Please help a beginner(!) (get rid of my gut!)

[Markus]

Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about being
unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer belly.

I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then don't
drink much (5-6 pints). I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast,
and then a sandwich or salad for lunch, and every other day
will skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in the evenings
i'm definitely getting no more than 2000 calories a day. When
I don't it's more like 1000. a day.

I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm 24, only
5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I even need the
'2500' calories recomended for the average guy.

So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about an hour
and a half. I do 20 minutes on the high/uphill/interval
settings on an exercise bike, and i'm pretty nackered and
pouring with sweat after, but not so tried I can't go on. I've
been gradually upping the resistance but keeping to 20
minutes. I cover about 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit
a rowing machine and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then
use about 5-6 different resistance machines, doing 2 sets of
10 reps on each, and again have been gradually upping the
weight as I can.

I feel a lot fitter, and have some definition on most parts of
my body, apart from my belly/gut; it's still the same and
sticks out majorly. I've avoided intense situps since i'm told
I should concentrate on loosing bodyfat and just do say, 20-30
situps every other day to keep the muscle underneath toned...

Does anyone have any advice on what I can change to what
I'm doing right now? and how I can get rid of my sticky out
gut (ugh).

Thanks!

Feels good to be exercising at long last though!

[Curt James]

Markus wrote: [...]

> I do 20 minutes on the high/uphill/interval settings on an
> exercise bike, and i'm pretty nackered and pouring with
> sweat after, but not so tried I can't go on.

And so you should!

Have you ever read what competition bodybuilders often do
while cutting? I mean so far as cardio is concerned. Just 20
minutes is not what I'd call very serious.

I'm happily carting my Buddha belly around just now, but if I
was making a run for more Robert Schuh-like dimensions - he of
the 22-inch waist - well, I'd be certain to do a.m. and p.m.
cardio for at least 30 minutes each session.

[...]

> Does anyone have any advice on what I can change to what
> I'm doing right now? and how I can get rid of my sticky out
> gut (ugh).

Increase the cardio. Eat smaller meals more often, say five or
six meals a day. And, yes, check out http://theabsdiet.com/ or
pick up the book if it's available in your area.

Congratulations on returning to exercise. Best of luck with
your workouts.

--
Curt

[Shute]

On 19 Oct 2006 13:55:26 -0700, "Markus"
<markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

>Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about being
>unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer belly.
>
>I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then don't
>drink much (5-6 pints). I will eat musli/cerial for
>breakfast, and then a sandwich or salad for lunch, and every
>other day will skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in
>the evenings i'm definitely getting no more than 2000
>calories a day. When I don't it's more like 1000. a day.
>
>I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm 24, only
>5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I even need the
>'2500' calories recomended for the average guy.
>
>So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about an hour
>and a half. I do 20 minutes on the high/uphill/interval
>settings on an exercise bike, and i'm pretty nackered and
>pouring with sweat after, but not so tried I can't go on.
>I've been gradually upping the resistance but keeping to 20
>minutes. I cover about 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit
>a rowing machine and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then
>use about 5-6 different resistance machines, doing 2 sets of
>10 reps on each, and again have been gradually upping the
>weight as I can.
>
>I feel a lot fitter, and have some definition on most parts
>of my body, apart from my belly/gut; it's still the same and
>sticks out majorly. I've avoided intense situps since i'm
>told I should concentrate on loosing bodyfat and just do
>say, 20-30 situps every other day to keep the muscle
>underneath toned...
>
>Does anyone have any advice on what I can change to what
>I'm doing right now? and how I can get rid of my sticky out
>gut (ugh).
>
>Thanks!
>
>Feels good to be exercising at long last though!

This might not help with the weight but I would change a
couple of things in your routine. I would do the weight
training before the cardio workout. I think you will get more
out of it if you are fresh whereas the cardio it doesn't
really matter. I also wouldn't skip meals. You can keep it
light and just eat an apple or something if you want.

Everything else looks o.k. Have you been tracking body fat
percentage and how much your weigh? On men the beer belly can
be the last thing to go. It may be gradually shrinking but you
just haven't noticed yet. If it really isn't working try
adding another ten minutes of cardio each day.

[Dz]

Shute <Shute@nowhere.com> wrote:
> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about being
>>unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer belly.
>>
>>I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then don't
>>drink much (5-6 pints). I will eat musli/cerial for
>>breakfast, and then a sandwich or salad for lunch, and every
>>other day will skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in
>>the evenings i'm definitely getting no more than 2000
>>calories a day. When I don't it's more like 1000. a day.
...

> I also wouldn't skip meals. You can keep it light and just
> eat an apple or something if you want.

There is nothing wrong with skipping meals, if it doesn't
provoke binging. I eat only in the evening. No beer belly.

[Steve Frei]

"Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:1161291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about being
> unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer belly.
>
> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then don't
> drink much (5-6 pints).

5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink much?" For
me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think a pint or two
qualifies as not much.

> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a sandwich
> or salad for lunch, and every other day will skip dinner
> completely, and when I do eat in the evenings i'm definitely
> getting no more than 2000 calories a day. When I don't it's
> more like 1000. a day.
>
> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm 24,
> only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I even
> need the '2500' calories recomended for the average guy.
>
> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about an
> hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the high/uphill/interval
> settings on an exercise bike, and i'm pretty nackered and
> pouring with sweat after, but not so tried I can't go on.
> I've been gradually upping the resistance but keeping to 20
> minutes. I cover about 8km at the moment. After this i'll
> hit a rowing machine and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll
> then use about 5-6 different resistance machines, doing 2
> sets of 10 reps on each, and again have been gradually
> upping the weight as I can.

High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best use of
your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the bike on a
lower resistance - I use the lowest or nearly the lowest
setting - and work on a smooth, fast "spin" type of cadence of
at least 90 rpm, even 100 rpm or more is good. You will get
healthy knees and good cardio benefit this way. Then spend
your energy with weights to work against resistance.

