The Inuit Paradox

[Angeline76]

http://www.discover.com/issues/oct-04/features/inuit-paradox/?page=1

I really liked this article. I was sitting here reading it gobbling down my hamburgers with mayo on a bed of romaine ... when ... I got to the part about farm raised animals in the US having more of the bad fat in their fat and its not healthy .
The article is about the inuit and their diet , the seal , the whale blubber.
Geesh I 've lost a bunch of weight (25 lbs) and my anxiety and shortness of breath and hypoglycemic episodes are under control better than ever before ... but the part about clogged arteries and the way we raise our meat in this country made my gag on my hamburger . I can't afford organic , especially if I"m to eat it everyday .

I posted the link if anyone wants to check it out . I think the part that scared me was on page 4 .

[2bthinner!]

One thing I've learned, listen to your own body. You feel good on this diet, right? Let your body guide you.

I've let myself be pulled away by convincing articles, well meaning husbands who, of course, can eat McDonald's all day and never gain. And I always end up back here. I do feel best on Atkins. I'm my own worst enemy. I'll remember something I read "somewhere" and sabotage myself. I'm really trying not to shoot myself in the foot this year though. :lol: :help:

ETA:http://www.westonaprice.org/knowyourfats/fats_lungs.html
We need natural saturated fat in our diets. The important phospholipids that form the membranes in all of our cells are made of mostly (half or more) saturated fatty acids. This is especially true for parts of our brains where more than 80 percent of the phospholipids carry half of their fatty acids as saturated fatty acids.

When it comes to our lungs, the very important phospholipid class called lung surfactant is a special phospholipid with 100 percent saturated fatty acids. It is called dipalmitoyl phosphatidylcholine and there are two saturated palmitic acid molecules attached to it. When people consume a lot of partially hydrogenated fats and oils, the trans fatty acids are put into the phospholipids where the body normally wants to have saturated fatty acids and the lungs may not work effectively. Some research has suggested that trans fatty acids are causing asthma in children.

Recent research shows that having enough saturated fat prevents stroke; and to protect our kidneys from disease, research shows we need certain kinds of saturated fatty acids, which are found only in the natural fats such as animal fats and coconut and palm kernel oils.

[Nancy LC]

Wow, this article is really good! Thanks for posting the link.

[waywardsis]

Thank for this!

As far as the sat-fat, cholesterol, heart disease/clogged arteries thing goes, there's a whole slew of doctors (yes, doctors) actively working AGAINST this theory. If you're concerned though, start with Weston Price or have a read here: http://www.second-opinions.co.uk/cholesterol_myth_2.html

[Lisa N]

Another good site is THINCS (The International Network of Cholesterol Skeptics) which can be found using this link (http://www.thincs.org/discuss.htm). Lots of good reading there!
It's generally true that supermarket meats are imbalanced with respect to Omega 3 to Omega 6 ratio (too high on the 6), but that can be brought into better balance by the addition of fatty fish (wild caught), flax seeds or flax oil (keep the oil refrigerated as well as the seeds if they are already ground as they both oxidize quickly at room temperature) as well as by decreasing the use of oils that tend to be high in omega 6.

[dina1957]

One thing I've learned, listen to your own body. You feel good on this diet, right? Let your body guide you.
Unfortunately, not always our body has have ability or time to show warning signs (there are many silent deseases), and some folks that feel great all of sudden have a major heart attack, or Dx with T2 (like myself) or Dx with cancer. Unfortunately, some folks even with poorly controlled diabetes feel fine for most of the time, and some ppl with clogged artherie(s) have no clue until they get a fatal coronary episode. I am a bit sceptical of body guideing, and sometimes it sends signs when it is a little bit too late.

[tom sawyer]

Sure there are silent diseases, and for this reason some routine annual screening is always going to be a good idea. But losing a bunch of weight, not having episodes of asthma, acne clearing up, these things are your body telling you that you are eating better than before. Listen to it, more than any article. When I read about diet, it is to help me figure out why what I am doing is working. And there are always going to be ways to tweak things to improve the diet, but don't get away from the core of low carb because that is enough to give you better health than your old ways. Whether conventional "commercial-grade" foodstuffs are worse for you than free-range organic stuff, is an open question. There may be a benefit, the extent of the superiority is not liekly to be huge though. Nothing like the difference between ANY form of low carb, and SAD.

[Nancy LC]

I used to ignore my IBS and gas, that wasn't such a bright thing to do in retrospect. :p

[Angeline]

That article was quite fascinating and informative at many levels. I knew that the Inuit way of eating was very healthy, but I didn't really know the specifics of what they ate. So this is interesting. It also shows the vegetables-haters that although the Inuits ate a predominantly meat diet, it doesn't translate to an all steak, bacon, and chicken diet.

