Deprivation Issues & Binging

[Nica]

Every emotional eater needs to discover what is their ultimate trigger. I discovered mine two years ago although it took several incidences to really get it cemented in my mind.

Deprivation

Any form of deprivation for me is a horrible gate waiting to open into a field of binging. And that includes extreme low carb such as Atkins induction.

I can do deprivation very, very well, for a while. Then the gates break open.

I believe this issue stems from childhood restrictions on my freedom. My mother was extremely strict and I felt suffocated and rebelled at age 13. As an adult, I am most productive when I have a lot of freedom in my creativity, my schedules, and deadlines. Eating/food, was one of the only areas in my childhood where there was scope for excess. As my mother was very overweight and, I believe, an emotional eater herself, there were many weekends filled with pizza and chocolate.

So food has remained my friend, my outlet when life becomes restrictive in any way. What a disaster then, to restrict food!

I actually eat very low carb, however, I've had to adapt it so that foods such as bread are included hence my LC Bread recipe (http://forum.lowcarber.org/showthread.php?p=6646154#post6646154) experiments. lol

Although Atkins says that on his diet we won't feel deprived, after all, there's butter and cream involved. For those that don't eat emotionally, such a diet feels psychologically great. If a diet restricts any food group, it is deprivation for most emotional eaters.

After 2 successful weeks of doing it the Atkins way, I was desperate for a pear! I'm not even a big fruit person. I denied myself this pear, and when the inevitable binge finally came, it wasn't chocolate at first, but 4 bowls of tinned pears! Then to be followed by everything else.

I have finally, finally, fully understood just how deep this deprivation issue runs. I've learnt that I need to feel that I am not dieting, and that no food is taboo. Somehow, I've managed this and still kept very LC.

Another aspect to all this, is that I've learnt to feed both hungers - stomach hunger and emotional hunger.
I would feel horribly guilty and try not to eat if I was not physically hungry. I still stop and ask myself why I want that food, and if I can not have it and feel okay, I won't have it. But if I'm very stressed, etc, and right now food will comfort me, I won't deny myself. I try to make better choices, LC choices. but I've learnt if the only thing that will satisfy me is a HC food, then better to be done with it than eat everything else in sight because I', not getting satisfaction.

When a binge is over, these days sooner than it used to take, I don't beat myself up about it. I still sometimes feel down, after all, who wants to feel out of control. But I move forward.

That's my story in a nutshell. I would love to hear from others who know or suspect that deprivation triggers binges.

[anita45]

Hi Nica,

I totally understand where you're coming from. I definitely have emotional/behavioral problems relating to my eating. When I first started Atkins it was really liberating because my constant hunger seemed to vanish and food seemed as if it wasn't such an issue for me any more... but after about two months the problems started again and I suppose haven't really gone away... it's weird because in some respects I have no problem sticking to a diets 'rules'. I have a lot allergies which means some food groups are automatically restricted to me. So cutting out one more doesn't seem like a big deal - MOST of the time. I was vegan for 3 years (for 'health' reason's - ha!) and had no problem avoiding meat (I'm allergic to dairy). I was mostly very healthy with my eating, well as healthy as one can be on vegan diet but I felt like crap by the end of the three years and I'm sure that was down to lack of protein in my diet...

Anyway - back to today. I'm having those same problems that you mentioned - where 'knowing' that certain food groups are restricted is causing me problems - to the point where I've started to binge too. I feel guilty, hate myself etc etc - the worst thing is that 99% of the time what I'm binging on is generally low carb - but obviously that still effects my weightloss (which has been all over the place since the new year). I'm so frustrated that I 'allow' this to take over my life!

[Nica]

Hi Anita!

We're very similar. I was veggie for over a 12 years and vegan for 6.

I thought about this before, how we're able to restrict ourselves so well. It brought up two ideas for me.

Firstly, restricting ourselves might be psychologically easier than being retsricted by others. Example, deciding to be vegan was my choice for ethical reasons. But a diet, even though it's my choice to go on it, is always some external restriction. Like, someone 'out there' tells you to resrict calories, fat, carbs, whatever. I would think this is amplified when following actual rules of a specific diet.

