly recommend his new book. It is rare to find a negative
review. He covers the material well and gives a very
comprehensive look at diet from a different perspective,
particular processed carbs (errantly recommend by the "food
pyramid") and fat (denigrate generally by most
lets-just-follow-the-crowd "experts").

>> Dean Ornish doesn't strike me as a "low carb advocate" as
>> he was not too fond of meat. Perhaps he has changed his
>> stripes in the past year or two. Saturated fat has it's
>> place in good health. I take the paleo diet generally as my
>> guide in these matters and when modern "experts" deviate
>> far from paleo, they are moving in an unhealthy direction.
>
> Ornish isn't a low carb advocate since he seems to have a
> vegetarian agenda. He doesn't think that fish should be in
> the diet and that the only source of omega 3 fatty acids
> should come from plants (ALA).

Someone, I thought it was you, called him a "low carb
advocate".

> Has there been any study showing that saturated fats are
> essential for good health, after all, the body can
> synthesize them.

Again, I'm inclined towards a paleo diet where saturated fats
would have been part of a regular diet although perhaps less,
perhaps perhaps, than we eat today. Paleo man would have been
inclined to eat bone marrow, brain, other fatty bits, and
other sources of fat when possible.

> --
> Ron

--

Pramesh Rutaji

p297tongue6221@newsguy.com - remove tongue to reply

Ron Peters
Mon, Feb-11-08, 06:15
On Feb 10, 1:46=A0am, Pramesh Rutaji
<p297tongue6...@newsguy.com> wrote:

> Again, I'm inclined towards a paleo diet where saturated
> fats would have been part of a regular diet although perhaps
> less, perhaps perhaps, than we eat today. =A0Paleo man would
> have been inclined to eat bone marrow, brain, =A0other fatty
> bits, and other sources of fat when possible.

Saturated fat wasn't part of the Paleo diet. The only animals
that are high in saturated fat are the ruminants (e.g cattle,
sheep) which weren't main sources of meat back until they were
domesticated. Most wild animals are very lean as is fish.

Brain has a very high concentration of omega 3 fatty acids
which counters any saturated fat intake.

--
Ron

Taka
Tue, Feb-12-08, 06:15
On Feb 11, 12:57 pm, Ron Peterson <r...@shell.core.com> wrote:
> On Feb 10, 1:46 am, Pramesh Rutaji
> <p297tongue6...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>
> > Again, I'm inclined towards a paleo diet where saturated
> > fats would have been part of a regular diet although
> > perhaps less, perhaps perhaps, than we eat today. Paleo
> > man would have been inclined to eat bone marrow, brain,
> > other fatty bits, and other sources of fat when possible.
>
> Saturated fat wasn't part of the Paleo diet. The only
> animals that are high in saturated fat are the ruminants
> (e.g cattle, sheep) which weren't main sources of meat back
> until they were domesticated. Most wild animals are very
> lean as is fish.
>
> Brain has a very high concentration of omega 3 fatty acids
> which counters any saturated fat intake.
>
> --
> Ron

Are you saying that the Mammoths were full of Omega-3s? Or are
you the advocate of the "human brain developed because of fish
diet" or the aquatic apes evolutionary theory? Never saw
monkeys eating fish ...

Taka

Ron Peters
Tue, Feb-12-08, 06:15
On Feb 11, 7:14=A0pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Are you saying that the Mammoths were full of Omega-3s?
> =A0Or are you the advocate of the "human brain developed
> because of fish diet" or the aquatic apes evolutionary
> theory? =A0Never saw monkeys eating fish ...

I don't think that mammoths supplied most of the nutrients in
any human population. The meat intake was probably from
smaller animals.

On the other hand, mammoths were probably similar to elephants
in being non-ruminants having lower concentrations of
saturated fat. In the case of elephants,
http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/abstract/7=
6500785/ABSTRACT shows high content of omega 3 fatty acids.

http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/99legacy/5-18-199-
9.html says: "This information suggests that, for their size,
many wild primates routinely ingest greater amounts of many
minerals, vitamins, essential fatty acids, dietary fiber and
other important dietary constituents than most modern human
populations," Milton will report in the June issue of the
journal "Nutrition: The International Journal of Basic and
Applied Nutritional Sciences."