> I feel a lot fitter, and have some definition on most parts
> of my body, apart from my belly/gut; it's still the same and
> sticks out majorly. I've avoided intense situps since i'm
> told I should concentrate on loosing bodyfat and just do
> say, 20-30 situps every other day to keep the muscle
> underneath toned...

Any resistance exercise is going to be helpful to you at this
point - just keep experimenting and finding what you enjoy
doing. When you can, squats and/or deadlifts will give your
midsection a good workout, too.

> Does anyone have any advice on what I can change to what
> I'm doing right now? and how I can get rid of my sticky out
> gut (ugh).

It sounds to me like you're doing pretty well. Keep paying
attention to how you feel and remember that the best exercise
program is the one you actually do - don't overtrain, don't
get injured, don't force yourself to do things that are
completely unpleasant to you, and enjoy the results you will
be getting.

-S- http://www.kbnj.com

> Thanks!
>
> Feels good to be exercising at long last though!

[Bully]

Shute wrote:
> On 19 Oct 2006 13:55:26 -0700, "Markus"
> <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something
>> about being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a
>> saggy beer belly.
>>
>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then
>> don't drink much (5-6 pints). I will eat musli/cerial for
>> breakfast, and then a sandwich or salad for lunch, and
>> every other day will skip dinner completely, and when I
>> do eat in the evenings i'm definitely getting no more
>> than 2000 calories a day. When I don't it's more like
>> 1000. a day.

How many grams of protein per day? How much fat?

>>
>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm 24,
>> only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I even
>> need the '2500' calories recomended for the average guy.
>>
>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about an
>> hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>> high/uphill/interval

Which high setting; most bikes have a setting relating
to levels?

> settings on an
>> exercise bike, and i'm pretty nackered and pouring with
>> sweat after, but not so tried I can't go on. I've been
>> gradually upping the resistance but keeping to 20 minutes.
>> I cover about 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit a
>> rowing machine and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes.

To be honest with you, that's quite feeble. I'm just on my way
back to building my aerobic endurance, and looking at my log I
did 3.5k a few weeks ago in 13mins 38secs.

> I'll then use about 5-6 different resistance machines,
>> doing 2 sets of 10 reps on each, and again have been
>> gradually upping the weight as I can.
>>
>> I feel a lot fitter, and have some definition on most parts
>> of my body, apart from my belly/gut; it's still the same
>> and sticks out majorly. I've avoided intense situps since
>> i'm told I should concentrate on loosing bodyfat and just
>> do say, 20-30 situps every other day to keep the muscle
>> underneath toned...
>>
>> Does anyone have any advice on what I can change to what
>> I'm doing right now? and how I can get rid of my sticky out
>> gut (ugh).
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> Feels good to be exercising at long last though!
>
> This might not help with the weight but I would change a
> couple of things in your routine. I would do the weight
> training before the cardio workout.

Absolutely agree with this. Do weights when you energy
is highest.

> I think you will get more out of it if you are fresh whereas
> the cardio it doesn't really matter. I also wouldn't skip
> meals. You can keep it light and just eat an apple or
> something if you want.
>
> Everything else looks o.k. Have you been tracking body fat
> percentage and how much your weigh? On men the beer belly
> can be the last thing to go. It may be gradually shrinking
> but you just haven't noticed yet. If it really isn't working
> try adding another ten minutes of cardio each day.

Yeah right; you really think another 40 kcals per day is gonna
make that much difference. That's 30 weeks to lose another
pound of lard!!!

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

[Bully]

Steve Freides wrote:
> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:116-
> 1291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something
>> about being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a
>> saggy beer belly.
>>
>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then
>> don't drink much (5-6 pints).
>
> 5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink much?" For
> me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think a pint or two
> qualifies as not much.
>> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a sandwich
>> or salad for lunch, and every other day will skip dinner
>> completely, and when I do eat in the evenings i'm
>> definitely getting no more than 2000 calories a day. When I
>> don't it's more like 1000. a day.
>>
>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm 24,
>> only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I even
>> need the '2500' calories recomended for the average guy.
>>
>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about an
>> hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>> high/uphill/interval settings on an exercise bike, and
>> i'm pretty nackered and pouring with sweat after, but
>> not so tried I can't go on. I've been gradually upping
>> the resistance but keeping to 20 minutes. I cover about
>> 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit a rowing machine
>> and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then use about
>> 5-6 different resistance machines, doing 2 sets of 10
>> reps on each, and again have been gradually upping the
>> weight as I can.
>
> High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best use of
> your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the bike on a
> lower resistance - I use the lowest or nearly the lowest
> setting - and work on a smooth, fast "spin" type of cadence
> of at least 90 rpm, even 100 rpm or more is good. You will
> get healthy knees and good cardio benefit this way.

WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate; don't
you think that has some bearing on the effectiveness of the
exercise????

[...]

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

[Steve Frei]

"Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
news:4ps8vqFkfjbfU1@individual.net...
> Steve Freides wrote:
>> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:11-
>> 61291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about
>>> being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer
>>> belly.
>>>
>>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then
>>> don't drink much (5-6 pints).
>>
>> 5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink much?" For
>> me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think a pint or two
>> qualifies as not much.
>>> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a sandwich
>>> or salad for lunch, and every other day will skip dinner
>>> completely, and when I do eat in the evenings i'm
>>> definitely getting no more than 2000 calories a day. When
>>> I don't it's more like 1000. a day.
>>>
>>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm 24,
>>> only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I even
>>> need the '2500' calories recomended for the average guy.
>>>
>>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about an
>>> hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>>> high/uphill/interval settings on an exercise bike, and
>>> i'm pretty nackered and pouring with sweat after, but not
>>> so tried I can't go on. I've been gradually upping the
>>> resistance but keeping to 20 minutes. I cover about 8km
>>> at the moment. After this i'll hit a rowing machine and
>>> do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then use about 5-6
>>> different resistance machines, doing 2 sets of 10 reps on
>>> each, and again have been gradually upping the weight as
>>> I can.
>>
>> High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best use of
>> your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the bike on a
>> lower resistance - I use the lowest or nearly the lowest
>> setting - and work on a smooth, fast "spin" type of cadence
>> of at least 90 rpm, even 100 rpm or more is good. You will
>> get healthy knees and good cardio benefit this way.
>
> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
> don't you think that has some bearing on the effectiveness
> of the exercise????