Secondly, that people like us do restriction so well, partly because we've learnt it as children. We know how it's done and how to succeed at it. But that ultimatly, it's not what the 'inner me' or however you want to see it, wants or needs.

Thoughts?

I also binged on LC foods, obviously halted weight loss, but I think it's better than HC at least. The weight gains were much smaller I noticed, than with HC foods.

I do think that getting to a place where you forgive yourself is important and part of the overall healing for ourselves. I feel down sometimes, had tears last week, but I have stopped berating myself for it. Much better place to be. It can take time.

Have you considered re-thinking restrictions on foods? Like incorporating back the ones that feel most taboo, but doing it in some LC way? This has made a huge difference for me. Having toast and sandwhiches is soooooo comforting.

[anita45]

I think you're right about restricting yourself being easier - I went from meat eater to vegan overnight, didn't need any transitional period. But following a diet is not quite the same (at least for me) One day I was a meat-eater the next I wasn't. No problems, no cravings... With Atkins I wasn't so strict - I cut out the bread, rice, pasta, potatoes etc but kept eating a little fruit as that's my weakness although when my weight loss slowed I gave that up too (for a bit)... I don't particularly crave any carby food really - I don't know... it's confusing.

The first time I lost weight, I did it ultra low fat (and to be honest, it worked faster than Atkins seems to be for me - not that you should judge a diet by how fast it works, it's the long term you have to think about). Anyway, I think the reason why that was easier for me in some respects was that I could literally eat as much as I liked as long as there was no fat - and I continued to lose the weight. That doesn't seem to work now and anyway it's not good to be eating like that constantly. It's a psychological problem, I was eating because I was bored, depressed, happy, anxious - I want to break away from this!

Like you said - there's another problem which the food issues mask. There's something you can't control in your life, so you 'take control' through obsessing over your food. All the time I spend obsessing over this could be spent on far more important things! I hate feeling guilty all the time - bargaining with myself. I say, 'if I lose this much weight by next week, I can eat x' - except this usually turns into a mini binge. It's ridiculous.

[Nica]

Funny, I don't crave carbs physically. When I dropped bread I was totally fine about it, once it was out of my system. But I've realised now that certain carbs, like bread, are comfort foods. So emotionally, I was subconsciously wanting them.

I also think that for many of us, something like bread is such a staple in our lives, sandwhiches, etc. Any staple or food you eat for comfort or on a regular basis, imo, will be psychologically missed.

I can understand that any diet that let's you eat as much as you like would work. Only problem with low fat diets (they also worked for me) is that unless you're checking body fat, you might be losing tons of muscle. That's what happened to me but I didn't realise until I started to check it. Over the course of years of yo-yo dieting I've lost a lot of muscle, and thereby made my weight loss attempts really difficult now.

Have you ever thought of checking your Metabolic Type?
I write an user-friendly intro here:
http://metabolicshiftapproach.wordpress.com/metabolic-typing/


I was eating because I was bored, depressed, happy, anxious - I want to break away from this!


Boy, can I relate to this! I kept reading books/sites that recommeded finding your emotional trigger. problem was my triggers were - sad, happy, anxious, bored, etc!! It's like eating was akin to breathing - just there.

I have thought narrowed it down a bit now. I realise I eat either
a) when very bored and don't have a purpose for the day or hour.
b) when I'm emotionally aroused (anxiety or very happy)
c) when others are eating and either they're eating fast, it's a social event, or I'm also anxious
d) when I've felt deprived

Difficult areas to deal with. B and D are the hardest. C I've learnt to cope with, but can still catch me off guard.

If my DH is in a hurry, or pops home for lunch, I tend to either not eat with him, or remind myself to take deep breaths, and that I am not the one in a hurry.

Social events are really tough. I have to put a lot of effort into staying aware. But I also make sure that I don't feel deprived by denying myself everything that eevryone else is having!


