The Number of Seats in Low Carb Heaven

[LC Sponge]

I'm putting this here because as a less active thread it won't get pushed down too quickly. I'm also hoping that this being a "maintainer" area that it might be a natural stop for curious newbies.

There is no such thing as 'cheating' on this WOE. If refined white sugar finds it's way to your menu today it's because you put it there. That's not cheating. Putting an ace of spades on the bottom of the deck and then dealing it to yourself is cheating.

Cheating is doing something, generally considered to be illegal, with the intent of putting yourself farther ahead of others around you so that you are in a position of advantage. How does eating 1/2 chocolate cake give you an edge over me? There are NOT a limited number of seats in Low Carb Heaven. Eating 1/2 a chocolate cake is self-destructive - but it's not cheating.

Self Destruction to Feel Pain Eating that chocolate cake just put you farther from your own goal, and caused you to be depressed where yesterday you were happy. If you want to feel pain, next time, just set fire to your hair - that won't cause an insulin spike.

Self Destruction to Get Reassurance
We all jump in ("poor baby..it's ok don't worry") everytime a person admits to being self-destructive. Why should this behaviour be rewarded? Unfortunately that 1/2 chocolate cake often causes a lowering of the scale (for a myriad of reasons) and often reassures the loser that "cheating is good". That's OK, life is about learning lessons the hard way. That second 1/2 of chocolate cake won't have the same scale result. If you don't believe me, go ahead and eat it. If eating chocolate cake caused us to lose weight, there'd be a "Chocolate Cake Diet"

Self Destruction Because You Don't Like Yourself.
If you didn't like yourself just a LITTLE, you wouldn't be here. You wouldn't be registered on this board, and you certainly wouldn't be reading the maintenance area. Figure out what it is about yourself you DO like and dwell on that a lot.

Self Destruction Because 'There was nothing else I could eat'
Yeah yeah - the mother-in-law who serves carrot soup, thickened with potato and flour and Wonder Bread on the side. When you eat it because you are a nice person and want to please your mother in law, WHAT you ate just became part of today's plan. It wasn't self destructive at all. Do the carb count and include it in your journal. Like this: Todays Carbs 8,567 (dinner at MIL's - mental note - stop eating at MIL's house)

Self Destruction Because 'I didn't know it had carbs'.
"It was an accident officer, I hit that car because I didn't know it was parked. The second time I hit is was because I was just so mad at myself for hitting it the first time!". If you are ever fooled by carb count, let it be only once. Nobody's going to believe you the second time.

[Atriana]

LC - This is a great post!

[Homegirl]

I can dig it!

I record every thing I eat in my journal and post every day's menu no matter what it contains.

I have noticed that some will "skip" the days that they added foods that they feel quilty about and pick up their journals on the good days. For me, that doesn't work. I eat what I eat and don't rationalize not recording it in the hope that it will just disappear.

If I am living a diet that I can live with for the rest of my life, I have to be honest with myself about what I am going to include and when/why I include it. Being honest, for me, means keeping the food journal honest as well. When I am putting it on paper I am facing my own choices and consequences.

LC, you really are a deep thinker--thanks.

[jesdorka]

amen!

[Karen]

Wow Sponge!

Are you actually advocating that low-carbers educate themselves and take responsibility for their actions? What a concept! ;)

OK, sarcasm off.

Very well put Sponge. What about Self Destruction Not to Feel Pain?

Karen

[LC Sponge]

Karen - "Self Destruction not to feel pain" ?

I could buy into that if this was a board about alcohol or heroin. I don't think a carb high gets one high enough to "forget" about dieting, or needing to lose weight, or a crappy job, or self loathing, or an aching back. If eating carbs made a person temporarily "forget" about their station in life.... then this would make sense.

I think eating carbs is a pain-giving thing not an escape. Like the person who repeatedly bangs their head against a wall, or who picks their cuticles until they bleed. The objective for them is to increase pain to support self-loathing - immediate justification that: "I am unworthy of being treated well, even by myself". The drunk and the heroin addict are looking for the pain avoidance - the 'mind-numbing-forget'.

