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TheCaveman
Sat, May-21-05, 20:45
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/sunshine___cancer


Scientists Say Sunshine May Prevent Cancer

By MARILYNN MARCHIONE, AP Medical Writer 48 minutes ago

Scientists are excited about a vitamin again. But unlike fads that sizzled and fizzled, the evidence this time is strong and keeps growing. If it bears out, it will challenge one of medicine's most fundamental beliefs: that people need to coat themselves with sunscreen whenever they're in the sun. Doing that may actually contribute to far more cancer deaths than it prevents, some researchers think.

The vitamin is D, nicknamed the "sunshine vitamin" because the skin makes it from ultraviolet rays. Sunscreen blocks its production, but dermatologists and health agencies have long preached that such lotions are needed to prevent skin cancer. Now some scientists are questioning that advice. The reason is that vitamin D increasingly seems important for preventing and even treating many types of cancer.

In the last three months alone, four separate studies found it helped protect against lymphoma and cancers of the prostate, lung and, ironically, the skin. The strongest evidence is for colon cancer.

Many people aren't getting enough vitamin D. It's hard to do from food and fortified milk alone, and supplements are problematic.

So the thinking is this: Even if too much sun leads to skin cancer, which is rarely deadly, too little sun may be worse.

No one is suggesting that people fry on a beach. But many scientists believe that "safe sun" — 15 minutes or so a few times a week without sunscreen — is not only possible but helpful to health.

One is Dr. Edward Giovannucci, a Harvard University professor of medicine and nutrition who laid out his case in a keynote lecture at a recent American Association for Cancer Research meeting in Anaheim, Calif.

His research suggests that vitamin D might help prevent 30 deaths for each one caused by skin cancer.

"I would challenge anyone to find an area or nutrient or any factor that has such consistent anti-cancer benefits as vitamin D," Giovannucci told the cancer scientists. "The data are really quite remarkable."

The talk so impressed the
American Cancer Society's chief epidemiologist, Dr. Michael Thun, that the society is reviewing its sun protection guidelines. "There is now intriguing evidence that vitamin D may have a role in the prevention as well as treatment of certain cancers," Thun said.

Even some dermatologists may be coming around. "I find the evidence to be mounting and increasingly compelling," said Dr. Allan Halpern, dermatology chief at Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center in New York, who advises several cancer groups.

The dilemma, he said, is a lack of consensus on how much vitamin D is needed or the best way to get it.

No source is ideal. Even if sunshine were to be recommended, the amount needed would depend on the season, time of day, where a person lives, skin color and other factors. Thun and others worry that folks might overdo it.

"People tend to go overboard with even a hint of encouragement to get more sun exposure," Thun said, adding that he'd prefer people get more of the nutrient from food or pills.

But this is difficult. Vitamin D occurs naturally in salmon, tuna and other oily fish, and is routinely added to milk. However, diet accounts for very little of the vitamin D circulating in blood, Giovannucci said.

Supplements contain the nutrient, but most use an old form — D-2 — that is far less potent than the more desirable D-3. Multivitamins typically contain only small amounts of D-2 and include vitamin A, which offsets many of D's benefits.

As a result, pills might not raise vitamin D levels much at all.

Government advisers can't even agree on an RDA, or recommended daily allowance for vitamin D. Instead, they say "adequate intake" is 200 international units a day up to age 50, 400 IUs for ages 50 to 70, and 600 IUs for people over 70.

Many scientists think adults need 1,000 IUs a day. Giovannucci's research suggests 1,500 IUs might be needed to significantly curb cancer.

How vitamin D may do this is still under study, but there are lots of reasons to think it can:

_Several studies observing large groups of people found that those with higher vitamin D levels also had lower rates of cancer. For some of these studies, doctors had blood samples to measure vitamin D, making the findings particularly strong. Even so, these studies aren't the gold standard of medical research — a comparison over many years of a large group of people who were given the vitamin with a large group who didn't take it. In the past, the best research has deflated health claims involving other nutrients, including vitamin E and beta carotene.

_Lab and animal studies show that vitamin D stifles abnormal cell growth, helps cells die when they are supposed to, and curbs formation of blood vessels that feed tumors.

_Cancer is more common in the elderly, and the skin makes less vitamin D as people age.

