lantus and avantia

[Bob]

I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of Lantus.
Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c and a 475
BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a day and the
last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75 to 85. The
problem is I am always nauseated and tired. Could the Med
cause this?

Bob Fuhrman

[Ron G]

One of the classic side effects of Metformin, is nausea. Some
people get over it in a few weeks, some have to use a
different medicine, or, like me, I had to reduce Metformin
from 2000 mg per day down to 1000 mg per day, so I did not
have nausea. IMOO, I feel Metformin is good stuff to help
insulin resistance, so I wanted to stay on it. The "balance"
or "tradeoff" for me was to reduce Metformin and increase
Lantus. Works for me, but be sure your doctor tells you this
is ok. Never try it by yourself. By the way, bringing your Bg
down from 475 to 95 is fantastic! Watch out for hypo's when
you start getting that close to 80. My Dr wants me 90 to 120,
so I stay away from the hypo region a bit better.

(The only reason I post the history part of my changes over
time, is to show that the Dr's can change things around so you
can feel better, as needed, without too many side effects)

Best--- 'Tis Himself Ron, a Scot Thanks----
1)Ron (scrambling real hard to be able to put a "handle" on
all the insulin/med changes lately) T2, since about 1995,
2000 mg Metformin, 15 Mg Glyburide, 8 Mg Advandia, added 10
Units Humulin NPH ( Novolin N Human Insulin) at Bedtime
starting April 2004

2) Sept 2004, drop the Glyburide, keep the Metformin and
Avandia shoot 4 Units Breakfast mixed with 4 Units of
Novolog shoot N 12 Units Supper mixed with 4 Units Novalog
Novolog will now be titrated upwards weekly as required

3) Now, Jan 2005, 1000 mg Metformin and 8 mg Avandia shoot 10
units Novolog @ Breakfast, lunch and dinner shoot N 12
Units Lantus @ bedtime Novolog will now be titrated upwards
weekly as required ---Works good!!!-----

Bob <bob1942@suscom.net> wrote in message
news:G72dnZlSQ_QwfRbfRVn-ig@suscom.com...
> I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of
> Lantus. Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c
> and a 475 BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a
> day and the last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75
> to 85. The problem is I am always nauseated and tired. Could
> the Med cause this?
>
> Bob Fuhrman
>
>

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[Ron G]

Correction to the dosing schedule---

1)Ron (scrambling real hard to be able to put a "handle" on
all the insulin/med changes lately) T2, since about 1995,
2000 mg Metformin, 15 Mg Glyburide, 8 Mg Advandia, added 10
Units Humulin NPH ( Novolin N Human Insulin) at Bedtime
starting April 2004

2) Sept 2004, drop the Glyburide, keep the 8 mg Avandia and
reduce to 1000 mg Metformin (severe nausea) shoot 4 Units
Breakfast mixed with 4 Units of Novolog shoot N 12 Units
Supper mixed with 4 Units Novalog Novolog will now be
titrated upwards weekly as required

3) Now, Jan 2005, 1000 mg Metformin and 8 mg Avandia shoot 10
units Novolog @ Breakfast, lunch and dinner shoot N 12
Units Lantus @ bedtime Novolog will now be titrated upwards
weekly as required, per Bg meter readings, approved by Dr.
---Works good!!!-----

Best---- Ron :-)

Bob <bob1942@suscom.net> wrote in message
news:G72dnZlSQ_QwfRbfRVn-ig@suscom.com...
> I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of
> Lantus. Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c
> and a 475 BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a
> day and the last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75
> to 85. The problem is I am always nauseated and tired. Could
> the Med cause this?
>
> Bob Fuhrman
>
>

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[Alan Hardy]

Bob wrote:
>I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of Lantus.
>Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c and a 475
>BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a day and the
>last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75 to 85. The
>problem is I am always nauseated and tired. Could the Med
>cause this?
>
> Bob Fuhrman
Yes, the med could cause it, but I think achieveing the
current excellent level from far too high has more to do with
it. Give your body time to adjust.

Alan

[Oldal4865]

Bob wrote in message ...
>I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of Lantus.
>Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c and a 475
>BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a day and the
>last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75 to 85. The
>problem is I am always nauseated and tired. Could the Med
>cause this?
>
>Bob Fuhrman
>
>

Early Days are tough. Congratulations on your superb results!
(and I mean Superb! ! !)

The trick with metformin is to start at a low dose, 500 mg/day
Another trick is to avoid carbs while the metformin is in your
stomach and intestines. For some folks it works.

Metformin has some spectacular effects on Type 2 diabetics. It
is worth your while to tough it out and try to acclimatize
your gut to the med.

