What the hell is wrong with you?????

[Primate]

:stop: CAUTION THIS IS A LONG RANT!

Since I have started this thing yesterday (thing refers to Atkins btw) I have been reading pages upon pages of information and viewing this site and that site and something disturbing to me has come to light. “Parents putting their kids on diets”. I was a fat kid too and there are a lot of fat kids in the world but most will grow out of it. Now there are circumstances where yes a child needs to go on a diet such as health risks or a chemical type of thing, but there is nothing wrong with your kid being a chubby little guy or plumb little girl! Pinch their cute chubby checks give them a kiss and let them know they are loved and ok whether they are fat or skinny, tall or short, first in the class or the last.

The world is pretty jacked today and the last thing your kid needs is a self esteem problem from their parent that has them on a diet because he or she isn’t socially acceptable. To steal from my friends accrossed the pound THAT IS JUST RUBISH!

You know the reason there is an increase in child obesity? Well let me tell you what I think:

Technology:
You want your kid to trim down be happy and healthy? Get them off the computer and from in front of the Xbox and get them out playing. Running around in the woods, Playing football or hop-scotch in the middle of the street, hide and go seek, the real life sport or activities they are playing on the Xbox or computer. This keeps them in shape builds there imagination and teaches them how to work as a team.

Laws:
Skateboarding, Rollerblading, and just being a troublemaker. These are activities that some of us did as kids but now the law has made it impossible for kids to get out and do things. You can’t skate her or ride your board there, climbing through an abandoned house out in a backfield somewhere gets your parents sued and you get a record. Sneaking out was one of the best aerobic exercises I did as a kid. We didn’t do anything to bad but running everywhere getting the heart rate up and being very alert to your surroundings isn’t that bad then you come home usually safe and sound and get some sleep. Now the penalties is to too severe.

Fat Lazy Parents (me included):
So we are overweight and low on energy so we don’t want to run our kid to extracurricular activities or go outside and teach little Johnny how to play baseball or go to the park and play volleyball. We get fat and lazy and they don’t learn good habits and end up the same way.

I am not a doctor or Lawyer and only a part time parent so should I really be dispensing this information and advice? Yes, because the people in charge who should tell you this stuff are obviously a bunch of dope smoking retards….. just my .02 Have a Lovely Day :wave:

[misskimbee]

You know what? I agree with you....

Seems that there is a huge difference from when I was a kid, and the kids I see now, who seem to be more sedentary with their video games and more inclined to eat the crap that cafeterias sell them these days.

Obesity is a huge epidemic. We're eating ourselves to death but name a big corporation in the food or entertainment industry that gives two hoots right?

:)

[Primate]

WHEWWWW. Right on I am glad someone agrees I was scared that I would just get flamed when I posted it :) Thanks for the reply :wave:

[KryssiMc]

You're not the only one who feels this way. When my girls were little, I MADE them go outside to play. They were only allowed TV and video games after dinner and on rainy days. Snow days they were made to go out and play too (and I went out there with them!).

It's so sad to see how empty the streets are with very few kids out. Yet the food court in the mall is PACKED with kids stuffing their faces with bad food when they should be eating at home.

I blame the parents for this. And don't give me any crap about predators being outside to get your kids because you should be out there with them enjoying the weather too!

Whew...now I feel better. Thanks for starting such an interesting thread. Now let's see someone take some responsibility.

[Lisa N]

You want your kid to trim down be happy and healthy? Get them off the computer and from in front of the Xbox and get them out playing. Running around in the woods, Playing football or hop-scotch in the middle of the street, hide and go seek, the real life sport or activities they are playing on the Xbox or computer. This keeps them in shape builds there imagination and teaches them how to work as a team.

In an ideal (and safer) world, this would be right on the money. However, at least where I live, 4 young girls have been abducted, sexually assaulted and murdered within the past year...all within a 5 mile radius of where I live (moving is not an option at the moment, nor is my neighborhood considered particularly 'unsafe'). If anyone thinks I'm going to let my 9 and 10 year old daughters run the neighborhood unsupervised, they're smokin' something illegal. As for playing in the street, my kids get grounded for that sort of thing. Cars pay no attention to speed limits in my neighborhood and there are far safer place to play than the street (like...ummm...the back yard or the sidewalk?).
That's not to say that they don't get their share of exercise, but it certainly needs to be in a more supervised form than it was when (and where) you grew up apparently.

As for parents putting their kids on diets, these days they often don't have to. Girls as young as 8 have reported 'dieting' on their own in surveys over the past several years. Children are far more aware of body size these days and at a younger age than most people give them credit for and there certainly is no lack of information on TV and in the media about weight loss.
I'll give you an example from my own experience. When my oldest daughter was in 1st grade, she was a little chubby; enough so that the kids at school began to tease her about being 'fat'. Her pediatrician wasn't too concerned (my daughter brought up the topic during her physical) and was more or less of the opinion, "just hold her weight where it is for a while and let her height catch up". About that same time, she was diagnosed with ADD and started taking medication for it. Now, one of the side effects of this medication is loss of appetite for a few weeks until the body adjusts to it. She took advantage of that and, unknown to me until a few months later, quit eating her lunch at school for several weeks. It was only after we brought her in for a height/weight check (standard procedure for this medication) after a few months that we realized that she had dropped 15 pounds and her pediatrician freaked out. I knew she had gotten thinner and we had expected some weight loss, but not that amount. When I asked her what on earth had given her the idea to quit eating lunch, she told me one of her classmates had suggested it. :bash: I didn't put her on a diet. In fact, I was doing everything I could to encourage her to eat. She found a way to do what she wanted anyway. It took some work, but she is now back to eating normally and maintaining a healthy weight, but it just goes to show you that it's not always the parents 'putting kids on diets'. :p
OTOH, there's nothing wrong with limiting the junk food that kids eat. As a parent, I want my kids to be as healthy as they can be and that takes healthy food, not junk. After all...you are what you eat. ;)

[Juli_G]

Hi there! I can say I don't agree with you 100% Primate. I WISH someone would have helped me with my diet when I was younger. Maybe the torture of middle school and high school wouldn't have been so bad. Maybe I wouldn't have cried my eyes out and wanted to quit school because people were constatly calling me fat.

:stop: CAUTION THIS IS A LONG RANT!


I was a fat kid too and there are a lot of fat kids in the world but most will grow out of it.

Oh, how I wish!! I was a chubby thing all my life, and chubby grew into FAT!

The world is pretty jacked today and the last thing your kid needs is a self esteem problem from their parent that has them on a diet because he or she isn’t socially acceptable. To steal from my friends accrossed the pound THAT IS JUST RUBISH!

I think the self esteem issue comes from people making fun of overweight children. At least for me it did. The children aren't going to get any better unless the parents step in. I think its a good idea for parents to step in. Now I'm not talking about putting heavy kids on Atkin's or strict diets. I'm talking about teaching them good eating habits. For instance: instead of sugar laiden cereal, give them some fresh fruit for breakfast.


You know the reason there is an increase in child obesity? Well let me tell you what I think:

Technology:
You want your kid to trim down be happy and healthy? Get them off the computer and from in front of the Xbox and get them out playing. Running around in the woods, Playing football or hop-scotch in the middle of the street, hide and go seek, the real life sport or activities they are playing on the Xbox or computer. This keeps them in shape builds there imagination and teaches them how to work as a team.

Laws:
Skateboarding, Rollerblading, and just being a troublemaker. These are activities that some of us did as kids but now the law has made it impossible for kids to get out and do things. You can’t skate her or ride your board there, climbing through an abandoned house out in a backfield somewhere gets your parents sued and you get a record. Sneaking out was one of the best aerobic exercises I did as a kid. We didn’t do anything to bad but running everywhere getting the heart rate up and being very alert to your surroundings isn’t that bad then you come home usually safe and sound and get some sleep. Now the penalties is to too severe.

Fat Lazy Parents (me included):
So we are overweight and low on energy so we don’t want to run our kid to extracurricular activities or go outside and teach little Johnny how to play baseball or go to the park and play volleyball. We get fat and lazy and they don’t learn good habits and end up the same way.

I am not a doctor or Lawyer and only a part time parent so should I really be dispensing this information and advice? Yes, because the people in charge who should tell you this stuff are obviously a bunch of dope smoking retards….. just my .02 Have a Lovely Day :wave:


I just think along with the exercise you suggested, parents should also be aware of what their kids are putting in their mouths. Instead of the high fat, high carb food and goodies loaded with sugar, I wish someone would have taught me the value of an apple or some fresh veggies. Maybe I wouldn't have gotten so heavy. Interesting post! Have a great day! :wave:

[potatofree]

It's easy to sit back and tell other parents how they should get out there with their kids and "enjoy the weather", since I live in a VERY low-crime area and have the LUXURY of being a stay-at-home Mom.

I'm also lucky enough to have an education about what makes for a nutritious diet, and the means to provide quality food to my children.

My son does have a bit of a weight problem due mostly to his disability and medications, but I'm so lucky to have access to the right kind of care for him, so his doctor can help keep an eye on things.

I love him regardless of his size, and have sworn myself to being a better parent than my Mom, who liked to remind me I was "getting chunky" on a regular basis.

Yes, there are a lot of things parents who AREN'T as lucky as I am can do, that maybe they aren't. Instead of complaining, why don't we all go take the neighbor's kid for a walk WITH us?

[Pollyanna]

Right on Primate!!!!!!! My son, who is now a trim and slim 21 year old, was a quite a chunk of a boy. He was, and is very active. What could be more cuddly and lovable than a big ol' baby boy! My only concern was for his health and the fact that other kids can be cruel. the word "diet" was never mentioned or thought of. he is my son, whether fat, skinny or somewhere in between - he is perfect in my eyes. Marlene

[Primate]

Very Good! It is fantastic to hear the opposite side of this issue. Though I do not agree with some of the rebuttals it is good to see that it is at least being thought about. :wave: ---- I am right there in agreement Pollyanna WELL SAID! :thup:

[LiveWell]

I agree that putting them on a "diet" is the wrong thing to do. Some kids are naturally chunky and some get that way because of their enviornment. There are plenty of ways to curb it and one is to get off our lazy ~$$ and do it with them. I dont live in a crime ridden neighborhood (far from it) but Im not stupid either. My kids are always where I can see them and take care of them. There are plenty of parks and such to go to if the yard isnt an option, but that would take effort on our part.