--
Ron

Mattlb
Tue, Feb-12-08, 17:16
On Feb 12, 1:14 am, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Feb 11, 12:57 pm, Ron Peterson
> <r...@shell.core.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Feb 10, 1:46 am, Pramesh Rutaji
> > <p297tongue6...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>
> > > Again, I'm inclined towards a paleo diet where saturated
> > > fats would have been part of a regular diet although
> > > perhaps less, perhaps perhaps, than we eat today. Paleo
> > > man would have been inclined to eat bone marrow, brain,
> > > other fatty bits, and other sources of fat when
> > > possible.
>
> > Saturated fat wasn't part of the Paleo diet. The only
> > animals that are high in saturated fat are the ruminants
> > (e.g cattle, sheep) which weren't main sources of meat
> > back until they were domesticated. Most wild animals are
> > very lean as is fish.
>
> > Brain has a very high concentration of omega 3 fatty acids
> > which counters any saturated fat intake.
>
> > --
> > Ron
>
> Are you saying that the Mammoths were full of Omega-3s? Or
> are you the advocate of the "human brain developed because
> of fish diet" or the aquatic apes evolutionary theory? Never
> saw monkeys eating fish ...

Never heard of the Crab-eating Macaque then? It's a general
omnivore so doesn't live exclusively on fish/shellfish, but
does eat them. It can also swim apparently.

MattLB

Taka
Wed, Feb-13-08, 06:15
On Feb 12, 2:33 pm, Ron Peterson <r...@shell.core.com> wrote:
> On Feb 11, 7:14 pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Are you saying that the Mammoths were full of Omega-3s? Or
> > are you the advocate of the "human brain developed because
> > of fish diet" or the aquatic apes evolutionary theory?
> > Never saw monkeys eating fish ...
>
> I don't think that mammoths supplied most of the nutrients
> in any human population. The meat intake was probably from
> smaller animals.
>
> On the other hand, mammoths were probably similar to
> elephants in being non-ruminants having lower concentrations
> of saturated fat. In the case of elephants,http://www3.inte-
> rscience.wiley.com/cgi-bin/abstract/76500785/ABSTRACT shows
> high content of omega 3 fatty acids.

in spermatozoa - what a joke, is the semen the main part of
the mammoth to be consumed by the prehistoric men?

> http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/99legacy/5-18-1-
> 999.html says: "This information suggests that, for their
> size, many wild primates routinely ingest greater amounts of
> many minerals, vitamins, essential fatty acids, dietary
> fiber and other important dietary constituents than most
> modern human populations," Milton will report in the June
> issue of the journal "Nutrition: The International Journal
> of Basic and Applied Nutritional Sciences."
>
> --
> Ron

Ron Peters
Wed, Feb-13-08, 06:15
On Feb 12, 9:31=A0pm, Taka <taka0...@gmail.com> wrote:

> in spermatozoa - what a joke, is the semen the main part of
> the mammoth to be consumed by the prehistoric men?

Did you ever see elephant testicles?

Brain tissue is also high in omega 3 fatty acids which would
probably be highly prized by paleolithic man.

--
Ron

Taka
Thu, Feb-14-08, 06:16
On Feb 13, 11:23 pm, sphynx....@gmail.com wrote:
> Taya,
>
> This is an interesting claim:
> > 3) Saturated fatty acids actually lower Lipoprotein (a),
> > a
> substance
> > in the blood that leads to heart disease, whereas excess
> consumption
> > of vegetable oils increases it.
>
> Can you furnish some literature citations for that? Sure,
> dietary satfat lowers Lp(a) with isocaloric substitution
> for sugar or other fat carb. But you seem to be saying
> that satfat lowers Lp(a) with isocaloric subst for MUFA or
> PUFA. Really?
>
> If you can, I'd really like to see a cite to the
> peer-reviewed literature, not just the say-so at
> Weston-Price or Mercola.
>
> Thanks Adam Becker Sr

See my other post "It's SFA/PUFA ratio, not n-3/n-6 ratio
what matters".

Taka