I hate feeling guilty all the time


I know it probably won't be convincing right now, but at least for me, getting past this helped me deal with all the other aspects of emotionl eating. I think that feelings of guilt, self-loathing, and so on, only keep us down. Never allowing us to deal with what truly pains us, or finding workable strategies.

I spent years falling off the wagon and then hating myself for it, feeling horrible and depressed, and then binging and often never ging back to dieting, for a while.
Getting rid of such feelings, means I now cheat, and am back on the next day or two. (If I've really deprived myself the eating can last a couple of weeks though).

I've noticed that people who do deprivation well, tend to work well in extremes. All or nothing. Obsessing about details. Either I'm on the diet or I'm not. You notice any of that?
I think when you stop hating yourself or feeling guilty, you're better able to accept a more fluid reality - cheating or having a 'bad day', is nothing more than that, and has no bearing on tomorrow. Make sense?

[anita45]

Well I think my attachment to fruit must be emotional - I never felt particularly deprived on Atkins apart from avoiding fruit during induction (which I just couldn't do) and just generally cutting down on my consumption of it. I suppose I ate fruit the same way some people eat mass quantities of bread and pasta. Before this WOE I could easily eat a kilo of fruit (or more!) a day. So having to restrict it causes me major issues. I think it possibly relates back to my allergies in that because I was (and am) allergic to many of the treats 'normal' children are given, I'd eat fruit instead - as much as I liked.

Eating as akin to breathing - I think that's true. If I'm busy, food isn't an issue. When I have free time that's when I start thinking about it. If other people around me are eating - even if I've eaten/not hungry - I still want to eat too! I feel like I'm 'missing out' despite knowing that I won't really enjoy it/don't need it as I'm not hungry.

What you said about losing muscle mass on low fat diets is very true I think. I did the low fat diet for about 7 months before I became vegan, going from 63.5kg - 55kg. Then I went vegan and went down to around 53kg and maintained that weight (though at one point I did get down to 50kg, but I was stressed and not eating). Anyway, although I don't know for certain I'm pretty sure that I lost a hell of a lot of muscle mass during the three years of my vegan diet. I also had loads of other problems related to bad digestion and lethargy - which have mostly gone now that I'm doing Atkins but I'm still overweight...

I did the metabolic type test - I'm a protein type. But looking at the info it seems like I'm already eating that way anyway... I think the root of my problem is emotional/behavioral - and that's what I have to sort out. You're right - it's a waste of energy feeling guilty/upset. I keep telling myself to stop being so pathetic and eat what i want if I REALLY want it at that particular time... still easier said than done.

I understand the all or nothing thing - I keep telling myself that I have to look at it as a whole, the big picture and not freak out if I have one cheat. It's just one small thing.

[Nica]

Well I think my attachment to fruit must be emotional
From what you describe, it sure sounds like it. How horrible for your emotional state to be told (Atkins) to keep away from almost all of it! Like me with bready foods. But even strict Atkins had me craving fruit. lol

I'm certainly having it again. Although not bothered by it, if I want it I have it. I make sure to have it with cream or a piece of cheese. Last night I had sliced nectarines with double cream and cinnamon. VERY comforting, satisfying, and fairly lc.


If I'm busy, food isn't an issue. When I have free time that's when I start thinking about it.

Sooo relate to that. I love that busy feeling and realising afterwards that you hadn't thought of food fo X number of hours.

If other people around me are eating - even if I've eaten/not hungry - I still want to eat too! I feel like I'm 'missing out' despite knowing that I won't really enjoy it/don't need it as I'm not hungry.

Bingo - the deprivation issue rears its head. Social situations, even if just one other person, have got to be a huge trigger for deprivations issues. I couldn't care less about other people's possessions, careers, money, etc, but if they're eating and I'm not my brain kicks into panic mode.

Anyway, although I don't know for certain I'm pretty sure that I lost a hell of a lot of muscle mass during the three years of my vegan diet. I also had loads of other problems related to bad digestion and lethargy - which have mostly gone now that I'm doing Atkins but I'm still overweight...

yeah, my hiatus hernia has gone. I discovered that really starchy foods and carb binges were triggering them. Even a LC binge won't do it.