[gwilson38]

Excellant post Victoria! U always have such wisdom. How ya doing girl??

[Karen]

Karen - "Self Destruction not to feel pain" ?

If we assume that sugar is a drug, then why not? Besides the sugar high, there is also the process of eating that is temporarily numbing and feeling so lousy afterwards that there is nothing else that you feel.

The food addict is usually addicted to carbs. You don't find many people addicted to steak or asparagus. I also have a sneaking suspicion that those who leave low-carbing after being successful at it and regain weight might fall into this category. Why do people on this WOE gravitate towards carbs? Once you're past the physical addiction, it's something in your head that makes you crave them. What is it then, that thing that makes you crave when you know that it's really bad for you.

Of course, as with any addiction, it doesn't make any difference no matter how much of the drug you take. It won't change what ails you. It is, as you pointed out, pain giving, which is part of the vicious cycle of addiction.

Karen

[LC Sponge]

Originally posted by Karen


If we assume that sugar is a drug, then why not? Besides the sugar high, there is also the process of eating that is temporarily numbing and feeling so lousy afterwards that there is nothing else that you feel.

The food addict is usually addicted to carbs. You don't find many people addicted to steak or asparagus.
Karen

I don't dispute the addiction aspect, however I don't ever remember blacking out on chocolate chip cookies. When I used to light a cigarette the high was minor compared to other drugs, and I never did it to avoid pain. To give myself comfort perhaps. And maybe that's a further angle we should examine.

What do you think of: "Self Destruction as a way to Comfort the Inner Child" ?

[Karen]

I'm not a big 'inner child' follower, but I do have an 'inner chef'. ;)

What's the difference between comforting oneself with a substance, or using it to avoid pain?

Karen

[LC Sponge]

I love discussing issues with you. You make me think.

The difference is, it is possible to receive comfort without the pain going away.

I'm sad, I sob, I eat cookies - that's a hug for comfort, I still sob.

I'm sad, I sob, I drink 1/4 bottle of Jack Daniels, I wake up in Saskatchewan, surrounded my new 'friends'.

I'm not convinced that pain is "avoided" by carb eating, in the same way it is avoided in other addictions that are more physically altering. But I do recognize that there is a comfort element.

PS, I don't eat cookies or drink Jack Daniels - just for clarification in case anyone reading this isn't sure :)

[gwilson38]

Ok I know this is suppose to be a serious discussion however I cracked up when Victoria posted "when I drink JD I wake up in saskatchewan" When we eat carbs it raises our seritonin levels giving us a short "high" However we are still in control of what we are doing. The same cant be said for someone addicted to drugs or alcohol unfortuantely.

[Karen]

Bourbon and chocolate was one of my favourite flavour combinations. But bourbon, sour dried cherries and chocolate? Gives me the shivers...

Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that food addiction can be as serious as any other addiction.

It just appears to be a slower, "gentler" process. Anorexia and severe overeating are two sides to the same coin. You may not wake up in Saskatchewan surrounded by new friends, but you may wake up in the hospital with esophageal bleeding from throwing up. You may end up not having any friends because it's more important to stay at home in the dark surrounded by your favourite binge foods. Food becomes more important to you than anything else in your life. You would and do lie, cheat and steal for it.

Now that's an addiction!

Karen

[gwilson38]

I guess maybe I didnt spend enough time pondering these posts before replying. As a person who has suffered an eating disorder I can certainly see your point karen. I do truely believe tho that whatever your addiction may be....before U get to where the physical craving becomes a need, it starts out as an emotional problem that U are trying to mask by using "something" to make U feel better.

[LC Sponge]

Excellent perspectives Gale and Karen - I am seeing the light :)

[Mindyd]

Some very interesting points made here - and I think I like the part about eating something not on the plan is not "cheating".....it's strange that it's always been called that - in any diet plan....