_Blacks have higher rates of cancer than whites and more pigment in their skin, which prevents them from making much vitamin D.

_Vitamin D gets trapped in fat, so obese people have lower blood levels of D. They also have higher rates of cancer.

_Diabetics, too, are prone to cancer, and their damaged kidneys have trouble converting vitamin D into a form the body can use.

_People in the northeastern United States and northerly regions of the globe like Scandinavia have higher cancer rates than those who get more sunshine year-round.

During short winter days, the sun's rays come in at too oblique an angle to spur the skin

to make vitamin D. That is why nutrition experts think vitamin D-3 supplements may be especially helpful during winter, and for dark-skinned people all the time.

But too much of the pill variety can cause a dangerous buildup of calcium in the body. The government says 2,000 IUs is the upper daily limit for anyone over a year old.

On the other hand, D from sunshine has no such limit. It's almost impossible to overdose when getting it this way. However, it is possible to get skin cancer. And this is where the dermatology establishment and Dr. Michael Holick part company.

Thirty years ago, Holick helped make the landmark discovery of how vitamin D works. Until last year, he was chief of endocrinology, nutrition and diabetes and a professor of dermatology at Boston University. Then he published a book, "The UV Advantage," urging people to get enough sunlight to make vitamin D.

"I am advocating common sense," not prolonged sunbathing or tanning salons, Holick said.

Skin cancer is rarely fatal, he notes. The most deadly form, melanoma, accounts for only 7,770 of the 570,280 cancer deaths expected to occur in the United States this year.

More than 1 million milder forms of skin cancer will occur, and these are the ones tied to chronic or prolonged suntanning.

Repeated sunburns — especially in childhood and among redheads and very fair-skinned people — have been linked to melanoma, but there is no credible scientific evidence that moderate sun exposure causes it, Holick contends.

"The problem has been that the American Academy of Dermatology has been unchallenged for 20 years," he says. "They have brainwashed the public at every level."

The head of Holick's department, Dr. Barbara Gilchrest, called his book an embarrassment and stripped him of his dermatology professorship, although he kept his other posts.

She also faulted his industry ties. Holick said the school has received $150,000 in grants from the Indoor Tanning Association for his research, far less than the consulting deals and grants that other scientists routinely take from drug companies.

In fact, industry has spent money attacking him. One such statement from the Sun Safety Alliance, funded in part by Coppertone and drug store chains, declared that "sunning to prevent vitamin D deficiency is like smoking to combat anxiety."

Earlier this month, the dermatology academy launched a "Don't Seek the Sun" campaign calling any advice to get sun "irresponsible." It quoted Dr. Vincent DeLeo, a Columbia University dermatologist, as saying: "Under no circumstances should anyone be misled into thinking that natural sunlight or tanning beds are better sources of vitamin D than foods or nutritional supplements."

That opinion is hardly unanimous, though, even among dermatologists.

"The statement that 'no sun exposure is good' I don't think is correct anymore," said Dr. Henry Lim, chairman of dermatology at Henry Ford Health System in Detroit and an academy vice president.

Some wonder if vitamin D may turn out to be like another vitamin, folate. High intake of it was once thought to be important mostly for pregnant women, to prevent birth defects. However, since food makers began adding extra folate to flour in 1998, heart disease, stroke, blood pressure, colon cancer and osteoporosis have all fallen, suggesting the general public may have been folate-deficient after all.

With vitamin D, "some people believe that it is a partial deficiency that increases the cancer risk," said Hector DeLuca, a University of Wisconsin-Madison biochemist who did landmark studies on the nutrient.

About a dozen major studies are under way to test vitamin D's ability to ward off cancer, said Dr. Peter Greenwald, chief of cancer prevention for the
National Cancer Institute. Several others are testing its potential to treat the disease. Two recent studies reported encouraging signs in prostate and lung cancer.

As for sunshine, experts recommend moderation until more evidence is in hand.

"The skin can handle it, just like the liver can handle alcohol," said Dr. James Leyden,

professor emeritus of dermatology at the University of Pennsylvania, who has consulted for sunscreen makers.

"I like to have wine with dinner, but I don't think I should drink four bottles a day."