It takes "too" much effort to put good nutritious food on the table and to buy healthy snacks because they yell and beg for sugary treats (which are plenty cheaper). Well a bag of carrots cost about $1 or two...same as/ less than cookies and thats a decent snack for a kid. Thats just an example, of course every child wont eat carrots. But you can find something healthy they will eat or at least try.

We all need to look at what we all eat, what we fix our children and what we expect to teach them in life. Some kids are chunky naturally ( like I said before ) but the majority get worse because of what we do to them. Also while on the subject, people should stop pointing and saying crap about others being fat - especially in front of their kids. Your an adult, yes we know, but try to teach your children better than you. If you everyone tought their kids to be kind then there wouldnt be so much teasing in the first place.

My children get in BIG trouble if I find out they tease/ have teased someone. They are tought that its not nice and hurts peoples feelings and give them examples of how it hurts them - not just take it for granted that they are angels and will learn only from your instruction.

I tell them all the time that they are perfect the way they are and its ok for people to be different. I tell them that we are all eating healthier and try not to use the word "diet" around them. Althought they are little ears so they hear things we dont necessarliy want them to. I just hope they understand that their mommy and daddy are unhealthy like this and are working to fix it. They are one of the main reasons that we are doing this. I dont want to be the lazy fat mom. The parents that dont want to go do anything ever just due to lack of energy and embarrasment of ourselves. And thats exactly who I am right now. (trying not to be though and doing a decent job so far).

Anyway..I got to rambling there myself. Its getting warmer everywhere ~ get those kids out!!! and get out with them!!! (be safe).

Oh yea..and I agree I wouldnt let my kids run the neighborhood. Have you ever typed your address in the child molester database to see how many lived in your area?? Its very scary...and I have a good community. Only one....well two now one just moved in. I was abused as a child and I would die protecting them from that sort of thing. Thats why Im always there!

Im sorry if I offend some - Im not trying to generalize EVERYONE and I know that some times its harder due to whatever reason. But parenting takes a major commitment and is a major obligation. Do your children right!

[nawchem]

My mom put me on a diet when I was 5. I didn't understand that I was chunky and thought she was mad at me and that was why everyone else got dessert. Your right I grew a few inches and by 6 I was scrawny.

I feel sorry for kids today. They really can't run around free anymore, at least not where I live.

I hear ya primate the world is setting them up to be fat.

An aside my parents were very strict very little junkfood. I was a teen before I had my first coke. I can't blame them at all for my carby ways, its all my doing.

Good luck Primate!

[Primate]

Well put LiveWell. I am not sure if I am supposed to be commenting when I agree or disagree I just feel rude letting someones comment hang without saying anything so fill me in if I can stop replying all the time :D

One thing though. This might be more from a male stand point I dont know but calling somone fat, while not PC and can be considered rude, is not a big deal. While I would never teach my son to or encourage him to call somone fat, I dont take huge offense by someone calling me fat, you know since I am and all :D

Big Boned, Big Build, Large, Voluptuous and any other slang word seems patronizing me. It is like a code word for fat. Calling someone a name for something that is beyond their control is not right such as a physical deformaty or mental health isssues but, someone who likes ho ho's zingers and whos only exercise is running to the fridge for German Chocolate cake (talking about myself here mmmmmm German Chocolate cake :doah: ) should not be suprized when they are refered to as fat.

Males when children or Adults (I should say big children :D) Communicate in a very different way. We great each other with derogatory names and expressions. To hear someone say "move your fat ass" or "Hey fat boy", to me anyway, is not shocking.

Well I think that was a secondary rant sorry. :wave: By the way not upset or anything I just have a lot of thoughts and haven't been able to vent them. I will chill out promise :angel:

[LiveWell]

lol dont worry about it. Some will agree some will disagree. My husband is a "teasing" kind of person. He wont do it if he knows it hurts your feeling or even thinks it might. But him and his brother grew up teasing each other and thats what they do constantly. "hey fatboy" "hey slim" (and thats being derogatory too..neither are slim lol) but yes I know boys (and men) are way different from women and girls.

But there is also a difference between adults and children and there should be different actions around children. I dont think its right to demean someone because of how they look. Whether they can change it or not really. Even the guys feelings can be hurt - especially as a small child. As they grow they find their own set of friends and their own personalities and what is is. But they shouldnt be taught that thats anyway to treat their fellow man.

I didnt take anything you said as being angry :) Im interested in seeing how others feel about all this. I have a feeling there will be alot of posts. I dont have a problem with people feeling the way they feel, one way or another. Im pretty laid back. All of us have opinions, some are the same, some slightly different but basicly the same, and some totally opposite. Its all good :lol:

[LiveWell]

Oh and one more thing I think as adults its easier for us to be called or thought of (by others or ourselves) as fat. We are more mature and dont usually fall into TOO much emotional tourmoil from it. But kids are way more sensitive to everything growing up. Trying to find themselves and all. Im fat, I know Im fat, I know people know Im fat hehehe, But I would still give someone an earful for calling me that to my face because everyone is flawed somehow.

[mio1996]

I agree with some of your points, primate, but the first thing to realize is that to us serious lc'ers, lc is not a "diet" in the traditional sense of a weight-loss diet. It is a new way of life that simply discards junk food in search of better overall health (for most of us, this does include weight-loss, of course). Period. I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting kids to eat real food most days! I am responding here because I am the one that expressed in another thread my displeasure with my wife constanty allowing the kids junk food. Neither of my kids are even "chunky" whatsoever, but I still like for them to eat healthy food. I developed metabolic syndrome eating FAR less sugar and starch than they do.

You are definitely right about the exercise being insufficient nowadays. I personally think that diet is far more important to control of weight, though.

I totally agree that it is rubbish to ruin a kid's self-esteem by striving for bodily perfection, but it is equally rubbish to destroy kids' lives by feeding them rubbish from the time they are conceived!

[Primate]

I like rubbish it is a good word :D

[LiveWell]

I totally agree that it is rubbish to ruin a kid's self-esteem by striving for bodily perfection, but it is equally rubbish to destroy kids' lives by feeding them rubbish from the time they are conceived!

Preach on! hehe I agree totally. And yes I am guilty of it too...but thankfully for my kids I have woken up to eating more healthy. Neither of my children are chunky at all and I want to give them a head start on eating right so they might not have to ever be. Kids grow up quickly...and adults/young adults get fat easily enough on their own without us helping it along. If that happens hopefully you have instilled enough sense into them to relize how to deal with it ~ A GOOD DIET (daily diet..not "diet" diet)

[briancurra]

i know that as i got bigger people made fun of my size, and i didnt really get overweight until i was in my 20's.

The way i look at people like that, is that you should not give them the satisfaction of letting them know they got to you.

I just use those people as my motivation when I am working out...just thinking about all of the mean and hurtful things they say, really can motivate you in the weight room, at least it did for me

[kwikdriver]

I'm a little annoyed by the constant focus on exercise in this thread. I was a fat baby, a fat kid, and grew into a fat adult. I was also an extremely active and athletic kid, and was athletic well into adulthood. It didn't matter.

Exercise, or lack of it to be exact, isn't the problem. Our food supply is. Lack of knowledge about nutrition is. The problem isn't lazy bodies, but lazy minds.

[KryssiMc]

LiveWell,

You proved my point exactly (just more eloquently). It is up to US, the parents, to point them in the right direction. Loved your post.

[GinaLeanne]

WHEWWWW. Right on I am glad someone agrees I was scared that I would just get flamed when I posted it :) Thanks for the reply :wave:
My son plays outside and does all the same things I did when I was young..

[Primate]

My son plays outside and does all the same things I did when I was young..

That is fantastic to hear. Wish it could be that way for all kids. :D :thup:

[emmy207]

I agree with every thing you said and the situation is getting like it is in the US, here in the UK.
We have a huge rise in childhood obesity, when I was growing up the "fat" kids in school was one in 50. Now it is closer to one in ten. (I was not a fat kid.)
Our kids do have a poorer diet, far too much sugar and aggressive advertising of junk food to kids on TV.
But they also do not play out, you don't see two ten years walking together to the park or racing each other to get there.
Kids are soccer mad but they don't play it much on the streets or estates, the play in on their X boxes instead.
Parents are scared of letting their children out, for fear of drugs pushers and thugs, but indulging them in the highly addictive drugs of high sugar and high fat diets, whilst veg out in front of the tv.
When I was growing up I walked up a steep hill to school every day five days a week for seven years and back in the afternoons, starting aged nine. And we did go to the sweet shop on the way but we didn't get fat because we only got a few penny sweets, not cans of fizzy drinks or chocolate bars.
Now most children even in urban areas get driven to school and picked up afterwards, missing out of basic exercise.
When I was a child was had times without a TV, I would throw a tennis ball against a wall on practice handstands etc.

[Lisa N]

I'm a little annoyed by the constant focus on exercise in this thread. I was a fat baby, a fat kid, and grew into a fat adult. I was also an extremely active and athletic kid, and was athletic well into adulthood. It didn't matter.

Exercise, or lack of it to be exact, isn't the problem. Our food supply is. Lack of knowledge about nutrition is. The problem isn't lazy bodies, but lazy minds.

kwikdriver, you make a good point. Exercise in and of itself is ineffective for promoting weight loss. It's excellent for many things, including weight maintainence, cardiovascular endurance and muscle building...but not for weight loss.
It simply will not solve anything to keep feeding kids the same 'rubbish' (I like that word, also) and then tell them to go excercise more.
I agree with not putting young children on diets, at least not in the sense that most people think of diets. But how about we stop feeding them sugar-loaded cereal, pop tarts, Big Gulps, pop by the case and all the other non-nutrient crap and give them healthy, nutritious food in reasonable amounts instead?