[StLouisTom]

Unfortunately, not always our body has have ability or time to show warning signs (there are many silent deseases), and some folks that feel great all of sudden have a major heart attack, or Dx with T2 (like myself) or Dx with cancer. Unfortunately, some folks even with poorly controlled diabetes feel fine for most of the time, and some ppl with clogged artherie(s) have no clue until they get a fatal coronary episode. I am a bit sceptical of body guideing, and sometimes it sends signs when it is a little bit too late.

Dina, I don't know when you were diagnosed with T2, but looking at your stats, I'm guessing it was when you were overweight. Since at least 80% of those diagnosed with T2 diabetes are overweight, and since obesity and diabetes go hand in hand ("diabesity"), it should come as no surprise to any overweight person that they have T2 diabetes. Frankly, I'm surprised when an overweight (more than just a few pounds) person tells me they DON'T have it. I'm sure most are pre-diabetic and well on their way to full blown T2. The point is, T2 develops over time and doesn't happen "all of a sudden". T1, on the other hand, hits people out of the blue.

[dina1957]

Dina, I don't know when you were diagnosed with T2, but looking at your stats, I'm guessing it was when you were overweight. Since at least 80% of those diagnosed with T2 diabetes are overweight, and since obesity and diabetes go hand in hand ("diabesity"), it should come as no surprise to any overweight person that they have T2 diabetes. Frankly, I'm surprised when an overweight (more than just a few pounds) person tells me they DON'T have it. I'm sure most are pre-diabetic and well on their way to full blown T2. The point is, T2 develops over time and doesn't happen "all of a sudden". T1, on the other hand, hits people out of the blue.
You will be surprised to learn that it is T2 diabetes that causes weight gain, not the other way around. I know lots of folks twice my weight that have no diabetes; to say that everyone who carres few pounds is T2 diabetic, is oversimplified approach to diabetes. This is a very complex and poorly understood metabolic disorder that can have many different causes, but the outcome is almost the same: exessive blood glucose is turned into fat and causes weight gain, along with elevated insulin levels (not high too in my case).
I was not overweight or obese all my life, actually I manage my weight pretty good :between 130-155 pounds until I started to gain all of a sudden on the same diet (no processed carbs, no soda, no sugars, for almost 30 years). How do you explain my diabetes in comparison to other forum members that were well above 250 pounds prior to starting Atkins or other lc diet?
My point was, I was not feeling tired, or ill, or thristy, or hungry, or losing weight, or craved sweets, no any other signs of diabetes.
I did skip one annual physical, and between the last one and later, is when I became T2, and exactly, at that time I gained weight.
I too belived in "diabesity" and letrally, felt like asking every overweight stranger if they have diabetes, and all obese women at work. Guess, what, noen of them had diabetes, at least, those I had enough courage to ask or knew personally. The more i read about diabetes, the more I feel like we know nothing about this condition.
Ask ppl around and you will be even more surprised.;)
EDA: I forgot to mention that I started cutting my carbs 2 years prior being Dx with T2, structured my diet mostly around protein, and started eating waaaay more fat than I used to. May be this is a clue...

[Wyvrn]

You will be surprised to learn that it is T2 diabetes that causes weight gain, not the other way around. I know lots of folks twice my weight that have no diabetes; to say that everyone who carres few pounds is T2 diabetic, is oversimplified approach to diabetes.You need to read that post again, Dina. StLouisTom didn't say most overweight people are diabetic. He said they were probably pre-diabetic, a very different thing.

Diabetes causes weight loss, not weight gain, but hyperinsulinemia (pre-diabetes) does cause weight gain, and I think it very likely that most people who have insulin resistance are ignorant of their condition - and overweight.

Wyv

[StLouisTom]

You will be surprised to learn that it is T2 diabetes that causes weight gain, not the other way around. I know lots of folks twice my weight that have no diabetes; to say that everyone who carres few pounds is T2 diabetic, is oversimplified approach to diabetes. This is a very complex and poorly understood metabolic disorder that can have many different causes, but the outcome is almost the same: exessive blood glucose is turned into fat and causes weight gain, along with elevated insulin levels (not high too in my case).
I was not overweight or obese all my life, actually I manage my weight pretty good :between 130-155 pounds until I started to gain all of a sudden on the same diet (no processed carbs, no soda, no sugars, for almost 30 years). How do you explain my diabetes in comparison to other forum members that were well above 250 pounds prior to starting Atkins or other lc diet?
My point was, I was not feeling tired, or ill, or thristy, or hungry, or losing weight, or craved sweets, no any other signs of diabetes.
I did skip one annual physical, and between the last one and later, is when I became T2, and exactly, at that time I gained weight.
I too belived in "diabesity" and letrally, felt like asking every overweight stranger if they have diabetes, and all obese women at work. Guess, what, noen of them had diabetes, at least, those I had enough courage to ask or knew personally. The more i read about diabetes, the more I feel like we know nothing about this condition.
Ask ppl around and you will be even more surprised.;)
EDA: I forgot to mention that I started cutting my carbs 2 years prior being Dx with T2, structured my diet mostly around protein, and started eating waaaay more fat than I used to. May be this is a clue...