Big problem with losing muscle mass MM, is that you have to eat a lot fewer calories to lose weight. VERY difficult obviously. At one point, I was down to 600 calories a day! I honestly, I was feeling totally fine. Bizzare. I could only have 800 cals to maintain. Now I can manage 1200-1400 to lose.
Do you own calipers? Would recommend these. How tall are you?


I did the metabolic type test - I'm a protein type.

Argh, like me, all that damage we were doing eating as vegans!

[anita45]

So how do you eat for your Metabolic Type - from what I understand, the protein types eat more or less like Atkins - though I did notice on the allowed food groups there were bananas (!!).

I don't have any calipers and I'm five foot. I know my body fat is far too high - I seem to put on weight on my arms, legs and butt - my torso is pretty slim in comparison to the rest of me and it's from here that I lose my weight first.

At work one of my friends has just found out she's pregnant. She's already had three boys and is skinny as a rake and I've always been jealous about how she can eat whatever she wants (mainly junk - she's a veggie too by the way) and never seem to put on any weight. Anyway, what I found very ironic is the fact that in the last few weeks I've been feeling EXTREMELY envious of her and feeling fat and frumpy in comparison and all the time she's been feeling fat and frumpy because she's been putting on weight due to the pregnancy but was hiding it under baggy clothes! Anyway, we had a laugh about this but I know it's gonna get more difficult for me as she'll be eating non-stop and I'll feel deprived (even though half the time I won't be hungry/won't want to eat what she's eating) just because I can't 'join in' with the eating...

[Nica]

Hi chook,

Yep, Protein Types are basically low carbers. In my approach though, I also take into consideration of emotional issues. So for Protein Types like us, I wouldn't recommend doing anything as strict as induction, but finding a way to get very LC without feeling deprived. Our meaning of deprivation, not Atkins' version.

I would, as an example, find a way to include the foods that bring us the most comfort. Like I've mentioned, my very LC eating includes bread, it also includes chocolate, everyday.

Getting the carbs/sugars out of our system is crucial. Okay, we agree with Mr Atkins. Stabilising our blood sugar is crucuail - yep. But if we do it with deprivation - binge city.

A Mixed or Carb Type would feel awful doing Atkins.

Ok, you know your friend is going to be a trigger, she already is. So you need to arm yourself agianst it. Can you be open with her? and share your food issues? If so, I would tell her, and explain that eating together will be situations of anxiety for you. If you ca't confide in her, find excuses not to eat together.

These situations are tough. I've been known to smuggle LC sweets in my pockets and sneak them during social events. lol Yeah, I usually end up over-eating, but at least I've stuck to lc stuff. I think this is what it's all about. Accepting who we are, and simply finding strategies to cope, to manage our compulsive personalities.

This is crucial: Our over-eating, as much as we've learnt to hate it, was a coping mechanism we formed during childhood (usually). That is, our subconscious, found a way to cope during times of over-arousal, stress, anxiety. We could have fallen to pieces without this emotional eating strategy.

Funny how your friend is feeling frumpy even though she's skinny. Goes to show it has very little to do with weight, and lots to do with self-image. I try to tell myself I look great, every time I look in the mirror, despite still wanting to lose several inches. This simple thought helped me: the fat is not me.

I can't admit to be totally convinced, but I'm more convinced than I used to be.

[anita45]

well I suppose it wouldn't hurt incorporating a bit of fruit everyday - I've just got to be able to do portion control! Sometimes just knowing that I can have a piece of fruit is enough - I don't actually end up eating it. For instance yesterday I took an apple to work along with my regular chicken salad, but it never got eaten because I was too full from the salad. I'm glad that i can recognise true and false hunger now which I really wasn't able to do before low carbing but even then sometimes you STILL want to eat.

That makes me sound a bit messed up though - carrying around fruit like some sort of emotional prop (like a small child and his 'blankie') - haha! But hey - if it works...