I was a fat kid too and there are a lot of fat kids in the world but most will grow out of it.

Primate, the fact is that most kids won't 'grow out of it' unless there is some sort of intervention. Obese children are far more likely to become obese adults than normal weight children.
It sounds good to say, "just love them as they are" but I wouldn't apply that reasoning if my kids were sick or hurt as a rationale to ignore the problem and do nothing about it. The question in my mind is do we love them enough to make the effort to change what they are eating and then put up with the whining without caving in when you tell them 'no' to daily unhealthy food? ;)
Junk food on demand does not = love, people.
Changing a child's diet for the better without destroying their self-image in the process is quite possible...it's all in how you present it to the child. :)

[KryssiMc]

I actually have a question regarding this. My goddaughter is a very big girl. At age 1 she is wearing a kid's size 5. Her mother is at least 75 lbs overweight and my brother, her father, could stand to lose 25 lbs or so. What I noticed is that, every time that Ashlee cries, her mother gives her something to eat.

I'm wondering...will this set her up to be an emotional eater later on in life? I appreciate any answers as I am very concerned about my little monster.

[Lisa N]

What I noticed is that, every time that Ashlee cries, her mother gives her something to eat.
I'm wondering...will this set her up to be an emotional eater later on in life? I appreciate any answers as I am very concerned about my little monster.

Kryssi, it's very possible. By soothing her tears with food, Ashlee's mom is giving her the unspoken message that food makes everything all better.
At the age of one, your goddaughter isn't like to make that connection consciously, but as she gets older she certainly will.

[Jiggerz]

Ya know the movie quote "You had me at hello.."? Well for me its, "You lost me at...... What the hell is wrong with you????? ." ..... And honestly, about 30 minutes after you posted this thread I started a scathing response that started with, "Dude, you need to chill the bleep out..." then backspaced everything I wrote, and went on down the list of other new threads. But its a new day, and I'm back to reading this one.

I'm the mother of an overweight child. Is just admitting that setting me up for accusations ....as in how DARE I view my child like that? It's reality..she's 9 years old and in the third grade, and she weighed in at the doctors office (when she went in for a viral infection) at 122 pounds. I honestly believe that not caring (to myself) about her being at this weight, ignoring it and pretending it'll go away on its own is more dangerous. I've NEVER mentioned anything about her weight to her, I'd never dream of it...what could I say that could possibly get her to change this? Nothing..it'd only cause hurt and internally fester into self hatred compounding year after year for who knows how long. But, I do read the threads concerning diet & nutrition for children, I may have even replied to some. The point is, I'm trying to see how I can do anything differantly. I don't word for word follow everything I read, but once in awhile you'll pick up one thing.. that totally makes sense, something you hadn't thought of, you apply it..and it helps. Example: Limit or remove sugary drinks (juice boxes, apple juice, koolaid, etc). I did that a long time ago. Switch to skim milk instead of full fat Vitamin D milk, did that too. It's very much like us in our forum, we don't go by everything that we read within these forum walls... we scan through, ignore what doesn't pertain to us, and sometimes incorporate others that we hope might improve our WOL.

I guess it was the highly accusatory (that a word?) statements at the beginning of your post that started the smoldering thoughts. I don't want her to go through junior high and highschool hating herself, getting picked on and ignored because of her weight.... that turns into self hatred because you believe everyone hates you to treat you that way. (That's how I felt anyway, maybe I'm the only one that every felt it?) So......no, I won't just ignore it......

Also..... I remember the times when I was called fat. It burned, I cried, and who said it and where I was ..is just as clear and real to me as when it happened when I was on that playground 25 years ago. I'm happy for you, you had thick skin, it didnt bother you.

[KryssiMc]

Not only do we need to teach our children to eat healthier, we need to really change what society dictates is "acceptable". I had the opposite problem...66lbs in sophomore year in high school. I was called every name in the book. Eating disorder? Nope...I ate the same nasty, sugary, high carb foods my overweight friends were eating. At times I actually ate more than they did. What a surprise when I hit 35! Hypoglycemia and a slower metabolism.

People see overweight and too thin as ugly. We should be seeing it as not healthy. How do we as a society shift the focus? Beats me....but being a part of this forum has definitely opened my eyes as to what is truly beautiful.

[LiveWell]

LiveWell,

You proved my point exactly (just more eloquently). It is up to US, the parents, to point them in the right direction. Loved your post.

Oh wow thank you! Made my day :D

[mio1996]

Ya know the movie quote "You had me at hello.."? Well for me its, "You lost me at...... ." ..... And honestly, about 30 minutes after you posted this thread I started a scathing response that started with, "Dude, you need to chill the bleep out..." then backspaced everything I wrote, and went on down the list of other new threads. But its a new day, and I'm back to reading this one...

I felt the same way when I first read Primate's post. It seemed that he was calling any parent an idiot who would watch what their kids eat.

Let me tell you, I wish my parents would have known the dangers of white bread, potatoes, sugar, and rice when I was a kid. Instead, my parents being semi-starved by poverty when they were kids, they never denied me very much in the way of food. Maybe they should've! Maybe I would've grown up a lot happier and healthier, physically and mentally!

Now, armed with the knowledge we have, I think it would be irresponsible to not help our children. You don't have to tell the kids they look fat in order to help them, though. If both parents were on board with the program it would be pretty easy to simply keep certain foods out of the house. In my case, where the other parent thinks you will die without a massive daily starchload, it's not so easy.

"The kids are skinny, they don't need a diet," she says. Well, darn it, I wasn't fat yet when I was 7 either. A couple of years later, I was among the fattest and most ridiculed kids in school.

It's not stupid to be concerned about kids' health and weight. It is responsible.

[Jiggerz]

Since I have started this thing yesterday (thing refers to Atkins btw) I have been reading pages upon pages of information and viewing this site and that site and something disturbing to me has come to light. “Parents putting their kids on diets”.

So...its a bad thing to try and improve our childrens nutrition? Bad to look for information that might help? Burn the childrens nutrition books and shame the forum threads that pertain to this? ........I don't get it, people.

[Melanie4]

I think there is a difference being implied between "improving child's nutrition" and "putting kids on diets." Just like we low-carbers say "It's not a diet, its a way of life," helping your child lose weight or get healthier should be done as a way of life - by improving nutrition. It should not be done by a "diet" such as severe calorie restriction or by only feeding them cabbage soup or whatever.

[LiveWell]

I think there is a difference being implied between "improving child's nutrition" and "putting kids on diets." Just like we low-carbers say "It's not a diet, its a way of life," helping your child lose weight or get healthier should be done as a way of life - by improving nutrition. It should not be done by a "diet" such as severe calorie restriction or by only feeding them cabbage soup or whatever.


Very well expressed!

[potatofree]

It's all in the spirit in which it's carried out, IMO. I know people who restrict what the "fat kid" gets to eat, while the rest of the family gets pizza and chips. To me, a FAMILY "goes on a diet" not just one member. The whole family can benefit from changing their menu to make a positive change, not force it on ONE member as a negative.

Teaching a child to fuel their body in a healthy way like Jiggerz is trying to do is the best gift you can give them. Shaming them into eating carrots when their friends are all eating ice cream is just abuse... which I think is what the OP meant...isn't it?

[Primate]

Those last three posts kept me sane Thank you! Thank you! Thank you!….

I would like to answer some of the “opposite side people”. This might upset you a little but hopefully not to much and I do not know any of you personally so this is in no way a personal attack I am only making generalized statements about what you had typed and not try to assume what I am about to write is true for you but merely a response to your quotes. The initial post was also a generalized and in some cases “Not to be Take literally”. I apologies in advance if I ruffle feathers or sting the feelings a bit.

But then again this could all be BS and I might just be emotionally stunted and you ladies around here might need to straighten me out a bit :D

This is long but want to cover everything up to this point. Only read if you are boared and have nothing else better to do :D
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In an ideal (and safer) world, this would be right on the money. However, at least where I live, 4 young girls have been abducted, sexually assaulted and murdered within the past year...all within a 5 mile radius of where I live

If I had 2 girls and lived in this area I would move. If money or other issues kept this from happening I would beg barrow or steal to get my kids out of there as soon as possible and I would have to agree with you that there is NO WAY my kid would leave the house accept with me!
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she was diagnosed with ADD and started taking medication for it. Now, one of the side effects of this medication is loss of appetite for a few weeks ……….It took some work, but she is now back to eating normally and maintaining a healthy weight, but it just goes to show you that it's not always the parents 'putting kids on diets'.

I understand what you are saying here and that is why I had said

Now there are circumstances where yes a child needs to go on a diet such as health risks or a chemical type of thing
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I think its a good idea for parents to step in. Now I'm not talking about putting heavy kids on Atkin's or strict diets. I'm talking about teaching them good eating habits. For instance: instead of sugar laiden cereal, give them some fresh fruit for breakfast.

I couldn’t agree with you more. If they learn good habits it will carry on with them through their life and hopefully they wont struggle with weight issues throughout life. I did say We get fat and lazy and they don’t learn good habits and end up the same way.
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I'm a little annoyed by the constant focus on exercise in this thread. I was a fat baby, a fat kid, and grew into a fat adult. I was also an extremely active and athletic kid, and was athletic well into adulthood. It didn't matter.

Exercise, or lack of it to be exact, isn't the problem. Our food supply is. Lack of knowledge about nutrition is. The problem isn't lazy bodies, but lazy minds.
You need exercise to be healthy. Healthy doesn’t = skinny. While I agree that in some cases exercise alone will not make you thin if combined with GOOD EATING HABITS not a diet, your child will in most cases see a reduction in weight. I played football from the time I was 6 until college and some of the most athletic guys I new were well over 300lbs. Genetics can play a role in how much weight you have. There is nothing wrong with this. Some people not matter how much exercise and good eating habits they partake in will always be big.--- Love the quote in your signature by the way I laughed for a while then sent it to a friend of mine :D
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Primate, the fact is that most kids won't 'grow out of it' unless there is some sort of intervention. Obese children are far more likely to become obese adults than normal weight children.
It sounds good to say, "just love them as they are" but I wouldn't apply that reasoning if my kids were sick or hurt as a rationale to ignore the problem and do nothing about it. The question in my mind is do we love them enough to make the effort to change what they are eating and then put up with the whining without caving in when you tell them 'no' to daily unhealthy food?
Junk food on demand does not = love, people.
Changing a child's diet for the better without destroying their self-image in the process is quite possible...it's all in how you present it to the child.