I said 80% of those with T2 are overweight, and most overweight without T2 are pre-diabetic. And I'm sorry, but it will take an awful lot of proof to convince me T2 is caused by anything other than diet and lifestyle. That's not to "blame" you or anyone else for their disease, but only to state the truth so that we can deal with it as a society. Those of us raised on SAD have paid the price, some with diabetes, some with arthritis, some heart disease, etc. etc. We all ate the wrong things, and it manifests itself in different ways in different people. T2 simply doesn't occur in populations that don't eat our western diet. And when those populations start eating our diet, they get T2 at alarming rates. And as we've consumed more and more refined carbs, the incidence has skyrocketed, even among children!

I've seen in this and other posts that a LC diet doesn't seem to help you like it has so many others. I don't know why, but it's certainly possible that you're the exception to the rule. I'm not a big believer in it, but maybe Dr. Mercola's theory of "metabolic typing" has some truth in it (he says there are protein types, carb types and mixed types, all requiring a different diet). But I firmly believe the vast majority of people can avoid T2 by following a natural foods, LC diet (i.e. Neanderthin) and exercising regularly.

[Nancy LC]

It is true that obesity and diabetes go hand in hand, but obesity doesn't cause the diabetes, the diet does. Everyone makes that assumption, including the media and doctors.

We just had something posted not too long ago in this forum about obesity not being the cause of diabetes.

[StLouisTom]

It is true that obesity and diabetes go hand in hand, but obesity doesn't cause the diabetes, the diet does. Everyone makes that assumption, including the media and doctors.

We just had something posted not too long ago in this forum about obesity not being the cause of diabetes.

I agree that the diet causes the diabetes. The same diet is also the primary cause of the obesity. And the obesity contributes to the diabetes, and the diabetes contributes to the obesity. The fat cells get so "full" that they no longer accept all the sugar/triglycerides the insulin is trying to push into them (insulin resistance). That causes the sugar in the blood to be higher, which causes more insulin to be produced, which either makes the person fatter or at best prevents them from losing weight. The high blood sugar is literally poison to the body, thus all the nasty complications of diabetes. It's a vicious cycle, and it's the main reason obesity is such a health hazard IMHO.

Having said all that, T2 doesn't generally sneak up on you. It's years in the making. Maybe Dina is an exception, but for most people the warning signs are there well in advance of the diagnosis.

[dina1957]

[quote]Diabetes causes weight loss, not weight gain,
Only poorly contolled, with Bgs over 250+, otherwise, it makes harder to lose and slighly elevated glucose will be converted into body fat.

[GeorgeMead]

When I read the title of this thread, :idea: I vaguely recalled an article by one of my favorite columnists, some of you may enjoy:

http://www.thincs.org/Malcolm2.htm#sep16-2004

Cholesterol And The French Paradox, The Swiss Paradox, The Russian Paradox, The Lithuanian Paradox...Etc...

By Red Flags Columnist, Dr. Malcolm Kendrick

[Wyvrn]

[QUOTE=Wyvrn]


Only poorly contolled, with Bgs over 250+, otherwise, it makes harder to lose and slighly elevated glucose will be converted into body fat.Well, of course I'm talking about poorly controlled (uncontrolled, actually) diabetes. Once you add an external source of insulin and other drugs, you've completely changed the parameters of the discussion.

[ysabella]

StLouisTom, do you have any documentation about fat cells becoming full? I've never heard of that.

That was an interesting read, GeorgeMead, thanks.

[Nancy LC]

And the obesity contributes to the diabetes, and the diabetes contributes to the obesity. The fat cells get so "full" that they no longer accept all the sugar/triglycerides the insulin is trying to push into them (insulin resistance).
That's a new one on me, I'm interested in reading more too. Everything I've read says we are quite capable of making new fat cells.

[ReginaW]

StLouisTom, do you have any documentation about fat cells becoming full? I've never heard of that.

I'm not Tom, but a couple of years ago the Washington Post did an article on the active role of fat in the body...quite interesting....interesting enough I bookmarked it!