I don't think that there's much I can do about my friend at work - we only eat together at lunch time but she's constantly munching in between and I don't want her to stop because I have a lack of self control! She's a teacher and I'm her technician. She's got food stashed everywhere - in her desk in the class room, upstairs in our office, in the kiln room - fortunately 99% of it I'm allergic to. Looks like I'm just gonna have to carry around some fruit with me at all times like some weird kind of edible talisman!

I think it's easy to fixate on weight loss and allow yourself to believe that once it's all gone EVERYTHING ELSE in your life will suddenly fall into place. But it doesn't necessarily work like that - you've got to work at those other problem areas in your life too. It's not the be all and end all. Your frame of mind is really important too - perhaps more important in some ways.

[Nica]

Sometimes just knowing that I can have a piece of fruit is enough - I don't actually end up eating it.

Excellent!! That's SO true. You see how it's the deprivation thing? Knowing we can have it totally shifts our frme of mind. I for one have HC chocolate in my fridge which I haven't touched in over 2 months. I keep it there. Goes against many diet books that say to clean out your fridge and cupboards so you won't be tempted. I make sure I never run out of bread and chocolate. If it's in the house, sure, there's a higher chance I'll eat it. But if it's not in the house, and I want it? Disaster. Bigger chance of a binge coming on.


That makes me sound a bit messed up though - carrying around fruit like some sort of emotional prop (like a small child and his 'blankie') - haha!
I think it makes you sound like a person who has accepted who she is.

She's got food stashed everywhere - in her desk in the class room, upstairs in our office, in the kiln room - fortunately 99% of it I'm allergic to.
That's not easy. I have a husband who is slim and eats everything in sight. Has taken me a while to think my way around it. I think the allergy thing can really work in your favour. I use lc in mine. Like, I see him eat popcorn, which I sued to love, and just, gross, starchy hiatus hernia forming cr%p. lol


Looks like I'm just gonna have to carry around some fruit with me at all times like some weird kind of edible talisman!

I think that's perfect! Just don't forget to change it on occassion - mouldy fruit, ugh. Hmmm... might need to change that chocolate of mine. :lol:


I think it's easy to fixate on weight loss and allow yourself to believe that once it's all gone EVERYTHING ELSE in your life will suddenly fall into place.

Totslly agreed. You said yourself you've been down to 50kg. I've also been very slim. hasn't changed my relationship with food one tiny bit. And that's what I truly want to change.

You've inspired me to finally write my emotional eating page (http://metabolicshiftapproach.wordpress.com/emotional-eating/). well, to start it.... if you think I should add something, let me know.

[anita45]

Glad I've been able to motivate you to write! I've had a quick read through and it looks pretty on the ball to me - I'll go through it more thoroughly later.

Our conversation has reminded me of something - a few months back I was in the library getting out diabetes books for my mother (who's recently been diagnosed), I came across 'On Eating' by Susie Orbach - I just flicked through and I came across this bit that basically said that you should surround yourself with the food you binge on to try and break the relationship you have with it. That if you just saw it as a normal everyday food you wouldn't react to it in a bad way. I just scoffed at this and thought the woman was insane - surely that was a recipe for total disaster? Now however, I think she may have a point... knowing that the food is there if you REALLY want it puts your mind at ease. I need to get that book out and actually read the whole thing I think.

[jamaicaker]

I am having some real issues with this too. I do okay for a little while and then, i can't seem to stop eating. I never feel full. I hate it. I don't know why. Maybe cause i want to be rebelious. I want to loose weight so bad. About 2 1/2 years ago i was at a healthy 115 and felt great on adkins, now after many different anti depressants, which made me mad hungry and fat, i can't seem to get it together. I don't know what to do. I just keep praying that one day i can get it.

[Nica]

Anita - yeah! Sounds like a good book. When i first told my DH that I was going to buy lots of junka dn whatever foods caused me weight gain but I enjoyed, to keep around the house, he was very sceptical. he worried I was making things harder for myself.

Look, here's what I think, we've tried almost everything haven't we? If you're like me you've yo-yo dieted for years. Trying a new experiment isn't going to affect the rest of your life. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. But you don't know if you don't try.