___

On the Net:

Government information:

http://ods.od.nih.gov/factsheets/vitamind.asp

kwikdriver
Sat, May-21-05, 21:14
Most of the better supplements have been using D 3 for a while now.

Dodger
Sat, May-21-05, 21:45
For two years now, I have been following the natural suntan method of getting vitamin D. I don't allow myself to burn, but I increase sun exposure weekly. I only use sunscreen on the back of my neck after an hour or more of exposure during summer. I do wear a hat when the sun is at its highest. I was in the sun today for about a total of three hours (1 1/2 hour dog walk, 1 1/2 hour bike ride) and did not burn. I also live at 5000 ft elevation where the UV level is higher than at sea level. In addition to getting a nice tan, I am generating a lot of Vitamin D3 and other healthy chemicals.

I am of the opinion that avoiding the sun is just as bad as avoiding fat in the diet is. Humans evolved eating fat and getting tanned. Just like the low-fat diet craze has caused health problems, the avoid the sun craze has caused health problems. Just like limiting fat in the diet resulted in fatter people, limiting UV exposure has resulted in a higher cancer rate.

During the winter months, I do take a vitamin D supplement. Actually it is a calcium supplement that has vitamin D, magnesium and zinc. The vitamin D in the supplement is D3 (cholecalciferol), which is easier for the body to convert into the active form. The D2 form is ergosterol, which is plant based and more difficult for the body to convert.

It is a shame that the elderly, who in general need more vitamin D (for bone preservation), are being kept out of the sun because of skin cancer fears.

ojoj
Sun, May-22-05, 07:36
In a hurry so havent read the whole of the post, but I read somewhere that some "experts" now believe skin cancer maybe caused by a certain type of chemicals used in some sun screens??

http://www.second-opinions.co.uk/sunlight.html

Jo

mio1996
Sun, May-22-05, 08:35
Good article, Caveman! I have believed for years that the whole sunlight scare is just a lot of bunk!

Our species probably developed it's intelligence in the sun, we have long hunted our game in the sun, and cultures who stay in the sun the most have some of the lowest skin cancer rates. Moreover, many people get skin cancer in places where the sun never shines.

I for one feel much healthier with a natural suntan than without. These concepts are expounded on a little in a book called Death by Diet by Robert Barefoot. Many folks consider him to be a quack, but more of his ideas are being supported by truly sound science all the time.

acohn
Sun, May-22-05, 09:51
Naked at Noon is the title of a forthcoming book about vit. D. You can read more about it at http://sunlightandvitamind.com/. The thrust of the web page is the same as the article cited here. The online e-zine Wise Traditions has also published a vit. D article (http://www.westonaprice.org/basicnutrition/vitamindmiracle.html)by this author.

Since I'm a mostly indoor person, I make a blend of two cod liver oils, one low in vit. D and one high, to get about 500 IU/day. I'm hoping that Ca supplements w/ D3 and sunlight fulfill the rest of my vit. D needs.

emmy207
Sun, May-22-05, 09:51
Well we need sunshine to appear, right now it is nearly June and London is still cold, rainy and had about two warm sunny days this year.
I love the sun and I am heavily freckled so I do take care with sunscreen, I burn too easily not too. I think this issue can depend on skin type.

Kristine
Sun, May-22-05, 12:59
Good article. :thup: I never put on sunscreen unless there's a chance I'll actually burn; like if I was working outside in the sun. That's rare.

The Eadeses encourage regular sun exposure in Protein Power Lifeplan. :thup:

AJCole
Mon, May-23-05, 04:57
Yes, the Eades discuss this in PPL. They also talk about how skin cancer has increased as sunscreen usage has increased. I have been following their advice for 3 years. Try not to burn, build a gradual tan, but try not to look like a carrot:).

Dodger
Mon, May-23-05, 08:33
To show that the anti-sun lobby is still with us, here is an article from today: http://breakingnews.iol.ie/news/story.asp?j=143903980&p=y439x4686

Cancer warning over unprotected sun-tanning
23/05/2005 - 12:43:45

People are continuing to tan without adequate protection, despite the risk of developing skin cancer, a survey revealed today.

Even though most adults know the sun is the main cause of skin cancer, 74% have experienced sunburn.