Anyway, here's the link:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A43258-2004Jul11.html

And here is one of the key paragraphs....Like guardians of the nation's strategic oil reserve, fat coordinates how, when and where the body's energy supply is stored and how and when it is mobilized. Fat also emits signals that can unleash, or damp down, the immune system. Fat influences when blood clots and when blood vessels constrict. Fat even tells the body when it can reproduce, and when it must await more favorable conditions. And perhaps most insidiously, fat cells most likely beget new fat cells, perpetuating their existence and magnifying their effects.

One of the researchers whose work details fat calls begetting more fat calls is Dr. Ahima, a recent commentary is here:

Adipose tissue as an endocrine organ (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=pubmed&cmd=Retrieve&dopt=AbstractPlus&list_uids=17021375&query_hl=1&itool=pubmed_docsum)

Hope this helps....I can post other links, but this should be a start!

[dina1957]

I agree that the diet causes the diabetes. The same diet is also the primary cause of the obesity. And the obesity contributes to the diabetes, and the diabetes contributes to the obesity. The fat cells get so "full" that they no longer accept all the sugar/triglycerides the insulin is trying to push into them (insulin resistance). That causes the sugar in the blood to be higher, which causes more insulin to be produced, which either makes the person fatter or at best prevents them from losing weight. The high blood sugar is literally poison to the body, thus all the nasty complications of diabetes. It's a vicious cycle, and it's the main reason obesity is such a health hazard IMHO.

Having said all that, T2 doesn't generally sneak up on you. It's years in the making. Maybe Dina is an exception, but for most people the warning signs are there well in advance of the diagnosis.
Ok, I wanted to do this for some time. Let's start a poll to see how many overweight and obese on this forum are T2 diabetics. I am puzzled myself, being 30 pounds overweight made me T2, while I see some 100 oiunds heavier with no desease in sight? I always ask myself, do they have iron clad pancrease or simply have right genes? May be their weight is only caused by crappy diet, and once they change WOE, the weight comes off and they are healthy again. Not my case, definetely, weight loss did not reverse my condition, however, I am not a typical T2 either.
I am an exception may be, but let's start with others who are (were) 100 pounds overweight. Do they all have T2 diabetes???????????

[ReginaW]

Let's start a poll to see how many overweight and obese on this forum are T2 diabetics. I am puzzled myself, being 30 pounds overweight made me T2, while I see some 100 oiunds heavier with no desease in sight? I always ask myself, do they have iron clad pancrease or simply have right genes?

The thing is, it isn't just the diet per se....IMHO it's more the cumulative effect a poor diet has on the entire endocrine system, not just the pancreas....there is something more to the development of type 2 diabetes than just obesity - 20% of those diagnosed are normal weight - not an insignificant "chance" happening statistically, ya know?

The common thread that sparks diabetes with a poor diet (or without?) may well turn out to be genetic; then again it may be a single micronutrient deficiency or micornutrients deficient in just the right concert with each other to negatively affect the endocrine system; then again it may be exposure to something in utero or childhood or adulthood that sparks the domino effect to frank diabetes.

Type 2 doesn't just happen - it's slow and insidious and while many who are overweight or obese walk around seemingly unaffected, I would say many are already pre-diabetic or diabetic and don't know it....and if you add that the current targets and cut-offs are on the high side and are better lower than higher - the number of people who are most definitely on the road to diabetes is higher than the current estimates.

[venter]

what we want to measure is how many T2 diabetics are overweight, not how many of those that are overweight are T2.

conditions that often are precusors to T2 and that often exist in tandem with T2 (i.e. metabolic syndrome - hyperinsulemia/insulin resistance) are no doubt also the cause of weight gain in many people. i think we have to look at the causes of weight gain in those that are overweight/obese. did sudden changes in caloric intake (hyperphagia) lead to weight gain and insulin resistance or did a lifetime of high-carbs slowly lead to hyperinsulemia/insulin resistance/overweight/T2?

i think the mechanism for the latter scenario is more obvious and therefore more plausible, but that doesn't necessarily mean the T2 can't cause metabolic syndrome.

[2bthinner!]

When my BIL was diagnosed with T2, he actually had been losing weight. I know, doesn't sound like T2, but once he got out of the hospital and was stabilized (was on pill insulin for a while), he is diet controlled. He had always been really thin, then gained. But, we didn't think anything of it as he was eating a lot of sugary junk. Then, he was losing and got really sick. He was talking out of his head and such. My mil called me and I told her to take him to the ER. They kept him for 5 days. They worried about brain damage, but he seems about the same.