I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few minutes
of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate rise quite a
bit, even with no resistance. You are invited to try 10
minutes of 95 rpm and report back if you don't believe me.

-S- http://www.kbnj.com

> [...]
>
>
> --
> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>
> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
> Dr. Seuss

[Shute]

On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 05:48:55 +0000 (UTC), DZ
<8107@1031315582.326227082.32547.28726.3027> wrote:

>There is nothing wrong with skipping meals, if it doesn't
>provoke binging. I eat only in the evening. No beer belly.

I don't think it is wrong. I just think the benefits are not
as great as the seem to be. My body will slow itself down to
adjust for the skipped meal. I have less energy so I don't
feel as good and I burn less calories. On top of that my
digestive system gets sluggish. I feel much better if I just
eat something light. And because my metabolism doesn't slow
down I think I burn up most of the calories.

Everybody's body is different in this sense. Yours may react
in a completely different way.

[Dz]

Shute <Shute@nowhere.com> wrote:
> DZ wrote:
>>There is nothing wrong with skipping meals, if it doesn't
>>provoke binging. I eat only in the evening. No beer belly.
>
> I don't think it is wrong. I just think the benefits are not
> as great as the seem to be. My body will slow itself down to
> adjust for the skipped meal. I have less energy so I don't
> feel as good and I burn less calories. On top of that my
> digestive system gets sluggish. I feel much better if I just
> eat something light. And because my metabolism doesn't slow
> down I think I burn up most of the calories. Everybody's
> body is different in this sense. Yours may react in a
> completely different way.

You wouldn't need to burn more calories because by skipping a
meal you had not consumed them in the first place. Also, the
"slow down" of metabolism rate is mostly a fairy tale. The
rate, being a scaled quantity that accounts for the decrease
in weight, doesn't decrease. See here - http://www.sciam.com/-
article.cfm?chanID=sa006&colID=1&articleID=000B73EB-3380-13F6-
-B38083414B7F0000

"Understanding the mechanisms by which calorie restriction
works ... and developing medicines that reproduce its health
benefits have been tantalizing goals for decades ... The
phenomenon was long attributed to a simple slowing down of
metabolism ... But this view now appears to be incorrect.
Calorie restriction does not slow metabolism in mammals..."

In the "Biosphere" experiment the starved participants showed
a modest reduction in spent calories but that was explained by
the difference in activity.

[Shute]

On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 07:02:32 +0100, "Bully"
<bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote:

>> Everything else looks o.k. Have you been tracking body fat
>> percentage and how much your weigh? On men the beer belly
>> can be the last thing to go. It may be gradually shrinking
>> but you just haven't noticed yet. If it really isn't
>> working try adding another ten minutes of cardio each day.
>
>Yeah right; you really think another 40 kcals per day is
>gonna make that much difference. That's 30 weeks to lose
>another pound of lard!!!

Well I can burn 140 calories in 10 minutes. I think that can
make difference. Besides I don't think he is doing anything
wrong unless he is just strutting along doing the cardio. His
body is resisting and I think changing any factor could
switch him toward burning fat. Once during my weight loss I
had switched to a 4 day workout. For two weeks I stopped
losing weight until I switched back. That doesn't make any
sense but that is what happened. The body doesn't always do
the logical thing.

[Bully]

Steve Freides wrote:
> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
> news:4ps8vqFkfjbfU1@individual.net...
>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:1-
>>> 161291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about
>>>> being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer
>>>> belly.
>>>>
>>>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then
>>>> don't drink much (5-6 pints).
>>>
>>> 5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink much?"
>>> For me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think a pint or
>>> two qualifies as not much.
>>>> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a
>>>> sandwich or salad for lunch, and every other day will
>>>> skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in the evenings
>>>> i'm definitely getting no more than 2000 calories a day.
>>>> When I don't it's more like 1000. a day.
>>>>
>>>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm 24,
>>>> only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I even
>>>> need the '2500' calories recomended for the average guy.
>>>>
>>>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about an
>>>> hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>>>> high/uphill/interval settings on an exercise bike, and
>>>> i'm pretty nackered and pouring with sweat after, but not
>>>> so tried I can't go on. I've been gradually upping the
>>>> resistance but keeping to 20 minutes. I cover about 8km
>>>> at the moment. After this i'll hit a rowing machine and
>>>> do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then use about 5-6
>>>> different resistance machines, doing 2 sets of 10 reps on
>>>> each, and again have been gradually upping the weight as
>>>> I can.
>>>
>>> High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best use
>>> of your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the bike
>>> on a lower resistance - I use the lowest or nearly the
>>> lowest setting - and work on a smooth, fast "spin" type
>>> of cadence of at least 90 rpm, even 100 rpm or more is
>>> good. You will get healthy knees and good cardio benefit
>>> this way.
>>
>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
>> don't you think that has some bearing on the effectiveness
>> of the exercise????
>
> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance.

So, let's get this straight. 3 mins of 95RPM, no
resistance????

> You are invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report back
> if you don't believe me.

Oh, 10 minutes then?