The survey of 1,200 people aged over 15, which was carried out by the Irish Cancer Society, found that only 45% used a sunscreen with the recommended sun protection factor of 15 or more.

Another 34% said they never used any type of sunscreen. This practice was most common among men over 50 and especially in the farming community, where 56% said they never, ever, used sunscreen.

Only 23% of people using sunscreen said that they applied it correctly – 20 minutes before they went into the sun and every two hours while out in the sun.

The Irish Cancer Society said people were ignoring the risks of developing skin cancer.

“Despite yearly campaigns, judging from the results of this research we still have an immense amount of work to do in reaching out to the public and educating them on the risk of developing skin cancer and the need to be sun-smart,” said spokeswoman Dr Gillian Murphy.

Around 36% of people, mainly from wealthier backgrounds, said a tan was a sign of healthy skin, when the reality is that it indicates damaged skin.

Dr Murphy, who is a consultant dermatologist at Beaumont Hospital, said there was no such thing as a safe tan.

“People need to understand that experiencing sunburn not only increases the risk of skin cancer but it also causes premature ageing and disfigurement,” she said.

According to the National Cancer Registry, the number of skin cancer cases increased from 5,740 in 2000 to 5,798 in 2001. This included a rise in the number of cases of malignant melanoma, the most dangerous form of skin cancer, from 443 to 463.

There were 93 deaths from skin cancer in 2001.

Dr Murphy said that people were often unprepared for the sun’s rays due to the changeable Irish weather and added that they should carry adequate sunscreen with them.

According to the Irish Cancer Society, up to 90% of all cases of skin cancer are caused by the UV rays of the sun and are therefore preventable.

It is recommending under its ‘SunSmart’ code that people:

:: Avoid the sun when it is at its strongest – between 11am and 3pm

:: Wear adequate clothing to protect against the sun

:: Wear a wide-brimmed hat to protect ears, nose and back of the neck and sunglasses to protect the eyes.

:: Keep young babies out of the sun as much as possible.

The Irish Cancer Society is also recommending that people use fake tans instead of sun beds.

acohn
Mon, May-23-05, 21:55
I wonder if any of the research indicating health benefits from sunshine take account of the deteriorating ozone layer, which lets more of the harmful UV-C into the atmosphere?

ojoj
Tue, May-24-05, 02:52
I wonder if any of the research indicating health benefits from sunshine take account of the deteriorating ozone layer, which lets more of the harmful UV-C into the atmosphere?


I read somewhere that the apparent hole in the ozone layer had closed up again and "they'd" (whoever "they" are!?) decided that since time began the ozone layer has been prone to holes, change etc??

Jo

monster66
Tue, May-24-05, 06:48
I think for the most part, sun exposure it good and healthy for you. Of course you have those who go overboard with this as with other things. Common sense, which seems to lacking in so many people, should tell you how to approach tanning. When I am on the beach, I and my children wear sunscreen. When we are home and just playing outside where we are shaded partially, we dont wear it.

ojoj
Tue, May-24-05, 07:23
everything in moderation!

Jo

Angeline
Tue, May-24-05, 08:04
This whole anti-sun mania always made me wonder, how our ancestors survived spending all day in the sun. The possibility of spending most of your days indoor is a very very recent phenomenon. For most of our history, we spent the entire day out of doors, getting inside a shelter only to sleep or be protected from the elements. Wouldn't our ancestors all have died from cancer?

Dodger
Tue, May-24-05, 08:39
Wouldn't our ancestors all have died from cancer?

Well they all died of something!

kwikdriver
Tue, May-24-05, 09:09
This whole anti-sun mania always made me wonder, how our ancestors survived spending all day in the sun. The possibility of spending most of your days indoor is a very very recent phenomenon. For most of our history, we spent the entire day out of doors, getting inside a shelter only to sleep or be protected from the elements. Wouldn't our ancestors all have died from cancer?

The current lifespans we enjoy are very unusual from an historical standpoint. As recently as the turn of the last century, the life expetancy was around 50 years or so. People were dying of things like TB and influenza before cancer could get around to them.

Nancy LC
Tue, May-24-05, 09:42
Well...something my parents, who are in their mid-80's, are experiencing, is some sort of breakdown of their skin or the blood vessels under their skin. Doctors have told them it is from over-exposure to sun. Anyway, the lightest sort of touch or bump can cause these absolutely hideous bruises that look like blood bruises.