I guess he kinda follows an OWL. He eats hamburgers, but he doesn't get fries (I don't think, I don't live with him, so I'm not certain) and drinks a LOT of diet (aspartame) soda. And his weight is currently normal. He has a fairly active job.

[dina1957]

[QUOTE=venter]what we want to measure is how many T2 diabetics are overweight, not how many of those that are overweight are T2. [q/quote]
How many overweight/obese are T2!!!! It would be inetersting to see if it is just being overweight alone that causes diabetes, and some folks been overweight for most of their adult lives. So, shall we conduct the study?

[dina1957]

When my BIL was diagnosed with T2, he actually had been losing weight. I know, doesn't sound like T2,
Indeed it does, but your BIL was losign weight due to lack of insulin and the weigth loss came from : 1) glucose loss in urine 2) muscle and fat tissue breakdown due to high glucagon.
This is typical when diabetes goes undiagnosted for years, or T1 suddenly strikes.

but once he got out of the hospital and was stabilized (was on pill insulin for a while)
was he on pill or insulin? insulin can't be taken in a pill form, only ingected. it will be deactivated by stomach acid just any other peptide.

He had always been really thin, then gained. But, we didn't think anything of it as he was eating a lot of sugary junk. Then, he was losing and got really sick. He was talking out of his head and such. My mil called me and I told her to take him to the ER. They kept him for 5 days. They worried about brain damage, but he seems about the same.
then he had a very high blood sugar if he ate sugary junk, my coworker DH was brought to ER with blood glucose of 1042, no kidding, he lost 50 pounds in a months and was in ICU for 4 days, until they stabilized him on insulin drip.

I guess he kinda follows an OWL. He eats hamburgers, but he doesn't get fries (I don't think, I don't live with him, so I'm not certain) and drinks a LOT of diet (aspartame) soda. And his weight is currently normal. He has a fairly active job.
Well, I am not sure what id your BIL situation, since some adults have poor diet prior to being Dx, and he may be very well late onset T1 or T1.5, who knows, with diabetes it is very complicated. There are also normal weight T2, so it is not linear. But I would like to see the pol going. Why some can be obese enitre life and never develop diabetes, while others -will? I wish doctors can answer it. it is just easy to say: lose weight and you will be fine, I say: not so fast!

[Lisa N]

Ok, I wanted to do this for some time. Let's start a poll to see how many overweight and obese on this forum are T2 diabetics. I am puzzled myself, being 30 pounds overweight made me T2, while I see some 100 oiunds heavier with no desease in sight? I always ask myself, do they have iron clad pancrease or simply have right genes? May be their weight is only caused by crappy diet, and once they change WOE, the weight comes off and they are healthy again. Not my case, definetely, weight loss did not reverse my condition, however, I am not a typical T2 either.
I am an exception may be, but let's start with others who are (were) 100 pounds overweight. Do they all have T2 diabetes???????????

Dina, you might get a better response and data if you started a new thread for your poll rather than getting it buried in this one. :idea: Perhaps in the General Health or Diabetes forum would be a good spot?

[2bthinner!]

http://www.lifeclinic.com/focus/diabetes/advances.asp#Insulin%20Pill
Insulin Pill
The discovery of a new polymer that may allow development of an effective insulin pill was reported at a recent meeting of the American Chemical Society. When the polymer is used as a pill coating, it allows insulin to get into the bloodstream without being destroyed by the digestive system. So far it has only been tested in animals. Some experts question whether insulin in pill form will prove useful, since dosing is so critical and often variable. Whatever they gave him, my mil and he thought it was insulin.

He is diabetic, and since he's not currently on insulin, he must be T2. His doctor (we have the same family doctor) calls me once in a while because he'd like to see him. But, he's 40+ years old. If he doesn't want to go, I can't make him. He seems to be controlling it. Like I said, his weight is good. He's active, and he's been told anyway, not to eat sugary cabrohydrates.

I didn't see where you started a poll elsewhere, so I hope you find this okay.

PS. My uncle is also diet controlled diabetic, but I don't believe he was ever hospitalized, or that sick. His doctor has him basically on low carb. He was telling me how the doctor told him to take a tablespoon of olive oil. He had a hard time with it, but he did it. His weight is normal too.

ETA: Maybe this is what he was on.
http://www.baptisthealth.net/bhs/en/health/library/alldetails/0,2585,3150_22304_28931656,00.html
Insulin Pill
Many people think that the insulin pill already exists, but the pills that patients take for diabetes care are not insulin. They are medicines that improve the way the body’s own insulin works. I wasn't there when my mil brought him back home, so I don't know exactly what the doctor told them.. I only know what my mil told me.