Lisa, you appear to be my Lex Luther in this post ;) But that is good. It makes for a good conversation. Please read my post again I think you missed some of my points. If you just skim it or don’t read all of it you will easily disagree with me. Once again I am not saying feed your kids junk. I am saying teach them good habits and keep them from being stagnate. Don’t let the bad habits we have adopted rub off on your kids. Not you personally but that is just what I was saying in my original post.
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I guess it was the highly accusatory (that a word?) statements at the beginning of your post that started the smoldering thoughts. I don't want her to go through junior high and highschool hating herself, getting picked on and ignored because of her weight.... that turns into self hatred because you believe everyone hates you to treat you that way. (That's how I felt anyway, maybe I'm the only one that every felt it?) So......no, I won't just ignore it......

First off –Never backspace and reframe from saying something. If I upset you, made you mad or you disagree let it out. There is nothing wrong with unloading on “ME” if I evoked an emotion good or bad it is a discussion and I promise I can handle it. Besides Lisa doesn’t mind doing it;) JK Lisa…

If your child is a genius and cured cancer kids would pick on her, If she is a fantastic athlete they would be jealous and say things and if she is overweight they will pick on her. That is kids. Pretty people get talked about and stereo typed by ugly people, Smart people talked about by dumb people and Overweight people get talked about by skinny people and vise versa. This will happen forever even into adult hood. I am sure you do these things below but I just saying them as advice for those who do not. Teach them healthy habits, get them out playing (exercising), Praise the positive things they do and point out the great features they have. Comfort them and let them know as best you can that they are ok and people can just be mean, Correct the bad habits indirectly if it is what they eat then remove the soda and German chocolate cake (mmmmmmm German Chocolate Cake) from the house.
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I felt the same way when I first read Primate's post. It seemed that he was calling any parent an idiot who would watch what their kids eat.
No I was calling people who put their kids on diets without it being medically necessary idiots. If the parents bad habits and lack of interest in the child’s life causes a him or her to lack exercise and good eating habits then they are absolute idiots. Seems like in todays society people treat their kids like dogs. Give them some toys and a bowl of food then forget about them. Not saying you do it but, that was a point I was trying to get accrossed in not so many words in my original post.
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Listen when you have kids you make a choice to bring them into this world, you make a commitment to love them, give them the knowledge and tools to survive, and care for and protect them to the best of your ability. Laziness, media hype, and the inability to properly care for them is not an excuse to allow your child to become overweight then throw them on a diet and make them feel like a failure because you did not do your job. If this statement makes you mad and you feel like I am picking on you directly this is a sign. You know if you did or are doing something wrong. Take responsibility for your mistake and change it. Stop being a victim. It is easy to blame it on someone or something else. Teach your child something called character and self respect. Show them it is ok to be wrong as long as your correct it. We learn by failing. Failure is wonderful since it teaches you what not to do.

Don’t treat your kid like a little adult. THEY ARE NOT. As mature as they may seem they are still kids. They should not stress over weight or what other adults think. They need to be shown and not told what is right. You can not say don’t eat sugar then ask them to go get you a Pepsi. Teach by example! They need to know and have confidence that what mom and/or dad says and does is right. They need to have confidence that there parents will make it alright. They need to know they are loved and what others say does not matter. It is what they think and feel about themselves that is the most important.

[IvannaBFit]

I believe that it was dieting since the age of nine that has given me a terrible metabolism.

:(

And nowadays when you look at the cereals parents are feeding their children (Dinoeggs Oatmeal comes to mind, with sugar listed ELEVEN TIMES in the ingredients list, in different forms), and the meals they pack for lunch (bologna -- sugar -- on white bread -- sugar -- with "low fat" processed cheese -- sugar, with a "fruit" roll-up for snack -- sugar-- and a nice container of liquid sugar, oh I'm sorry I mean fruit drink, to wash it all down)

Yuck.

And then there are those who say, Oh they're just CHILDREN! Let them eat what they want! But unforuntately this is not going to work anymore, not in our day and age of corn syrups, genetically modified produce and over-processed and coloured foods. Perhaps when we were kids, or when our parents were kids, having an extra cookie wasn't TOO bad, but these days, it's an extra serving of liver-damaging corn syrup, chemicals, bio-engineered grains and obesity.

So while I believe that putting children on diets too early in life is a bad thing, I do not believe that teaching proper nutrition is a bad thing. It's all about healthy choices.

[potatofree]

You have to admit, though, that titling your thread "What the Hell is wrong with you?" was kind of asking for an argument?

[Primate]

Me start and argument? nooooooo never:D

[potatofree]

I don't mind a good debate myself, but I'm often accused of having no sense of humor when I suggest that doing something about the problem is an option. We can't fix everything, but to me, making a small step in our own corner is more productive than lecturing on an internet board. ;)

[LiveWell]

I think that the person that suggested grabbing the neighbors kid (dont remember who it is without going to look) and dragging them along was a very kind & thoughtful suggestion and one that needs repeated.

You could help save them..and a parent that may honestly have "no way" to do it.. (or letting some lazy bastage off the hook ~ but still great for the child)

[Lisa N]

If I had 2 girls and lived in this area I would move. If money or other issues kept this from happening I would beg barrow or steal to get my kids out of there as soon as possible and I would have to agree with you that there is NO WAY my kid would leave the house accept with me!

Move to where, Primate? I live in big city and no matter what zip code I put into the sex offenders database, it comes up with at least 150 registered for that zip code...and those are just the ones that have been convicted and registered (I checked this last night just out of sense of morbid curiosity). Perhaps you should do the same with your zip code and see how many it comes up with; I have a feeling that it may be a real eye-opener for you. BTW....as I mentioned before, the neighborhood that I live in is not considered unsafe for the city that I live in...it's middle to upper middle class and the homes here sell for 100K and up. The fact is in today's world and in most places in this country, it simply isn't safe to let your kids run around unsupervised. I admit, I ran the neighborhood unsupervised at their age when I was growing up. Maybe my parents were fools for allowing it and some bad things did happen to me. So...knowing what I do, I'm not about to give my girls that amount of freedom just yet.

I have a feeling that the reason that you started this post is because you were reading through the Low Carb Parenting and Pregnancy forum and jumped to some conclusions. Perhaps you are misunderstanding what parents who choose to have their kids join them on low carb do? I wouldn't consider my kids low carb, but they certainly are controlled carb but not because they have weight issues. It's simply a far healthier diet (yes, I use the word diet and in doing so, I mean the daily food that one eats, not a weight loss program) for them to be on than the SAD. The whole family eats this way and has for the past 4 years; I just eat at a much lower carb level than the rest of my family does.
You started out this thread blasting parents for putting their kids on diets, but did you check out the circumstances for their doing so first or even what, specifically, they were doing?
As I said before, I don't agree with putting young children on weight reduction diets unless there is a medical/chemical reason for doing so, just like you, but there is nothing wrong with cutting out junk food for the most part and feeding them healthier food. No matter what you're eating, you're on a 'diet'. The question then becomes; how healthy is your diet?
Step away from the German Chocolate cake..... :lol:

[322432]

Hello Primate
Point of interest. The way those of us here do LC is not a diet; it is a WOL. It is the most healthy WOE and WOL extant. This applies, not only to us, but to our children. I agree, children should not be on any diet that restricts, or does not provide, good, healthy, wholesome food choices, as this WOE does. Any diet that allows starch and sugar laden food, or drinks, will cause health problems, if not now, later for the child. Just my .02's worth.

[Primate]

You know with all the .02 around here we can put it all together and go get some German Chocolat Cake (Mmmmmmm German Chocolate Cake :doah: ) Jus kiddin. You know Lissa I am a man we tend to fantasize :D

Points well taken .Thanks all for the great discussion. I am very happy to be here and look forward to speaking with you all in future posts.. :wave:

[Melanie4]

Okay, I backed you up before Primate, and tried to stay out of the debate, but you have crossed the line.

If you mention German Chocolate Cake ONE MORE TIME, I am going to personally come over and smack you!


:bash:

:) :) :)

[LiveWell]

Okay, I backed you up before Primate, and tried to stay out of the debate, but you have crossed the line.

If you mention German Chocolate Cake ONE MORE TIME, I am going to personally come over and smack you!


:bash:

:) :) :)


Ditto - my FAVORITE cake ever. I dont even eat cake unless I have to for a birthday ... but I could never pass up German Chocolate ::drools:: and I havent even thought about it until now. I read it and my heart fell because I didnt even think to binge on any before starting my new way of life...then kick myself for even thinking that. THANKS ALOT!

[Primate]

:D Sorry. That is my fav thing and the only thing I think about.

[spiritof72]

First off –Never backspace and reframe from saying something. If I upset you, made you mad or you disagree let it out. There is nothing wrong with unloading on “ME” if I evoked an emotion good or bad it is a discussion and I promise I can handle it.

This type of unrestrained, shoot-from-the-psyche venting is called "immaturity" where I come from. Unless you were raised in a barn, it's generally considered adult behavior to consider your words carefully and decide where, how and when you will engage in confrontation.

Although I think that your general concept is reasonably valid, taking your limited experience (self-described "part time parent" to one child) and attempting to lecture everyone else on how to not be "idiots" in raising their children, is just a tad ... um ... ridiculous.

[Primate]

This type of unrestrained, shoot-from-the-psyche venting is called "immaturity" where I come from. Unless you were raised in a barn, it's generally considered adult behavior to consider your words carefully and decide where, how and when you will engage in confrontation.

Although I think that your general concept is reasonably valid, taking your limited experience (self-described "part time parent" to one child) and attempting to lecture everyone else on how to not be "idiots" in raising their children, is just a tad ... um ... ridiculous.