I'm not sure if that's it. They did spend a lot more time outside than I have in my life so far, but they weren't farmers or anything like that. But it does serve as a cautionary tale for me when I hear things like this.

ojoj
Tue, May-24-05, 09:45
Well...something my parents, who are in their mid-80's, are experiencing, is some sort of breakdown of their skin or the blood vessels under their skin. Doctors have told them it is from over-exposure to sun. Anyway, the lightest sort of touch or bump can cause these absolutely hideous bruises that look like blood bruises.

I'm not sure if that's it. They did spend a lot more time outside than I have in my life so far, but they weren't farmers or anything like that. But it does serve as a cautionary tale for me when I hear things like this.

My father in law has this problem (his in his late 80's) and he was told its caused by warfarin, a blood thinning medication, and that this is a common side affect??

Jo

Nancy LC
Tue, May-24-05, 09:47
I found a link about it:
http://www.skinsite.com/info_bateman's_purpura.htm. Its called Bateman's Purpura and apparently sun damage is the primary cause.

They cite sun damage as a cause, in addition to things like blood thinners. I don't think my parents are taking any meds that would be caused by this.

I've read, so far, that vitamin K cream, progesterone cream (for women), and alpha linolic acid (thickens the skin) can help with it.

Fhyreworks
Tue, May-24-05, 10:40
Well...something my parents, who are in their mid-80's, are experiencing, is some sort of breakdown of their skin or the blood vessels under their skin. Doctors have told them it is from over-exposure to sun. Anyway, the lightest sort of touch or bump can cause these absolutely hideous bruises that look like blood bruises.

I'm not sure if that's it. They did spend a lot more time outside than I have in my life so far, but they weren't farmers or anything like that. But it does serve as a cautionary tale for me when I hear things like this.


My father has this issue too. Even holding his hand "too tight" will bruise it.

ETA: I know he is not taking any kind of medication and hasn't been (he's a non-medication kinda guy :lol: ).

Debbie

seyont
Tue, May-24-05, 10:44
originally by KwikDriver: [I]The current lifespans we enjoy are very unusual from an historical standpoint. As recently as the turn of the last century, the life expectancy was around 50 years or so.[\I]

I think it's the life expectancy that's unusual, not the lifespans. Our family has a big fat genealogy book, going from the 17th century thru the 19th, and even mentioning some branches from the 15th century. People in that small sample commonly lived into their 80's. Many children died young, many women died during childbirth, and there were many accidents for the men, but the people who survived that seemed to live until their 70's and 80's. (How a woman in the 1600's could have nine kids in the New World and live that long I'll never understand...)

emmy207
Tue, May-24-05, 10:46
I never go out in the sun without factor 15 sunscreen and uv protecting moisturizer.
I would be interested in the opinions of the Australians here.
Sun safety is taught from Kindergarden and nobody goes out in the summer sun with out sun screen and a hat. In some places in Australia, baseball caps are part of the school uniform in the summer.

kwikdriver
Tue, May-24-05, 10:56
I think it's the life expectancy that's unusual, not the lifespans. Our family has a big fat genealogy book, going from the 17th century thru the 19th, and even mentioning some branches from the 15th century. People in that small sample commonly lived into their 80's. Many children died young, many women died during childbirth, and there were many accidents for the men, but the people who survived that seemed to live until their 70's and 80's. (How a woman in the 1600's could have nine kids in the New World and live that long I'll never understand...)

I wasn't aware of the distinction between lifespan and life expectancy, so thanks for pointing that out.

I was thinking along those lines, though, but I saw something interesting:

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0005140.html

Notice that the life expectancy for people over the age of 10 in 1900 isn't very different from the life expectancy of people who were born then, which suggests the difference in life expectancy between then and now isn't merely a matter of decreased infant mortality. I had always thought it was -- tales of Scottish women having 16 kids to have a shot at one of them reaching adulthood and so on. But apparently by 1900 that stuff was a thing of the past.

Looking at that chart, once you reached the age of 50 or so it was a good bet you'd live quite a bit longer, but apparently not too many people did reach 50.