>
> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>
>
>> [...]
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>
>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>> Dr. Seuss

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

[Bully]

Shute wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 07:02:32 +0100, "Bully"
> <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote:
>
>>> Everything else looks o.k. Have you been tracking body fat
>>> percentage and how much your weigh? On men the beer belly
>>> can be the last thing to go. It may be gradually shrinking
>>> but you just haven't noticed yet. If it really isn't
>>> working try adding another ten minutes of cardio each day.
>>
>> Yeah right; you really think another 40 kcals per day is
>> gonna make that much difference. That's 30 weeks to lose
>> another pound of lard!!!
>
> Well I can burn 140 calories in 10 minutes.

How do you know this?

> I think that can make difference.

> Besides I don't think he is doing anything wrong unless he
> is just strutting along doing the cardio.

He is. I had already pointed that out!

> His body is resisting and I think changing any factor could
> switch him toward burning fat. Once during my weight loss I
> had switched to a 4 day workout. For two weeks I stopped
> losing weight until I switched back. That doesn't make any
> sense but that is what happened. The body doesn't always do
> the logical thing.

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

[Steve Frei]

"Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
news:4pt30uFkf93kU1@individual.net...
> Steve Freides wrote:
>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>> news:4ps8vqFkfjbfU1@individual.net...
>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news:-
>>>> 1161291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>>>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about
>>>>> being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer
>>>>> belly.
>>>>>
>>>>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then
>>>>> don't drink much (5-6 pints).
>>>>
>>>> 5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink much?"
>>>> For me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think a pint or
>>>> two qualifies as not much.
>>>>> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a
>>>>> sandwich or salad for lunch, and every other day will
>>>>> skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in the
>>>>> evenings i'm definitely getting no more than 2000
>>>>> calories a day. When I don't it's more like 1000. a day.
>>>>>
>>>>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm 24,
>>>>> only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I even
>>>>> need the '2500' calories recomended for the average guy.
>>>>>
>>>>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about an
>>>>> hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>>>>> high/uphill/interval settings on an exercise bike, and
>>>>> i'm pretty nackered and pouring with sweat after, but
>>>>> not so tried I can't go on. I've been gradually upping
>>>>> the resistance but keeping to 20 minutes. I cover about
>>>>> 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit a rowing machine
>>>>> and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then use about
>>>>> 5-6 different resistance machines, doing 2 sets of 10
>>>>> reps on each, and again have been gradually upping the
>>>>> weight as I can.
>>>>
>>>> High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best use
>>>> of your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the bike
>>>> on a lower resistance - I use the lowest or nearly the
>>>> lowest setting - and work on a smooth, fast "spin" type
>>>> of cadence of at least 90 rpm, even 100 rpm or more is
>>>> good. You will get healthy knees and good cardio benefit
>>>> this way.
>>>
>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
>>> don't you think that has some bearing on the effectiveness
>>> of the exercise????
>>
>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance.
>
> So, let's get this straight. 3 mins of 95RPM, no
> resistance????
>
>> You are invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report back
>> if you don't believe me.
>
> Oh, 10 minutes then?

Yes.

-S- http://www.kbnj.com

>>
>> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>>
>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>>
>>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>>> Dr. Seuss
>
>
>
> --
> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>
> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
> Dr. Seuss

[Shute]

On Fri, 20 Oct 2006 20:31:01 +0000 (UTC), DZ
<12561@1563620975.156389942.30190.20227.5791> wrote:

>You wouldn't need to burn more calories because by skipping a
>meal you had not consumed them in the first place. Also, the
>"slow down" of metabolism rate is mostly a fairy tale. The
>rate, being a scaled quantity that accounts for the decrease
>in weight, doesn't decrease. See here - http://www.sciam.com-
>/article.cfm?chanID=sa006&colID=1&articleID=000B73EB-3380-13-
>F6-B38083414B7F0000
>
>"Understanding the mechanisms by which calorie restriction
>works ... and developing medicines that reproduce its health
>benefits have been tantalizing goals for decades ... The
>phenomenon was long attributed to a simple slowing down of
>metabolism ... But this view now appears to be incorrect.
>Calorie restriction does not slow metabolism in mammals..."
>
>In the "Biosphere" experiment the starved participants showed
>a modest reduction in spent calories but that was explained
>by the difference in activity.

Except you are talking about calorie restriction and I am
talking about skipping a meal. I think if you ate three
lighter meals in a day it wouldn't have the same impact as
skipping a meal altogether. For years I have heard of studies
saying children having breakfast do better in school. I think
it can cause the body to panic and slow down. Think about it.
If your employer suddenly starting paying you less it might
worry you some. But if they just stopped paying anything you
might panic. I don't think this happens in everybody. It could
be more psychological than physiological.

My information comes from personal experience. When I was a
high school wrestler I had to make weight in order to compete.
Just an eighth of a pound could make the difference between
qualifying or not. When I skipped lunch it saved me 1/4 of a
pound. Yet I was tired and wrestled like shit. If I ate I
could have easily have run off the 1/4 of a pound and still
had plenty of energy left. You need to be on a really strict
diet like this to see the difference.

[Bully]