It was kind of a barn. I mean it had a roof and doors and windows and all oh and instead of stalls we called them rooms. No hay we used beds. But you are very close.

You could call speaking your mind the way you see it "immature" but the alternative is censorship. We censor ourselves daily and not say what is on our mind and just the way we think it is. Has that worked so far???? Well I guess I'll let you decide for your self since that is a perspective thing.

Is it right for me to be saying such things since I have a lack experience in the subject since I am a part-time part?

Well let me put a little information here “The Chair of Harvard's nutrition department went on record before a 1973 U.S. Senate Select Committee investigating fad diets: "The Atkins Diet is nonsense... Any book that recommends unlimited amounts of meat, butter, and eggs, as this one does, in my opinion is dangerous. The author who makes the suggestion is guilty of malpractice."

So does this means this person who had the education and knowledge on the subject was right? Some would say yes some would say no. So am I right on this subject? Some would say yes and some would say no. Knowledge and experience only come in handy when common sense does not point out the obvious.

It is good to see you conviction for how you feel and your openness and ability to not sugar coat it or as you would say "be immature". Thanks for chiming in it was very nice to hear from you :wave:

[Juli_G]

I only have one thing to say, slightly off-topic. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!! No more talk about German chocolate cake! I'm German! I like cake! You might as well tie me down and poke me with a cattle prod! Sheer torture! I'm drooling and eventually my keyboard will short out and cause a neighborhood blackout! I won't stand for that! I need to keep my cheese and meat cold!!!! :wave:

[Primate]

I only have one thing to say, slightly off-topic. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE!! No more talk about German chocolate cake! I'm German! I like cake! You might as well tie me down and poke me with a cattle prod! Sheer torture! I'm drooling and eventually my keyboard will short out and cause a neighborhood blackout! I won't stand for that! I need to keep my cheese and meat cold!!!! :wave:

No worries Juli I wont mention Germ..... UH that one thing anymore ;) :D :wave:

[Juli_G]

:nono:


Thank you! Much appreciated!! :lol:

[Rosebud]

“The Chair of Harvard's nutrition department went on record before a 1973 U.S. Senate Select Committee investigating fad diets: "The Atkins Diet is nonsense... Any book that recommends unlimited amounts of meat, butter, and eggs, as this one does, in my opinion is dangerous. The author who makes the suggestion is guilty of malpractice."

So does this means this person who had the education and knowledge on the subject was right?
Well my take on this is that the spokesman for the Chair of Harvard's Nutrition Department clearly did NOT have any education or knowledge about low carbing.

Just my point of view. ;)

Rosebud:rose:

[KryssiMc]

This type of unrestrained, shoot-from-the-psyche venting is called "immaturity" where I come from.

I realize that you might be upset at what he said but please keep in mind that this is the War Zone. Please read the sticky that accompanies this part of the forum. What Primate was doing is exactly what the War Zone is for...controversial subjects.

[Primate]

Thanks for having my back kryssi :D

[KryssiMc]

No problem buddy...but you're on your own if you mention that German you-know-what again...LOL!

[Jiggerz]

German Chocolate cake is such a waste of a good ole REGULAR chocolate cake...... the freakin coconut gets in the way. :)

[Primate]

SHHHHHhhhh don't say that word so loud they will hear you ;) I didn't say it..It wasn't me...She did it...

[KryssiMc]

I gotta agree with Jig on that one (no coconut).

So is this the new controversial subject? German Chocolate vs. Regular?

What a segue from the original post!

[Juli_G]

German Chocolate cake is such a waste of a good ole REGULAR chocolate cake...... the freakin coconut gets in the way. :)


I love it! I'm a coconut addict...ex-coconut addict. I used to eat it straight from the bag!! I couldn't help myself! :wave:

[LiveWell]

DONT LIKE COCONUT???!! ... hmmm freaks.. :D Its soooo goooooood.

Boy this thread took a turn in subjects didnt it.

[Jiggerz]

Oh I USED to love coconut (toasted in the oven works for me), but not.....on.....chocolate........cake.........thanks.

[KryssiMc]

Almond Joy candy bars...miss those alot...yum

[potatofree]

I love it! I'm a coconut addict...ex-coconut addict. I used to eat it straight from the bag!! I couldn't help myself! :wave:

Unsweetened coconut is legal. I whirred some up in the food processor with splenda and a little coconut oil and made coconut butter that tastes just like the little sweet lumps in the bag of regular coconut. :D

Coconut milk (again unsweetened) is great to cook with, especially in custards or cheesecake.... The saturated fats and medium-chain triglicerides are VERY healthy!

[Nancy LC]

Oh wow! That sounds yummy. Thanks for the ideas. :D *drool*

[Juli_G]

Unsweetened coconut is legal. I whirred some up in the food processor with splenda and a little coconut oil and made coconut butter that tastes just like the little sweet lumps in the bag of regular coconut. :D

Coconut milk (again unsweetened) is great to cook with, especially in custards or cheesecake.... The saturated fats and medium-chain triglicerides are VERY healthy!


Oh boy oh boy!! Yippee!! :lol: Can you tell I'm excited? I have this big dopey "I love coconut" grin on my face! :yum: Thanks for the tip! :wave:

[Jiggerz]

someone say cheesecake? :)

[301]

Primate I enjoyed your post. It has brought out many different views and it is obvious as being one of those kids that education by the parent makes a ton of difference.

My 14 year old look at our change in life and decided he wanted to eat healthier and get more excercise. We did not push him - slthough the elimination of most bad snacks probably encouraged the thought more.

Thanks

[potatofree]

someone say cheesecake? :)

Try blending a cup of coconut milk, an 8-oz block of cream cheese, an envelope of unflavored gelatin (softened in a little cold water, then melted in the microwave) and Splenda to taste(I use the liquid from sweetzfree.com)... blend really well, then chill until set.

I've made baked cheesecake with coconut milk too, and chopped up a Z-Carb bar.... had to stop THAT, since I couldn't keep my snout out of it.

[joanee]

Great thread, Primate, I have to say that I agree with you.

One thing that lots of parents don't realize is that fats are absolutely necessary for the development of children's brains and neurological pathways. You should not give your child low-fat versions of good food. But the main thing is, the plain fact of the matter is, parents can control almost every aspect of their kids' diets.

(BTW: You, the reader of this post, know very well whether or not the stuff I'm writing applies to you. You can choose whether or not to be hurt/offended, so don't be a masochist. If what I write doesn't describe you, then DON'T TAKE OFFENSE! You know it describes somebody out there. If it's not you, fine. If it is you, wake up and smell the coffee.)

Who does the shopping for the family? Who decides what goes into the refrigerator and what gets put on the shelves? Who doles out the allowance? Who decides what proportion of an allowance can be used for personal snacks? Who pays for school lunches, or prepares and packs the children's lunches? Who decides what is for dessert? Who buys the XBox? Who decides how much time can be spent on the computer or in front of the TV? Who decides whether the kids can join an afterschool sports program? These decisions are in the parent's hands. The problem is that lots of parents have left these crucial child-rearing decisions to the children. You don't have to sit your kids down and "teach" them about good nutrition -- you just have to feed them right! If parents are providing three healthy meals a day, and providing healthy snacks, and limiting the amount of money kids have available to spend on unhealthy snacks, then the occasional Snickers bar that a kid buys on his own is not gonna make any difference. Believe me -- there were seven kids in my family, and we didn't have a lot of extra money. When we got home from school, we were hongry. We'd eat anything, and I mean anything we found to eat. My Mom did the weekly shopping: if there had been carrots and carrot cake in the fridge, we'd have eaten the carrot cake. But my Mom never managed to leave carrot cake in the fridge. Somehow, mysteriously, the only snack foods available were carrots. Or celery. Or stone-ground whole-wheat bread and real, dairy butter. Or the leftovers from last night's healthy dinner. If you buy Kool-aid, the kid are sure as hell gonna drink it, and if you buy white bread and bologna, they're sure as hell gonna turn it into a sandwich, and if you don't set limits on their Xbox time, they're sure as hell not gonna set limits themselves. Parents need to stop letting kids 'parent' themselves.

Also, both my parents worked full-time jobs. No way were either my mom or my dad gonna cook individual-preference meals for nine different people. Either you were hungry enough to eat what everybody else was having for dinner that day, or you weren't. End of story. I guarantee you, we had nine people around the breakfast and dinner table every day, nine people opening up their brown-paper lunch bags every day, nine people eating exactly what the other eight people were eating every day, and not one picky eater in the whole bunch. I loooove okra. Beans. Squash. Broccoli. Cauliflower. Lentils. When you're hungry enough, good-for-you food tastes gooood.

OK, so my $.02 is in 1956 money.

[cygirl]

Hi there! I can say I don't agree with you 100% Primate. I WISH someone would have helped me with my diet when I was younger. Maybe the torture of middle school and high school wouldn't have been so bad. Maybe I wouldn't have cried my eyes out and wanted to quit school because people were constatly calling me fat.
I wish someone would have taught me the value of an apple or some fresh veggies. Maybe I wouldn't have gotten so heavy. Interesting post! Have a great day! :wave:


It is our duty as parent to do everything in our power for this not to happen to our kids.!!

[TheCaveman]

You should not give your child low-fat versions of good food.

Heh, oxymoron? Can anyone name some of these, please?

[Zuleikaa]

Heh, oxymoron? Can anyone name some of these, please?
Cheese, cream, milk, butter, sour cream, coconut, lard.

[TheCaveman]

Cheese, cream, milk, butter, sour cream, coconut, lard.

Low-fat butter?

[TBoneMitch]

Caveman, I have actually seen low fat butter (sigh!) on sale at my grocery some time ago. Half the fat, and if you read the ingredients, they replaced that fat with water. And the price was not much lower.

So you can imagine how much profit they make off this crap! Not to mention that the water content must create furious splashings when you melt this «butter» in the pan!

[TheCaveman]

Well I'll be.

So we can debate (elsewhere please) whether there are good foods that have a low-fat version, but low-fat lard? Low-fat coconut? What exactly is the point of low-fat lard?