I must admit that this is the first WOE where when I am even the slightest bit tempted to eat something wrong I am hit with a sensation of displeasure - meaning that though the memories of what chocolate chip cookies taste like are pleasing, the thought of actually putting one (or 20 ;) ) in my mouth gives me a bad feeling because I know it is wrong for me and my health and well-being. That has been truly an amazing thing to me, because I've not experienced that on any other diet plan...I'm assuming there is some sort of physiological reason for this - simply because my willpower is not now nor has ever been that strong...and the "I'll only have one" game begins and then after 19 more the "I'll start over tomorrow" game follows....

Comments?

[DoodleBug]

This is a great thread. Lots to really think about. I am back on induction for at least a week and then I am going to start pre-maintenaince. I just read Dr. Atkins latest version last night and feel that I am more prepared for it than I was a couple of years ago.

LC - I have been searching and reading all of your posts. I want to be a forever LC maintainer like you! Carbs and sugar make me feel horrible and I don't ever want to feel like that again. You are a great inspiration to me.

Gwilson - I too am a recovering ED sufferer. This WOE seems to work wonders for me. Sweets were always my downfall and this way I don't crave them so I am not tempted to binge. I was anorexic and then fell into bulimia from there. It is amazing what our emotions can cause us to do to our own bodies!

Karen - You always make me think! I always had a hard time seeing my ED as an addiction like any other, but you are right. I always felt "weak" because I couldn't control my eating and my feelings about it. Here I see that there are a lot of others struggling with the same issues. One on one therapy helped me to get into recovery, but it is not the same as hearing others that feel the same.

Mindyd - Your thoughts exactly echo my own! You said "I must admit that this is the first WOE where when I am even the slightest bit tempted to eat something wrong I am hit with a sensation of displeasure ..." This is what I have been experiencing also. With so many other eating plans when I could have a little of the sweet stuff it always turned into a lot before long. I always said that for me it is all or nothing and this way I am not tempted by the sweets at all. BTW, 20 chocolate chip cookies is a lot... ha ha ha... been there and definitely have done that! :D

I hope that this maintenance forum gets busier and I hope to be a part of it. I love this place and you are all the BEST!

Hugs,
Carrie
:sunny:

[LC Sponge]

Mindy - funny how willpower isn't a prerequisite for success on Low Carb Living. We were torturing ourselves on low-fat dieting. Without willpower we CAN'T low fat diet - it's like punishment for being fat.

Low Carb Living is about rewarding yourself for being healthy.

Think of it this way for a minute: Low Carb Living is not about weight loss. The weight loss is just an added bonus on the road to being all-round healthy. On Low Carb lifestyles, our body returns to it's ideal weight for healthy living. The increased energy is proof of that. It's a way of living that addresses ALL aspects of life. Low FAT dieting just focuses on weight loss alone.

Carrie - you already ARE a part of this maintenance area! Congratulations on reaching the final approach to the Weight Goal Landing Strip . :) Once you "arrive" you will be instrumental in guiding all the others in for a smooth arrival. :)

[bsayne]

I am reminded of an old 12-step saying that went something like this...You may be an addict if....

One is too many and a thousand is never enough!

If you truly feel this applies to anything in your life...it sure fits the addiction profile.

Or...
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, smells like a duck or talks like a duck....it probably is...Don't step in it!

Perception is in the eyes of the owner!

Thank you ladies for some thought provoking reading.

Bsayne

[Karen]

I always felt "weak" because I couldn't control my eating and my feelings about it. Here I see that there are a lot of others struggling with the same issues. One on one therapy helped me to get into recovery, but it is not the same as hearing others that feel the same.

This is one of the central themes of recovery from an addiction. Addicts try to control many aspects of their lives. The irony is, how can you control what you're addicted to if you're addicted to it? How can you control anything?

When I stumbled upon this truth, the other shoe dropped!

Karen