I have lots of LC sweets at home. I noticed that when got a new shipment, if my home supply was very low, or I had run out of choccies for example, I would tend to want to eat too many on that first day. this is the same for normal grocery shopping. if I let our supplies at home dwindle, then I want to eat all sorts of things when we bring the shopping home. I've been known to nibble on things in the car!

I'm totally convinced that for anyone with deprivation issues, the last thing you do is cause any change in diet, lifestyle, or food supply, that suggests to our brain we might be restricted in any way.

Hi Jamaicker,

Are you still on the meds?

It's difficult enough working through emotional eating issues, let alone having to fight your own body. Anti-depressant meds are notorious for stalling weight loss, and even causing weight gain. It's not your fault.

[jamaicaker]

No i have been off the meds for at least 6 months now. i am just having a hard time.

[Nica]

Ok, so what do you mean by 'never feel full'? I mean, exactly. Does your stomach feel empty even after a large meal? Or is it that you don't feel satisfied?

[Nica]

Hi,

So what do you mean exactly by 'never feel full'? Physically or emotionally?

[LattéLover]

HI Nica, ANita, and Jamaicaker,

It'S 6:00 a.m. Monday morning and I couldn'T sleep, probably from having way to much sugary chocolate and food late last night. I'm feeling down about being able to stay on track.........which right now means, even maintaining the 8-10 pound gain I've done form eating lots of sugar in the last week.....I've tried to give myself that realistic goal and even that feels very hard right now. THis, after real success of doing SB, in my own way, with lots of in control HC treats regularly and lost 30 pounds in about 6 months, then been going up and down since about Oct 2006. Was stabilizing the last few weeks then it jsut hit be again and keep going up.......don'T know what I'll do.

I definitely agree about the deprivation-binge cycle you describe and Nica, I really enjoy the self-gentleness and self-acceptance tone of your post, as I have found that the more I can be self-accepting, the better success I have (like I never call them cheats, from the beginning, I called them treats or extras). Right now, I thought maybe if I eat quite high carb but can find a way to maintain at 155 (after just being 145 last week and most of the time the last few months - ugh - and ahd started to accept that maintaining at 145 WAS good enough and successful enough). BUt even maintaining at 155 seems hard right now.

I'm sure I'll write more at some point bc I find the thread really interesting,b ut at least wanted to respond now. That idea of keeping trigger foods around so that they become normal and lose their power, made me think of an article I read in a magazine last summer. It was about the American Idol runner up, Katherine McPhee, who went for bulimia treatment in a centre, I believe. ANyway, they had her eat a small portion of her trigger (mini snickers bar) with EVERY meal. THought it was interesting. CHOcolate is definitely my downfall and I do love bread and muffins and cookies, etc.

ANyway, just wanted to stop in and share my struggle...........really don'T want to gain back all the 30 pounds I worked so hard to lose and this is the longest I've ever lasted on a program. AND I was having regaulr off-plan treats, often in the beginnig, in controlled way, but more and more, seems to be in a uncontrolled way. SO I hover between wanting to go more strict to lose the gain fast, which can be very psychologically motivating (and strict for me still means having huge portions - I don'T measure generally - and no starch and 1 dairy - about Phase 1 - or no starch and 3 fruit and 3 dairy)......my normal baseline for losing was generally Phase 2 of SB: 1 starch, 3 fruit and 3 dairy per day. I hover between doing this right now and not doing it since I don'T want to det up the all or nothing mentality that I've gotten, to my disappointment, partly due to the diet-mentality deprivation you speak of (disappointing since my program was not so restrictive), but I guess as you say, any restriction, is still restriction.

Hoping that sharing this struggle will help me before I lsoe all the success.

Take care and thanks for sharing,
Latté Lover

[Nica]

Hi there chook,

Good to hear from you and what you're experiencing. it's something many of us can empathise with for sure.

Not matter how much I've learnt about these issues, I'm still learning all the time.

I've had a stressful few weeks and my eating was all over the place. Like you, I'm trying to maintain. I've put back some weight. However, although it's more than I would be happy with, it's not a huge amount and more importantly, I've not had any frenzy eating binges.