Another disturbing oxymoron. So if we exclude low-fat dairy as being bad-to-worse, we get oxymoronic spacefoods like lite butter and Weight Watchers Lard? That's not a very long list, finally, of "low-fat versions of good food", eh?

[potatofree]

Semantics aside, trying to feed a small child a lowfat diet is detrimental to their development, which seems to be the point of the post being picked at.

[Primate]

Well I'll be.

So we can debate (elsewhere please) whether there are good foods that have a low-fat version, but low-fat lard? Low-fat coconut? What exactly is the point of low-fat lard?

Another disturbing oxymoron. So if we exclude low-fat dairy as being bad-to-worse, we get oxymoronic spacefoods like lite butter and Weight Watchers Lard? That's not a very long list, finally, of "low-fat versions of good food", eh?

I think Zuleikaa was giving you an Idea lof low-fat foods since you asked for an "example of low-fat good foods" not the entire list. If you want a lengthy list here is a lot of examples of high fat vs low-fat or alternative lower-fat items.

Type of food Replace high-fat foods... ... with lower-fat alternatives
Soups high-fat broths, cream soups low-fat vegetable and meat soups, most ready-to-eat soups (provided that no cream is added during preparation)
Sauces cream sauce, butter sauce, béarnaise sauce, hollandaise sauce, mayonnaise (incl. light mayonnaise), pesto, certain ready-to-eat sauces, sauce cubes or pastes (read the nutritional information on the pack) tomato sauce, ketchup, tomato purée, low-fat cooking sauce, many ready-to-eat sauces (read the nutritional data; up to 5 g fat/dl is low fat), home-made sauces from meat stock without any supplementary fat, sauces from yogurt, light quark, soya sauce
Meat, meat products and sausage
Where possible, always cut off any visible fat Breaded meat or fatty meat e.g. minced meat, marinated beef, salted or pickled pork products, mutton, duck, goose, sausage meat.
Bacon, meat loaf, preserved meat, terrines and paté.
Sausage and sausage products, salami Lean beef, veal, horsemeat,
Roast beef, lean boiling beef, turkey ham, ham, dried beef (e.g. Bündnerfleisch).
Fish and seafood, tinned products Tinned fish preserved in oil, such as tuna, anchovies or sardines
Fish with fatty sauces (melted butter, mayonnaise, béarnaise etc.)
High-fat types of preparation, e.g. deep-fried or breaded fish, such as octopus in batter, fish fingers, frito misto Sardines and tuna in water, without oil.
Relatively low-fat fish include perch, pike, carp, trout, whiting, plaice, sole, cod, and seafoods of all kinds.
High-fat fish such as eel, herring, salmon etc. contain a lot of health-promoting omega-3 fatty acid
Low-fat types of preparation are preferable (smoked, grilled, poached or steamed fish)
Milk and dairy products Single cream (25% fat), full-fat cream (or whipping cream), sour double cream (crème fraiche), sauce cream, Mascapone, double cream.
Whole milk, condensed milk, some cocoa-containing breakfast drinks (read the information on the pack) Light cream, sour single cream (15% fat)
Skimmed milk, low-fat milk, buttermilk, drinking whey, sour milk, yogurt drink.
Yogurt, kefir
Cheese Cream quark
All semi-fat and full fat cheese, cream and double cream cheese.
Cheese dishes such as cheesecake, quiche lorraine, fondue and raclette. Low-fat or light quark, cottage cheese, blanc battu without the fat, semi- or low-fat cheese (max. 30% fat)
Bread and dough Croissants, wholemeal croissants, butter-enriched bread.
Cake dough, puff pastry Breads of all kinds, rusks, rolls, crispbreads.
Pizza dough
Grains and cereal products Some muesli and cornflake brands (read the data on the pack)
Pasta products made with fat or cheese, e.g. egg noodles fried in butter, lasagne, spag-hetti in a pesto sauce etc. Wheat, barley, rye, oats, maize, rice, spelt, millet, buckwheat, amaranth and quinoa and their products, such as flour, semolina, flakes, pasta, egg noodles etc.
Potatoes Chips (french fries), fried potatoes, roast potatoes, croquettes, potato gratin with cream. Salted potatoes, potatoes boiled in their skins, mashed potato, potato stock (with only a little cream or butter), baked potatoes, potato gratin (without cream, a little cheese) Savoyard potatoes
Pulses Soya beans, soya flour Lentils of all kinds (red, green etc.), peas of all kinds (green, yellow, chickpeas), beans of all kinds (green beans, dried beans, red kidney beans, borlotti beans, soisson beans etc.), tofu
Vegetables and mushrooms Ready-to-eat products such as cream spinach, vegetables in high-fat sauces, ready-to-eat salads with mayonnaise or cream sauces, vegetables either baked or preserved in oil Any fresh, deep-frozen, dried or tinned vegetables
Fruit Avocado, olives Any fresh, deep-frozen, dried fruit, compôte, fruit juice etc.
Nuts and seeds Although nuts, almonds, sesame and poppy seeds, linseed etc. are healthy, they are rich in fats and should be eaten in moderation. Chestnuts, coconut milk
Snacks and nibbles Salted nuts and almonds
crisps (potato chips), crackers (read the information on the pack)
Butter sticks, flûtes, cheese crackers etc. Low-fat crisps (potato chips) and crackers
Grissini breadsticks, salt sticks or pretzels
Sugar, sweets
Chocolate, Danish pastries, ice cream, desserts
Sweets are often "sweet fats", i.e. they contain a high proportion of fat - so eat them in moderation Ice cream, cream desserts, chocolate mousse, cream quark, Mascapone, tiramisu, chocolate, pralines, chocolate bars
Cakes, confectionery, Danish pastries, tarts, puff pastry.
Sweets such as toffee, marzipan, nougat Low-fat desserts (without cream) such as water ice, sorbet, light quark and yogurt, yogurt desserts, mousses and similar desserts without cream, fruit salad or compôte
Low-fat cakes and biscuits such as Lebkuchen (without the filling), honey cakes, gingerbread, meringues
Wine gums, chewing gum, pear drops etc.
Drinks
Beverages (with the exception of milk drinks) do not contain fat - this also applies to alcoholic drinks. However, alcohol slows the metabolism of fat in the body and so contributes indirectly to weight gain - drink alcohol in moderation All alcoholic beverages such as beer, alcopops, champagne, wine, liqueurs, aperitifs, spirits etc. Any other drinks (excluding milk drinks)

let me know if this is not a satisfactory list for you and I will try to put a better one together.

I do agree that Lard is an odd choice for low-fat since lard is uhhh.... Fat :D

I am ok with this discussion here. This post has taken many turns along the way. I think it is interesting all the side conversations that come up off of this subject...:wave:

[TheCaveman]

Ah. I was trying to think of good foods that have a low-fat version. Sorry for the confusion.

[JennLynnRN]

I actually have very strong opinions about this (original) topic. When I see parents who are very overweight with children 5 or 6 years of age also very overweight it saddens me. I really think that this is a from of child abuse. All physiological reasons aside, there is no reason a 5 or 6 year old should be overweight (and no, I am not talking abot just chibby baby fat here). Do you know why they renamed "juvenile diabetes" and "adult onset diabetes" to "type I" and "type II" diabetes? It's because CHILDREN are developing type II diabtes so it can no longer be referred to as "adult onset". That's disgusting. Do you realize how much junk a 10 year old needs to eat in their short life to tax their pancreas so much that they eliminate its ability to produce insulin??? These poor children don't know any better. They have no idea what kind of torment and health problems are in store fo them. IT'S A PARENT'S RESPONSIBILTY TO DO ALL THEY CAN TO ENSURE THEIR CHILDREN GROW UP HEALTHY. It's no wonder out health care system is so strained. Okay, I am done ranting now......

[mio1996]

I actually have very strong opinions about this (original) topic. When I see parents who are very overweight with children 5 or 6 years of age also very overweight it saddens me. I really think that this is a from of child abuse. All physiological reasons aside, there is no reason a 5 or 6 year old should be overweight (and no, I am not talking abot just chibby baby fat here). Do you know why they renamed "juvenile diabetes" and "adult onset diabetes" to "type I" and "type II" diabetes? It's because CHILDREN are developing type II diabtes so it can no longer be referred to as "adult onset". That's disgusting. Do you realize how much junk a 10 year old needs to eat in their short life to tax their pancreas so much that they eliminate its ability to produce insulin??? These poor children don't know any better. They have no idea what kind of torment and health problems are in store fo them. IT'S A PARENT'S RESPONSIBILTY TO DO ALL THEY CAN TO ENSURE THEIR CHILDREN GROW UP HEALTHY. It's no wonder out health care system is so strained. Okay, I am done ranting now......Well said, Jenn!

[dws1119]

I have just spent the last hour reading all these posts. Jenny you are right on target with the obese children. Parents ARE responsible for providing healthy foods. For proper development they need a higher fat diet. The problem is all these peocessed foods. The big companies rule what is served. All those hidden carbs. Natural foods are much better. What can be more natural than a chicken leg or a big juicy steak. Too much wheat, not enough veggies.
With societies views on body image, we have another set of problems.



But back to the forbidden-----GERMAN CHOCOLATE CAKE----

That is my father's favorite cake. Since my parents follow the LC WOL with me, I had to do something special for his birthday. I actually made a LC german chocolate cake. I found the recipe on another site.

Actually his entire birthday meal was LC. Everyone in my family ate this way, even the grandkids. No one knew the difference. The cake was the crowning touch. It was WONDERFUL. You would not ever know it was LC. So you can have your cake and eat it too.

[JennLynnRN]

Well, I'm glad 2 people have agreed with me do far! I was sure I'd get hate mail for that one! lol

[LiveWell]

But back to the forbidden-----GERMAN CHOCOLATE CAKE----



Are those your real stats? Thats amazing - congradulations. Im interested in this recipe :) do you remember where you got it or can you post it in the recipe place .. pls pls pls!