Steve Freides wrote:
> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
> news:4pt30uFkf93kU1@individual.net...
>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>>> news:4ps8vqFkfjbfU1@individual.net...
>>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>>> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news-
>>>>> :1161291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about
>>>>>> being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer
>>>>>> belly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then
>>>>>> don't drink much (5-6 pints).
>>>>>
>>>>> 5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink much?"
>>>>> For me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think a pint or
>>>>> two qualifies as not much.
>>>>>> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a
>>>>>> sandwich or salad for lunch, and every other day will
>>>>>> skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in the
>>>>>> evenings i'm definitely getting no more than 2000
>>>>>> calories a day. When I don't it's more like 1000. a
>>>>>> day.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm
>>>>>> 24, only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I
>>>>>> even need the '2500' calories recomended for the
>>>>>> average guy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about
>>>>>> an hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>>>>>> high/uphill/interval settings on an exercise bike, and
>>>>>> i'm pretty nackered and pouring with sweat after, but
>>>>>> not so tried I can't go on. I've been gradually upping
>>>>>> the resistance but keeping to 20 minutes. I cover about
>>>>>> 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit a rowing machine
>>>>>> and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then use about
>>>>>> 5-6 different resistance machines, doing 2 sets of 10
>>>>>> reps on each, and again have been gradually upping the
>>>>>> weight as I can.
>>>>>
>>>>> High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best use
>>>>> of your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the bike
>>>>> on a lower resistance
>>>>> - I use the lowest or nearly the lowest setting - and
>>>>> work on a smooth, fast "spin" type of cadence of at
>>>>> least 90 rpm, even 100 rpm or more is good. You will
>>>>> get healthy knees and good cardio benefit this way.
>>>>
>>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
>>>> don't you think that has some bearing on the
>>>> effectiveness of the exercise????
>>>
>>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance.
>>
>> So, let's get this straight. 3 mins of 95RPM, no
>> resistance????
>>
>>> You are invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report
>>> back if you don't believe me.
>>
>> Oh, 10 minutes then?
>
> Yes.
>
> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>
>>>
>>> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>>>
>>>
>>>> [...]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>>>
>>>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>>>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>>>> Dr. Seuss
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>
>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>> Dr. Seuss

...with no resistance?

OK after squats on Monday, wearing my HRM, I'll do 10 mins of
low resistance then 10 mins of hill/intervals at l15 and
report back here.

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

[Bully]

Steve Freides wrote:
> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
> news:4pt30uFkf93kU1@individual.net...
>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>>> news:4ps8vqFkfjbfU1@individual.net...
>>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>>> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message news-
>>>>> :1161291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>>>>>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about
>>>>>> being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer
>>>>>> belly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then
>>>>>> don't drink much (5-6 pints).
>>>>>
>>>>> 5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink much?"
>>>>> For me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think a pint or
>>>>> two qualifies as not much.
>>>>>> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a
>>>>>> sandwich or salad for lunch, and every other day will
>>>>>> skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in the
>>>>>> evenings i'm definitely getting no more than 2000
>>>>>> calories a day. When I don't it's more like 1000. a
>>>>>> day.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm
>>>>>> 24, only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt I
>>>>>> even need the '2500' calories recomended for the
>>>>>> average guy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about
>>>>>> an hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>>>>>> high/uphill/interval settings on an exercise bike, and
>>>>>> i'm pretty nackered and pouring with sweat after, but
>>>>>> not so tried I can't go on. I've been gradually upping
>>>>>> the resistance but keeping to 20 minutes. I cover about
>>>>>> 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit a rowing machine
>>>>>> and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then use about
>>>>>> 5-6 different resistance machines, doing 2 sets of 10
>>>>>> reps on each, and again have been gradually upping the
>>>>>> weight as I can.
>>>>>
>>>>> High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best use
>>>>> of your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the bike
>>>>> on a lower resistance
>>>>> - I use the lowest or nearly the lowest setting - and
>>>>> work on a smooth, fast "spin" type of cadence of at
>>>>> least 90 rpm, even 100 rpm or more is good. You will
>>>>> get healthy knees and good cardio benefit this way.
>>>>
>>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
>>>> don't you think that has some bearing on the
>>>> effectiveness of the exercise????
>>>
>>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance.
>>
>> So, let's get this straight. 3 mins of 95RPM, no
>> resistance????
>>
>>> You are invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report
>>> back if you don't believe me.
>>
>> Oh, 10 minutes then?
>
> Yes.
>
> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>
>>>
>>> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>>>
>>>
>>>> [...]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>>>
>>>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>>>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>>>> Dr. Seuss
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>
>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>> Dr. Seuss

BTW: what was that about "You will get healthy knees " ?

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

[Dz]

Shute <Shute@nowhere.com> wrote:
> DZ wrote:
>>You wouldn't need to burn more calories because by skipping
>>a meal you had not consumed them in the first place. Also,
>>the "slow down" of metabolism rate is mostly a fairy tale.
>>The rate, being a scaled quantity that accounts for the
>>decrease in weight, doesn't decrease. See here - http://www-
>>.sciam.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa006&colID=1&articleID=000B7-
>>3EB-3380-13F6-B38083414B7F0000
>>
>>"Understanding the mechanisms by which calorie restriction
>>works ... and developing medicines that reproduce its health
>>benefits have been tantalizing goals for decades ... The
>>phenomenon was long attributed to a simple slowing down of
>>metabolism ... But this view now appears to be incorrect.
>>Calorie restriction does not slow metabolism in mammals..."
>>
>>In the "Biosphere" experiment the starved participants
>>showed a modest reduction in spent calories but that was
>>explained by the difference in activity.
>
> Except you are talking about calorie restriction and I am
> talking about skipping a meal.

Then you're way off -

OP wrote: "when I do eat in the evenings i'm definitely
getting no more than 2000 calories a day. When I don't it's
more like 1000 a day."

That's calorie restriction by skipping a meal.

[Steve Frei]

"Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
news:4pttfuFkacpqU1@individual.net...
> Steve Freides wrote:
>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>> news:4pt30uFkf93kU1@individual.net...
>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>>>> news:4ps8vqFkfjbfU1@individual.net...
>>>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>>>> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message new-
>>>>>> s:1161291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com-
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something about
>>>>>>> being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a saggy beer
>>>>>>> belly.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even then
>>>>>>> don't drink much (5-6 pints).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink much?"
>>>>>> For me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think a pint
>>>>>> or two qualifies as not much.
>>>>>>> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a
>>>>>>> sandwich or salad for lunch, and every other day will
>>>>>>> skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in the
>>>>>>> evenings i'm definitely getting no more than 2000
>>>>>>> calories a day. When I don't it's more like 1000. a
>>>>>>> day.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm
>>>>>>> 24, only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt
>>>>>>> I even need the '2500' calories recomended for the
>>>>>>> average guy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about
>>>>>>> an hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>>>>>>> high/uphill/interval settings on an exercise bike, and
>>>>>>> i'm pretty nackered and pouring with sweat after, but
>>>>>>> not so tried I can't go on. I've been gradually upping
>>>>>>> the resistance but keeping to 20 minutes. I cover
>>>>>>> about 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit a rowing
>>>>>>> machine and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes. I'll then
>>>>>>> use about 5-6 different resistance machines, doing 2
>>>>>>> sets of 10 reps on each, and again have been gradually
>>>>>>> upping the weight as I can.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best use
>>>>>> of your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the bike
>>>>>> on a lower resistance
>>>>>> - I use the lowest or nearly the lowest setting - and
>>>>>> work on a smooth, fast "spin" type of cadence of at
>>>>>> least 90 rpm, even 100 rpm or more is good. You will
>>>>>> get healthy knees and good cardio benefit this way.
>>>>>
>>>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
>>>>> don't you think that has some bearing on the
>>>>> effectiveness of the exercise????
>>>>
>>>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>>>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>>>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance.
>>>
>>> So, let's get this straight. 3 mins of 95RPM, no
>>> resistance????
>>>
>>>> You are invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report
>>>> back if you don't believe me.
>>>
>>> Oh, 10 minutes then?
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>>
>>>>
>>>> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> [...]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>>>>
>>>>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>>>>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>>>>> Dr. Seuss
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>>
>>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>>> Dr. Seuss
>
> BTW: what was that about "You will get healthy knees " ?

The classic formula for cardio is time plus low resistance.
Think running, think spinning a bike at a high cadence in an
easy gear, think swimming a mile. If you take the cadence high
enough, even with _negative_ resistance, your pulse will get
right up there. If you don't believe me, ride a fixed gear
bicycle down a steep hill - I've done it, hit close to 180
rpm, at which point one's legs look more like a sewing machine
than a bicyclist, and you are actually resisting the forward
motion of the pedals - makes no difference, your heart rate
will be through the roof. If you want to give the cardio the
real test, keep the revs at 100 or higher.

For joint health, the classic formula is high repetitions -
doing a particular joint health movement for the number of
repetitions that matches your age in years is often suggested.
If you are well fit on a bicycle and spin a high cadence, you
will almost never have knee problems and you'll have healthy
knees. Problems arise mostly from poor bike fit and pushing
too big a gear at too low a cadence.

-S- http://www.kbnj.com

> --
> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>
> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
> Dr. Seuss

[Edward Sch]

Steve Freides wrote:
> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
<snip>
> > WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
> > don't you think that has some bearing on the effectiveness
> > of the exercise????
>
> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance. You are invited
> to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report back if you don't
> believe me.

pedalling 90-100rpm at the lowest resistance on an exercise
bike won't get my heartrate above 100bpm. at a medium
resistance (5 of 10) will get me to about 140. 8-9 will get me
upwards of 170...

[Steve Frei]

"Edward Scholl" <edscholl@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1161558033.482117.130790@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
> Steve Freides wrote:
>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
> <snip>
>> > WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
>> > don't you think that has some bearing on the
>> > effectiveness of the exercise????
>>
>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance. You are invited
>> to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report back if you don't
>> believe me.
>
> pedalling 90-100rpm at the lowest resistance on an exercise
> bike won't get my heartrate above 100bpm. at a medium
> resistance (5 of 10) will get me to about 140. 8-9 will get
> me upwards of 170...

I have yet to see _any_ non-cyclists who can sustain 100
rpm for 10 minutes, let alone have it not get their
heart rates up.

-S- http://www.kbnj.com

[Ed]

In news:4q2jbsFlblecU1@individual.net, Steve Freides
<steve@fridayscomputer.com> typed:
> "Edward Scholl" <edscholl@gmail.com> wrote in message news:-
> 1161558033.482117.130790@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>> <snip>
>>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
>>>> don't you think that has some bearing on the
>>>> effectiveness of the exercise????
>>>
>>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance. You are invited
>>> to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report back if you don't
>>> believe me.
>>
>> pedalling 90-100rpm at the lowest resistance on an exercise
>> bike won't get my heartrate above 100bpm. at a medium
>> resistance (5 of
>> 10) will get me to about 140. 8-9 will get me upwards of
>> 170...
>
> I have yet to see _any_ non-cyclists who can sustain 100
> rpm for 10 minutes, let alone have it not get their heart
> rates up.

it gets it up- just not a whole lot... my g/f can also sustain
100rpm for waaay more than 10 minutes, and i wouldn't really
call her a 'cyclist'- she uses the exercise bike for cardio at
the gym, and hasn't even done it for that long. a high cadence
feels unnatural for someone unused to it, but people adapt
REALLY quick. my g/f could do it w/in a week or two on the
exercise bike (w/ resistance)

[Steve Frei]

"ed" <news_test@no-atwistedweb-spam.com> wrote in message
news:i6V_g.15293$GR.3642@newssvr29.news.prodigy.net...
> In news:4q2jbsFlblecU1@individual.net, Steve Freides
> <steve@fridayscomputer.com> typed:
>> "Edward Scholl" <edscholl@gmail.com> wrote in message news-
>> :1161558033.482117.130790@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>>> <snip>
>>>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart rate;
>>>>> don't you think that has some bearing on the
>>>>> effectiveness of the exercise????
>>>>
>>>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>>>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>>>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance. You are
>>>> invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report back if
>>>> you don't believe me.
>>>
>>> pedalling 90-100rpm at the lowest resistance on an
>>> exercise bike won't get my heartrate above 100bpm. at a
>>> medium resistance (5 of
>>> 10) will get me to about 140. 8-9 will get me upwards of
>>> 170...
>>
>> I have yet to see _any_ non-cyclists who can sustain 100
>> rpm for 10 minutes, let alone have it not get their heart
>> rates up.
>
> it gets it up- just not a whole lot... my g/f can also
> sustain 100rpm for waaay more than 10 minutes, and i
> wouldn't really call her a 'cyclist'- she uses the exercise
> bike for cardio at the gym, and hasn't even done it for that
> long. a high cadence feels unnatural for someone unused to
> it, but people adapt REALLY quick. my g/f could do it w/in a
> week or two on the exercise bike (w/ resistance)

Well, y'all are exceptional. I've never seen anyone but me on
the exercise bike at the gym pedaling anything close to 100
rpm, and everyone I've invited to try hasn't been able to for
more than a few seconds. Part of the reason she may adapt
quickly is that exercise bike crank lengths tend to be
shorter, I think, than those on real bikes. I will have to
check on that.