Some of the spectacular effects of metformin:

a. Metformin reduces blood sugars

http://www.diabetesnet.com/diabetes_treatments/metformin.php

b. Metformin improves cholesterol and triglycerides

http://tinyurl.com/5errv

c. Metformin cuts heart attack risk in T2

http://www.diabetesincontrol.com/issue132/item2.shtml

also,

Common diabetes drug lowers risk by inhibiting proinflammatory
factor Heart Disease Weekly July 27, 2003

". . .This action of metformin may help prevent
atherosclerosis," said Dandona, "and may explain why persons
with type 2 diabetes who are treated with metformin are at
lower risk of dying from heart disease. . ."

(BTW, so do the TZDs, Actos and Avandia)

d. Actually, Metformin reduces overall mortality rates among
T2 diabetics

http://tinyurl.com/69yjd

e. Metformin may protect dying beta cells which are the
proximate cause of T2 (One interpretation of the metformin
results in the DPT-2

http://www.niddk.nih.gov/welcome/releases/8_8_01.htm

f. Metformin protects against the formation of Advanced
Glycosylation End Products (A.G.E.)

(A very good thing for a diabetic)

http://tinyurl.com/5tonv

g. Metformin seems to have some anti-cancer effects!

http://www.diabetesincontrol.com/modules.php?name=News&file=a-
rticle&sid=2687

". . .Items for the Week: Metformin Cuts Risk of Cancer
in Diabetics

Patients with type 2 diabetes who are prescribed metformin
appear to be at lower risk of cancer than those not treated
with metformin. . ."

h. Finally, Metformin helps folks lose weight (though usually
only in the first year)

http://www.smart-drugs.net/ias-metformin-weightloss.htm

i. However, metformin favors vitamin B12 deficiency and
related high homocysteine levels.

http://www.aafp.org/afp/20040115/letters.html

“. . . .The clinical significance of metformin-induced low
levels of serum vitamin B12 associated with an increase in
serum homocysteine levels as a risk factor for vascular
disease is still controversial. Calcium supplementation
appears to be an effective treatment as well as intramuscular
or oral crystalline cyanocobalamin (B12). . .”

High homocysteine is scary. Extra B6, B12 and Folic acid are
the standard high-homocysteine remedies, which, IMO, all
diabetics (even T1 like me, for instance,) ought to use,
whether you use metformin or not.

http://tinyurl.com/4nytv

Good luck and keep coming back. Reading the diabetes news
groups every night has substantially improved my health, my
quality of life, and, I'm sure, my life expectancy.

Regards
Old Al

[None Given]

"Bob" <bob1942@suscom.net> wrote in message
news:G72dnZlSQ_QwfRbfRVn-ig@suscom.com...
> I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of
> Lantus. Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c
> and a 475 BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a
> day and the last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75
> to 85. The problem is I am always nauseated and tired. Could
> the Med cause this?

How much metformin are you taking and when? If you can, spread
the dose out through the day and take it with food.

--
No Husband Has Ever Been Shot While Doing The Dishes

[Rk]

Bob" <bob1942@suscom.net> wrote in message
news:G72dnZlSQ_QwfRbfRVn-ig@suscom.com...
>I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of Lantus.
>Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c and a 475
>BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a day and the
>last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75 to 85. The
>problem is I am always nauseated and tired. Could the Med
>cause this?
>
> Bob Fuhrman
>
first CONGRATS....

second... dropping that much that quickly can mimic symptoms
of having a hypo one of which is being nauseated and after it
subsides being tired is an after effect. Even though, you
technically did not have a true hypo... Your body "thought"
you did, because of being at most likely such high numbers for
such a long time, the body got used to them... then dropping
that much isn't good.. needed to be done gradulally.

Either way... might try something to coat your stomach with or
eat 1-2 saltine crackers (10gm in 5 crackers)

Or the metformin could be causing it... most T2's have stomach
problems with
it.. they often refer to it as met"fartin" <- comprende?

Best of luck

--
RK, T1 // Animas IR1250 "I have better things to do then to be
depressed.." dannik http://www.insulin-pumpers.org
-----------------------

[Andrew B.]

Bob wrote:
>
> I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of
> Lantus. Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c
> and a 475 BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a
> day and the last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75
> to 85. The problem is I am always nauseated and tired. Could
> the Med cause this?

Would suspect the metformin +/- your diet.

In Christ's love and service,

Andrew

--
Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD Board-Certified Cardiologist

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[W. Baker]

Alan Hardy <alan.hardy9053@ntlworld.com> wrote:
: Bob wrote:
: >I have been on 8gr Avandia , Metformin and 20units of
: >Lantus. Three weeks ago when I was diagnose I had a 15 A1c
: >and a 475 BG reading. Three weeks later ,I test 4 times a
: >day and the last 3 days I had nothing over 95 with most 75
: >to 85. The problem is I am always nauseated and tired.
: >Could the Med cause this?
: >
: > Bob Fuhrman
: Yes, the med could cause it, but I think achieveing the
: current excellent level from far too high has more to do
: with it. Give your body time to adjust.

: Alan

Sometimes switching to the extended release form of the
metformin can help, but still spread it out to at lest 2 doses
to minimise peaks of the drug i your sysem.

Wendy