[craftymama]

as the mother of 7 kids and the oldest of 9 kids, here are my $.02 nutritional education is the key. the majority of my sisters and brothers and my kids were in to sports. baseball, track, gymnastics football, soccer, volleyball. we covered most of the sports. while growing up we weren't skinny, but the majority of our bodies were muscle. Every single one of us developed a weight problem when we stopped growing taller. most of us kept it in check with high school or church sports and dancing.
but when you stop and you keep eating the same kinds of foods you get fat. because of the large families, and not so great incomes our diets consisted of very high carbs, pasta, home made bread, potatoes, rice etc. very little meat,or fresh vegies,so even when we stopped eating so much the nutrition just wasn't there. i watch my kids raise their kids, and the cycle continues. i'm hoping to break the cycle. i've started to discuss nutrition with my kids and grandkids. holiday dinners are loaded with vegies- fresh and cooked. and do you know at easter very little of the deserts were eaten? everyone of the salads and vegie dishes were gone. so i see hope on the horizon

[potatofree]

We do the best we can with what we have. I do get irritated when I see people letting their kids feast on crap, and it IS child neglect to fail to provide adequate nutrition to them. How much is poor education, inadequate financial resources, or just plain apathy or laziness? <shrug>

I don't think I could look at myself in the mirror if I didn't do the best I could for my kids. The thing is, who gets to DECIDE what's best for them? If I let him eat fast-food twice a month, someone could be looking at ME and thinking "That stupid woman lets her kid eat that CRAP!" :rolleyes: or look into my grocery cart and see his Cocoa Pebbles and assume I'm an idiot for letting him eat THAT, when thye don't know that's the only sugar junk cereal he's had in 3 months...

And yes, I'm fat. He's chunky. His pediatrician is aware of it, and we're working together to keep it in line.

[nikkil]

Yep, when you're out in public don't judge what you see right then and there, that's for sure! I'm guilty of looking at an obese person and thinking 'I wish I could tell them about LC" - who knows, maybe they are LCing! Also, if somebody looked in my grocery cart and saw the beans, bread, juice they would never guess that I'm an LCer. I'm also buying for DH, 2 teenage boys and a 7-year-old!

I'm thankful that none of my children have weight issues. I'll take some credit for that, tho. They're all active, we sign up for sports and go to the rec centre, play outside in the yard, pick up games of basketball/street hockey/bike riding/swimming... on and on.

I've never rewarded my kids with food, never tried to cheer them up or make them feel better with food, we discuss nutrition and how it's important to eat the "food that keeps you healthy and helps you grow" before you eat the "food that doesn't". "Treat foods" are okay in moderation but the majority of what you eat should be healthy. I always have fresh fruit and veggies in the house, sandwich fixings like meats and cheeses, spinach and cucumber, etc, lots of salad fixings, make home cooked meals MOST of the time (say, 6 out of 7 dinners), no-sugar cereals.... I don't buy junk food or soda on a regular basis but they have them occasionally. I can't remember the last time we went to McD's :p

Lastly, I've never made my kids clean their plate. I do encourage them to eat a little more if they're just picking at it, I try to only serve them what I figure they will eat and they're welcome to more if they want it, and if they don't eat it all it can be wrapped and put away for later. It seems to work out quite well, especially with the 2 human garbage disposals, a.k.a. teenage boys :lol: :lol: :lol:

[dws1119]

Are those your real stats? Thats amazing - congradulations. Im interested in this recipe :) do you remember where you got it or can you post it in the recipe place .. pls pls pls!


Yes those are my real stats. I had gastric bypass surgery a year ago. It was a last ditch effort for me. My medical problems were life threatening.
WLS is no miracle cure. I credit my loss to following the recommended LC WOL. This is preached to us from the time we first start the process to have surgery. Many of the people who had surgery at the same time I did continued to eat the way they did before. They lost weight but alot have gained the lbs back.

As far as the cake, I'll post it on the recipe area. It takes some time to make but don't all the good ones. It is well worth the effort though.

[nikkil]

there's a great Devil's Food Cake recipe in the dessert section of the recipe area here on the forum. It mixes up in one bowl and is made in the microwave. No kidding - it's 2#$~$%~% KILLER!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

I think it's a variation of the 3-minute chocolate cake??

[cygirl]

Yes those are my real stats.


WOW.!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :thup: :thup: :thup:

[cygirl]

Well, I'm glad 2 people have agreed with me do far! I was sure I'd get hate mail for that one! lol


Jenn I also have a strong opinion on this subject and here comes my mail.

I totally agree with you on this.This is a form of child abuse,Now having said that what the heck could we or should we be doing with these parents??

I see these small obese children and think of all the torment they will take alone there lives(Discused me)and makes me mad!!

Sorry this is my opinion.

[Steph570]

My son is 15 and 5'9" and he weighs 170 pounds and thinks he is fat. He started the weight gain after the doctors put him on an enourmous amount of depression medicines that I eventually flushed down the toilet. He is chubby but not fat and still growing. I ry to get him to go and do things but he likes his video games- so leave him be. Try to keep healthy food choices in the house and leave him be. I believe that if I say oh yes you need to go on a diet it will only hinder him as has been done to me for years so now I have a very huge complex along with emotional problems so he is still growing and will probably eventually get to 6'3" like his dad and the little bit of weight will spread. He likes low carb and chooses to do it on his own not by me forcing him to. I do believe though that in a way us as parents set the prime example as to what they put in their mouths because we buy and prepare their food. To make a long sensless story short I have one of those over weight kids at home and I will not make him go on a diet to give him more of a low self esteem than he already has! He's a kid and I will buy thngs that are good for him to eat and just love him and watch him grow because eventually I think he will do just that, grow up not out.

[JennLynnRN]

Jenn I also have a strong opinion on this subject and here comes my mail.

I totally agree with you on this.This is a form of child abuse,Now having said that what the heck could we or should we be doing with these parents??

I see these small obese children and think of all the torment they will take alone there lives(Discused me)and makes me mad!!

Sorry this is my opinion.


Wow.....we are actually agreeing on something for once! LOL Thanks for backing me up Cygirl! :lol:

[nikkil]

My son is 15 and 5'9" and he weighs 170 pounds and thinks he is fat. He started the weight gain after the doctors put him on an enourmous amount of depression medicines that I eventually flushed down the toilet. He is chubby but not fat and still growing. I ry to get him to go and do things but he likes his video games- so leave him be. Try to keep healthy food choices in the house and leave him be. I believe that if I say oh yes you need to go on a diet it will only hinder him as has been done to me for years so now I have a very huge complex along with emotional problems so he is still growing and will probably eventually get to 6'3" like his dad and the little bit of weight will spread. He likes low carb and chooses to do it on his own not by me forcing him to. I do believe though that in a way us as parents set the prime example as to what they put in their mouths because we buy and prepare their food. To make a long sensless story short I have one of those over weight kids at home and I will not make him go on a diet to give him more of a low self esteem than he already has! He's a kid and I will buy thngs that are good for him to eat and just love him and watch him grow because eventually I think he will do just that, grow up not out.

First of all I don't think that 5'9" and 170 is that bad at all. Sure, a little on the higher side than average but doesn't sound bad to me at all. Like you said, he'll most likely "stretch" :p

Just an idea....

video games: what about DDR (dance, dance revolution)? That's a dang workout!!! Another idea might be to just find out what sports or activities he might be interested in at least trying and do what you can to facilitate that. If he tries something he might get "hooked". I wouldn't focus on his weight at all, just that it's always a good idea to be active and get exercise and everybody should do it regardless of their weight. He could make friends and have a great time, to boot :D

I like that you're not pushing him to lose weight or go on a 'diet'. I've heard of a lot of people who have been royally messed up because of parents putting them on diets. IMO, it's more important to focus on healthy lifestyle and to be an example of how to live it :)

Take care!

[AJourney]

I'm with ya Primate! As a working mother, I force myself to find the time to take my daughter out for a bit every night. Tv is limited in our home, and I make sure that there are healthy snacks available - she gets treats once a week, which is something she looks forward too, but teaching our children good eating habits now, will prevent issues in the future....

[simswife]

I try to teach my kids by example. I have ten year old twin girls and when they ask me if i am on a diet I say no...I want to grow old with you! I think moderation is the key. I let them eat junk on occasion and never make an issue out of it. I usually find half of it around the house later and toss it. i have taught them what there school doesn't teach them too...that whole food guide thing drives me crazy. I tell them fat is not the enemy...sugar is! neither is anywhere near fat. Also the benefits of exercise. They both vountarily joined the track team and play soccer 3 times a week. I am very lucky that they are the way they are but I would like to believe that I helped them get there. But you are right...our society is setting these kids up for issues whether they be real or perceived. I never watch TV...they do...maybe a couple of hours a week. We also head out camping and hiking throughout the summer. it does take energy and a committment to teach kids to be healthy...not slim! However as a parent iI have made that committment adn hope others do as well. For us the key is healthy...not slim. As a point of interest...my girls are identical and i have a scale in my house. The heavier (2lbs) of the two after weighing herself one day asked me if she is fat!!! I of course told her no...but where do they get these ideas??? School....TV....media!! Protect them from those huge influences too!

[KryssiMc]

video games: what about DDR (dance, dance revolution)? That's a dang workout!!!

Nikki, you have that right! We got the double one so that my daughter and I can do it together. Fantastic workout and sooooo much fun. I think this is a great alternative for people who don't like traditional exercise. You don't even feel like you're workin' it till you're done!

Maybe you should post that idea in an actual thread. It's definitely a novel approach.

[MetalMom]

I agree with ya 100%

[potatofree]

I'm with ya Primate! As a working mother, I force myself to find the time to take my daughter out for a bit every night. Tv is limited in our home, and I make sure that there are healthy snacks available - she gets treats once a week, which is something she looks forward too, but teaching our children good eating habits now, will prevent issues in the future....

..and not only do you AND your daughter get the exercise, but she gets to fall asleep at night knowing you made her a priority.

[kyrie]

When I was 11, I was maybe 15 pounds overweight, but it would never have bothered me if it hadn't bothered my mom so much. She had been telling me not to eat too much (or I'd get fat and boys wouldn't like me) for as long as I could remember. When I was 12, she convinced me to join Weight Watchers (they had a kids group). I followed the plan perfectly, and actually gained a pound.