I have of course over eaten, to put the weight back on. But as we know, our issues are NOT about weight but about food, eating, stress, etc. I'm recognising more and more how essential it is to deal with the stress, deprivation, and binging, than the weight.

I've made sure that despite the increasing weight and inches, I was not going to go 'strict'. In fact, this word is slowly being eliminated from my vocabulary. A part of me was wanting to, in fear at my expanding waist line, but I've held off. And I tell you, it feels good. Sure, i'm not jumping for joy, my weight is increasing. But I've not entered the viscious cycle.

Instead, I'm aware of the increase, I'm choosing low carb and watching portions, but am eating when I need it. I've done this for 3 weeks and that has caused a weight gain. But not a single binge, and yesterday i lost a little weight simply because I reached a day I was okay about eating less. Today I feel that same calm.

Rather than push myself into 'dieting', I've remained aware but allowed myself to ride out the need to eat. How long this calm will last, who knows. But for me, not binging, not eating in a frenzy, not depriving myself, getting to the weight maintanence/loss stage naturally and calmly, is an ENORMOUS achievement.

There are two things I have found that have helped in the past and now I've realised that they truly are helpers.
1 - 5HTP (http://metabolicshiftapproach.wordpress.com/2007/04/01/5htp/)
2 - Multi Vits plus separate Vit B Complex.

All a process. :)

[LattéLover]

Hi NIca,

COngratulations on your success; that calm, not bingeing and riding a wave ARE amazing achievements.

I am doing a bit better in having decided to not go strict with this gain, but try to maintain at this higher weight in order to hope to take some of the power out of foods - i.e. combat the all or nothing mentality. I ahve had very small successes and many days where I still want tons of starch and sugar and usually have them.......but am seeing it as an experiment, mostly keeping up exercise and seeign little baby steps.

Take care and good luck!

Latté

[Nica]

I am doing a bit better in having decided to not go strict with this gain, but try to maintain at this higher weight in order to hope to take some of the power out of foods - i.e. combat the all or nothing mentality.

I think this is absolutely key.

Something else I've sort of discovered (still experimenting) is that although my physicial hunger diminishes with very low carb, and I lose weight, my emotional hunger rises. I think mostly due to the psychological sense of any deprivation, but also a physiological one. It seems that a little more carbs improves my need-to-eat mentality.

I've added wholemeal rice back into my diet, and not only was it tasty, but mentally it felt great to be having rice again. As long as it's a low GI/GL food and I watch portions, I think these carbs might help too.

I had an amazingly good day yesterday. I felt like imagine 'normal' people feel - eat only when hungry, only get hungry when stomach empty, no need to eat emotionally. Now I think I might sell my soul just to understand exactly why I felt that way!

ah well, it's an explorative journey.... lots of luck.

[elizabet]

Carbs have always helped me with feelings of self laothing.What a viciuos cycle.To feel that way and eat a pound of ice cream and feel more self loathing for eating the ice cream .Also carbs is a way to comfort the feelings of inadequacy for me.Never feeling like I fit in or just plain not good enough( everyone else is perfect but Im a goof ball.)It has definetly gotten better but mistakes from past doesnt help.Feeling I will never be as good as the next person and if they knew the things I did would they still like me that Im a bad person.My hubby says thats not true everyone loves me but some days is better than others.I am very strong female,joke alot, love life,I try to share my experience with others of being just to wild for my pants and always read to much into peoples reactions.I tell the truth regardless.And some days I feel all these qualties make me different and I just want to be like everyone else.Then other days I am happy for the person I am to day and all my experience has made that person.About 80 percent good 20 percent bad and when the 20 percent hits I eat ice cream and tons of it to med my feelings .So I truely understand I also understand the world is emotional crippled.alot of people deal with this problem that is why the world is so overweight.But I will say It takes true courage to say Hey I have a problem and put one foot in front of the other even with all the let downs and slips pick yourself up and go on.And takes courage to say Hey I want to stop this or this is how i feel today.
Courage today ladies and gentlemen!!!!
Cause tomorrow I may feel different lol.