-S- http://www.kbnj.com

[Ed]

In news:4q2ndvFjt3ahU1@individual.net, Steve Freides
<steve@fridayscomputer.com> typed:
> "ed" <news_test@no-atwistedweb-spam.com> wrote in message
> news:i6V_g.15293$GR.3642@newssvr29.news.prodigy.net...
>> In news:4q2jbsFlblecU1@individual.net, Steve Freides
>> <steve@fridayscomputer.com> typed:
>>> "Edward Scholl" <edscholl@gmail.com> wrote in message new-
>>> s:1161558033.482117.130790@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>>>> <snip>
>>>>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart
>>>>>> rate; don't you think that has some bearing on the
>>>>>> effectiveness of the exercise????
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>>>>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>>>>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance. You are
>>>>> invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report back if
>>>>> you don't believe me.
>>>>
>>>> pedalling 90-100rpm at the lowest resistance on an
>>>> exercise bike won't get my heartrate above 100bpm. at a
>>>> medium resistance (5 of
>>>> 10) will get me to about 140. 8-9 will get me upwards of
>>>> 170...
>>>
>>> I have yet to see _any_ non-cyclists who can sustain 100
>>> rpm for 10 minutes, let alone have it not get their heart
>>> rates up.
>>
>> it gets it up- just not a whole lot... my g/f can also
>> sustain 100rpm for waaay more than 10 minutes, and i
>> wouldn't really call her a 'cyclist'- she uses the exercise
>> bike for cardio at the gym, and hasn't even done it for
>> that long. a high cadence feels unnatural for someone
>> unused to it, but people adapt REALLY quick. my g/f could
>> do it w/in a week or two on the exercise bike (w/
>> resistance)
>
> Well, y'all are exceptional.

um, no. ;D

> I've never seen anyone but me on the exercise bike at the
> gym pedaling anything close to 100 rpm, and everyone I've
> invited to try hasn't been able to for more than a few
> seconds.

that's because most peoeple are not used to it, and don't try
to do it. a week or two, and they'd be fine.

> Part of the reason she may adapt quickly is that exercise
> bike crank lengths tend to be shorter, I think, than those
> on real bikes. I will have to check on that.

they are shorter.

[Bully]

Steve Freides wrote:
> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
> news:4pttfuFkacpqU1@individual.net...
>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>>> news:4pt30uFkf93kU1@individual.net...
>>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>>>>> news:4ps8vqFkfjbfU1@individual.net...
>>>>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>>>>> "Markus" <markus4412@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message ne-
>>>>>>> ws:1161291326.505134.182360@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.c-
>>>>>>> om...
>>>>>>>> Hi; about a month back I decided to do something
>>>>>>>> about being unfit, not toned/muscled and having a
>>>>>>>> saggy beer belly.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've cut down my drinking to once a week and even
>>>>>>>> then don't drink much (5-6 pints).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 5-6 pints at a sitting qualifies as "don't drink
>>>>>>> much?" For me, that would be a _lot_ of beer. I think
>>>>>>> a pint or two qualifies as not much.
>>>>>>>> I will eat musli/cerial for breakfast, and then a
>>>>>>>> sandwich or salad for lunch, and every other day will
>>>>>>>> skip dinner completely, and when I do eat in the
>>>>>>>> evenings i'm definitely getting no more than 2000
>>>>>>>> calories a day. When I don't it's more like 1000. a
>>>>>>>> day.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I drink a lot of water and am never that hungry, I'm
>>>>>>>> 24, only 5 foot 7 and weigh around 11stone so I doubt
>>>>>>>> I even need the '2500' calories recomended for the
>>>>>>>> average guy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So far, ever other day i've been in the gym for about
>>>>>>>> an hour and a half. I do 20 minutes on the
>>>>>>>> high/uphill/interval settings on an exercise bike,
>>>>>>>> and i'm pretty nackered and pouring with sweat after,
>>>>>>>> but not so tried I can't go on. I've been gradually
>>>>>>>> upping the resistance but keeping to 20 minutes. I
>>>>>>>> cover about 8km at the moment. After this i'll hit a
>>>>>>>> rowing machine and do about 3.5km for 20 minutes.
>>>>>>>> I'll then use about 5-6 different resistance
>>>>>>>> machines, doing 2 sets of 10 reps on each, and again
>>>>>>>> have been gradually upping the weight as I can.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> High resistance on an exercise bike is not the best
>>>>>>> use of your time in achieving overall fitness. Put the
>>>>>>> bike on a lower resistance - I use the lowest or
>>>>>>> nearly the lowest setting - and work on a smooth, fast
>>>>>>> "spin" type of cadence of at least 90 rpm, even 100
>>>>>>> rpm or more is good. You will get healthy knees and
>>>>>>> good cardio benefit this way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart
>>>>>> rate; don't you think that has some bearing on the
>>>>>> effectiveness of the exercise????
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>>>>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>>>>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance.
>>>>
>>>> So, let's get this straight. 3 mins of 95RPM, no
>>>> resistance????
>>>>
>>>>> You are invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report
>>>>> back if you don't believe me.
>>>>
>>>> Oh, 10 minutes then?
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>>> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> [...]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those
>>>>>> who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't
>>>>>> mind." - Dr. Seuss
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>>>
>>>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>>>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>>>> Dr. Seuss
>>
>> BTW: what was that about "You will get healthy knees " ?
>
> The classic formula for cardio is time plus low resistance.
^^^^^^^^^

What classis formula???

> Think running, think spinning a bike at a high cadence in an
> easy gear, think swimming a mile.

I thnk more along the lines of rowing 2,000m in 7 minutes. Or
interval sprints [lamposts]. Or hill intervals on a bike.

> If you take the cadence high enough, even with _negative_
> resistance, your pulse will get right up there. If you don't
> believe me, ride a fixed gear bicycle down a steep hill -
> I've done it, hit close to 180 rpm, at which point one's
> legs look more like a sewing machine than a bicyclist, and
> you are actually resisting the forward motion of the pedals
> - makes no difference, your heart rate will be through the
> roof. If you want to give the cardio the real test, keep the
> revs at 100 or higher.
>
> For joint health, the classic formula is high repetitions -
> doing a particular joint health movement for the number of
> repetitions that matches your age in years is often
> suggested.

Well, that's a totally new one on me!

> If you are well fit on a bicycle and spin a high cadence,
> you will almost never have knee problems and you'll have
> healthy knees. Problems arise mostly from poor bike fit and
> pushing too big a gear at too low a cadence.

Cite please!

> -S- http://www.kbnj.com
>
>
>> --
>> Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk
>>
>> "Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who
>> mind don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." -
>> Dr. Seuss

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

[Bully]

Steve Freides wrote:
> "ed" <news_test@no-atwistedweb-spam.com> wrote in message
> news:i6V_g.15293$GR.3642@newssvr29.news.prodigy.net...
>> In news:4q2jbsFlblecU1@individual.net, Steve Freides
>> <steve@fridayscomputer.com> typed:
>>> "Edward Scholl" <edscholl@gmail.com> wrote in message new-
>>> s:1161558033.482117.130790@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>>>> Steve Freides wrote:
>>>>> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
>>>> <snip>
>>>>>> WTF? So lowest resistance, 90rpm? What about heart
>>>>>> rate; don't you think that has some bearing on the
>>>>>> effectiveness of the exercise????
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm a long time bikie and I can assure you that a few
>>>>> minutes of 90-100 rpm pedalling will see your heart rate
>>>>> rise quite a bit, even with no resistance. You are
>>>>> invited to try 10 minutes of 95 rpm and report back if
>>>>> you don't believe me.
>>>>
>>>> pedalling 90-100rpm at the lowest resistance on an
>>>> exercise bike won't get my heartrate above 100bpm. at a
>>>> medium resistance (5 of
>>>> 10) will get me to about 140. 8-9 will get me upwards of
>>>> 170...
>>>
>>> I have yet to see _any_ non-cyclists who can sustain 100
>>> rpm for 10 minutes, let alone have it not get their heart
>>> rates up.
>>
>> it gets it up- just not a whole lot... my g/f can also
>> sustain 100rpm for waaay more than 10 minutes, and i
>> wouldn't really call her a 'cyclist'- she uses the exercise
>> bike for cardio at the gym, and hasn't even done it for
>> that long. a high cadence feels unnatural for someone
>> unused to it, but people adapt REALLY quick. my g/f could
>> do it w/in a week or two on the exercise bike (w/
>> resistance)
>
> Well, y'all are exceptional. I've never seen anyone but me
> on the exercise bike at the gym pedaling anything close to
> 100 rpm,

Most people who have a PT show them how to use an exercise
bike are instructed to pedal at 80 RPM. So, if you come to any
gym I've ever trained in, you will see most people pedalling
at "close to 100 RPM" !!!

> and everyone I've invited to try hasn't been able to for
> more than a few seconds. Part of the reason she may adapt
> quickly is that exercise bike crank lengths tend to be
> shorter, I think, than those on real bikes. I will have to
> check on that.
>
> -S- http://www.kbnj.com

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss

[Steve Frei]

"Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
news:4q3801Fku7flU1@individual.net...

-snip-

>> For joint health, the classic formula is high repetitions -
>> doing a particular joint health movement for the number of
>> repetitions that matches your age in years is often
>> suggested.
>
> Well, that's a totally new one on me!
>
>> If you are well fit on a bicycle and spin a high cadence,
>> you will almost never have knee problems and you'll have
>> healthy knees. Problems arise mostly from poor bike fit and
>> pushing too big a gear at too low a cadence.
>
> Cite please!

Pavel's "Super Joints" http://www.kbnj.com/sj.htm - has
numerous citations, programs, and whatever else you'd like to
read on the subject. Besides, visit a bike newsgroup or web
forum and ask.

-S- http://www.kbnj.com

[Bully]

Steve Freides wrote:
> "Bully" <bully1@proteinbars.co.ok> wrote in message
> news:4q3801Fku7flU1@individual.net...
>
> -snip-
>
>>> For joint health, the classic formula is high repetitions
>>> - doing a particular joint health movement for the number
>>> of repetitions that matches your age in years is often
>>> suggested.
>>
>> Well, that's a totally new one on me!
>>
>>> If you are well fit on a bicycle and spin a high cadence,
>>> you will almost never have knee problems and you'll have
>>> healthy knees. Problems arise mostly from poor bike fit
>>> and pushing too big a gear at too low a cadence.
>>
>> Cite please!
>
> Pavel's "Super Joints" http://www.kbnj.com/sj.htm - has
> numerous citations, programs, and whatever else you'd like
> to read on the subject.

I was actually looking for something a little more scientific
in nature.

> Besides, visit a bike newsgroup or web forum and ask.

--
Bully Protein bars: http://www.proteinbars.co.uk

"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind
don't matter, and those who matter don't mind." - Dr. Seuss