The thing is, I think that I was fine at that weight. I did not eat much, and I was very active, sometimes pushing myself to ride my bicycle up and down the hills in my neighborhood so my legs wouldn't be so soft. Of course, I thought I must be fat. I wasn't, though, and didn't really get fat until I was a teenager and started sneaking food so my mom wouldn't know I was eating. When I moved out, my eating habits were horrible, and I gained a lot more.

My mom never meant to mess me up-- I know she always loved me a lot. She just really had no idea.

[DarthRaidr]

My daughter is 6 (65# 47-48"tall), I wouldn't call it dieting, but watching what and how much she does eat.
3 sides of the family (both mine, hubs moms side) are big, in the obese catagorey by that height/weight chart thing.

She is VERY active t-ball, swimming, biking..ect. and I want her to have that mcdonalds food if she wants it, but I only get her a 4pc kids meal...not the 6pc larger fries chocolate shake and pie she asks for.
When I see those kids on the Maury show and the parents tell you their diet..6 slices of bacon 6 eggs 5 slices of toast for breakfast for a 4yr old....That's not a genetic problem that's a parenting problem.

[Steph570]

I agree DarthRaidr. We buy the food and cook it so if we make it available then we are responsible for what goes in their mouth. If we don't buy the junk then they have very limited access to it.

[LauraC123]

I do not believe in "diets" for children...however, I believe you SHOULD always provide love & support for your children AND a healthy way of eating..as well as in building up there esteem and getting them into an active lifestyle...

Build your children up, never tear them down:)

[DarthRaidr]

Unless you actually tell your child..hey you're on a diet, they would never know it, all they would know is, this is the healthy way to eat.

[drdemars]

Growing up in the 30's we ate what is called depression food (fried potatoes, gravy, white bread, pork chops, potted meat, veryl little salads, breakfast cereals) I believe I was about the same weight as mentioned but very active outdoors. I had no trouble staying with the bunch and excelling in sports all through school. I don't think at that time there was such a word as "diet". In fact at school there seemed to be only one or two kids that were called fat ( they never involved themselfs in school yard play) I agree that exercise is very important in physical well being as well as proper food intake.

[byrdie16]

When I see those kids on the Maury show and the parents tell you their diet..6 slices of bacon 6 eggs 5 slices of toast for breakfast for a 4yr old....That's not a genetic problem that's a parenting problem.
I personally have seen "failure to thrive" babies in the hospital I worked at whose parents said "the baby makes me give him Mountain Dew. They won't drink anything else!" Dah!!!!!!!!!!! We used to say you should have a certain IQ before you could become a parent!
Carol

[juelz4u]

This was right on! There are so many times when I had to walk a mile to get to my friends house (I lived in the country) and I wanted to! Ya, would of been nice after a day of playing in the creek, walken up hill to get to the cool spot in the woods, swimming, ect. that it would of been awesome to get on my wheeler or scooter and buzz home or have mom pick me up..but no..a little more excersize for me and ya know what? It was great to come home and have spent the day outside and to be so exhausted that a Play Station wouldn't of crossed my mind! This business of kids sitting at home watching the tube or playing computer/video games is a shame for our kids! If they only knew what they were missen!! It's our responsibility, as parents to show our kids what they (and us) are missen! So our first family outing won't be climbing Mount Everest, but by cracky, we can take a walk, do a little fishing, or make a game out of picken up sticks in the yard...just get out and enjoy life....turn the TV off! ( I say as I sit infront of my computer..lol...but did have a day outside ;-)

[AntiM]

Sorry folks ...

I don't normally post to threads I haven't read 'cover to cover', but I thought this blog post was fascinating and apropos to the thread:

ModBlog: Parents, Back Off! (http://turtleway.modblog.com/?show=blogview&blog_id=309222)

There have been some reports in the news about this study of parenting style and obesity:

Food Restriction May Cause Child Obesity (Web MD) (http://my.webmd.com/content/article/94/103069.htm)

Read the Full Study (http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/full/114/4/e429#T1)

In the study, researchers followed two groups of families with children ages 5 to 7 years old– one in which the children were at a high risk for obesity and one with a low risk. They looked at some of the styles of interaction of the parents around food – did they monitor fat intake? Did they attempt to restrict food consumption? Was there pressure to eat more? By following the two groups of families, as well as the various parenting styles, the researchers could try to ferret out more of the interactions.

It seems that in the high-risk group, parental restriction of food predicted a larger weight gain. This association did not occur among low-risk children. Additionally, pressuring kids to eat was associated with less weight gain in both groups - in fact their BMIs dropped, which, depending upon the child, wasn’t always good. In other words, kids do exactly the opposite of what you tell them. Surprise!

Good things about the research: It’s trying to tease out ways that obesity risk might enter in, as well as the children’s weight to begin with. It’s following the groups over time, so it isn’t just a purely correlational, cross-sectional study.

Not so good: There weren’t a whole lot of families in the study (57 total). But more importantly, it’s always difficult to ferret out these interactions that go both ways. Is the parent acting in a certain way because of something about the child, or vice versa? It’s very often both, with parents and children participating in a back-and-forth dance that psychology researchers call “bi-directional”. Figuring out what is going on is difficult, and answers are pieced together bit by bit. However, this study was making a serious attempt to add to the knowledge on this important issue.

The researchers point to previous work that showed that parental control of child eating was associated with the children having poorer ability to self-regulate their eating behavior, and higher body weight. However, it wasn’t clear whether the children’s eating patterns and weight were eliciting the restrictions or the other way around. When you get down to the details of this study, it showed both, but definitely that the parent’s style does plays an important role. (The researchers didn’t have a lot to say about the bit where parents encouraging their kids to eat apparently produced less eating – I’m sure they didn’t want to advise parents to try this!)

The answer seems to be to encourage activity and eating nutritious foods (read: don’t have junk in the house), and let the children regulate the amount of food they eat.

PS - JennLynn, Cygirl and others who feel obesity is child abuse ... This certainly isn't hate mail ... but I'll just ask that you to consider not judging people by their looks alone.

I was obese by age 5, enrolled in Weight Watchers and fretted over incessently by my well-meaning and fat (like all the women in our family) mother. I followed every eating plan, I took every amphetamine prescribed and endured a lot of psychological trauma being the weird fat kid - at home as well as at school. I don't think I ever ate a bowl of cereal during childhood without it being meticulously weighed by my mom first. We never had any type of junk food in the house and I was an active kid.

I didn't have any type of metabolic disorder - at least not one that could have been recognized at the time ... still I kept gaining. I think my mom would literally have given her life if that could have made me slim.

I feel ... no, I know that I became as fat as I did in no small part due to the intense dieting I endurred during my growing years. I weighed 300 pounds and had developed an eating disorder by the time I turned 18 - all this back in the pre-Obesity Epidemic early 80's. My parents were so well intentioned, yet dieting backfired in every way possible for me.

Just one story you might keep in mind next time you're ready to judge someone you don't know.

[KryssiMc]

Monika, you are right and so are a few others that have posted in this thread. My daughter lost her excess weight without me being on her back and just having healthy choices in the house. Being in her older teens, she might have learned some from my example. The point is, I never approached this as a "diet", but a healthier way of eating. She does occasionally indulge in some junk food that she bought herself, but I see her just as often make herself a salad for a snack. But never do I "get on her case" about it. She's learning about balance, not deprivation and the rebelliousness is just not there because she's making her own choices.

[cygirl]

Monica, i am sorry if you thought i was harsh.I do not judge by the way a person looks but i need to say if i do see a obese 5 year old i must be right in saying this is not healthy.Children dont get obese by eating healthy foods and having lots of activities.I think it also safe to say obese children are getting the bad foods from their parents.Most of the obese children have unhealthy parents from what i have seen in the schools for the past 20 years.
So i stick to what i said,it is the parents that must take control(somehow)

[kwikdriver]

Monica, i am sorry if you thought i was harsh.I do not judge by the way a person looks but i need to say if i do see a obese 5 year old i must be right in saying this is not healthy.Children dont get obese by eating healthy foods and having lots of activities.I think it also safe to say obese children are getting the bad foods from their parents.Most of the obese children have unhealthy parents from what i have seen in the schools for the past 20 years.
So i stick to what i said,it is the parents that must take control(somehow)

I was an obese 5 year old who never ate sugar or junk food (we were too poor for that stuff, and I didn't like it anyway), and was so active people were worried something was wrong with me. I slept 4 - 5 hours a day, and if I wasn't sleeping or in school, I was doing something, usually something physical. My siblings weren't as active as I was, but they weren't slugs either, and they were also overweight. Both my parents had weight problems, my mother even as a child, and she grew up at a time when there was hardly such a thing as junk food.

It's a dangerous game, to look at an effect and presume the cause is self evident.

[cygirl]

So kwik,tell me what the outcome was/or is and now what kind of healthy lifestyle are you on that is working for you?What are your stats?
Is this a medical problem you have and is it corrected.
Are you telling me that fat parents breed fat kids case closed?

[kwikdriver]

So kwik,tell me what the outcome was/or is and now what kind of healthy lifestyle are you on that is working for you?

The outcome is, I went from an active but obese kid to an active but obese adult. My "healthy lifestyle" is low carbing, and thus far I've lost a little over 100 pounds, judging from clothes sizes.


What are your stats?

An irrelevant question, one I couldn't answer anyway, as I don't weigh myself.


Is this a medical problem you have and is it corrected.

Some people think it's a medical problem; others think it's a "lack of willpower," and all I have to do is "put down the fork."


Are you telling me that fat parents breed fat kids case closed?

I thought I cautioned against presuming to know the cause by looking at the effects? Why then would I commit the same fallacy myself?

[AntiM]

Krissi ~ That's exactly what I would have done in your place. I'm glad it's working well for her and she's finding her own balance.

Cygirl ~ You didn't hurt my feeling, no need to feel sorry. I posted because either you hadn't heard that the cause of childhood obsesity it's not always as simple as junk food and inactivity - or you don't believe it. It's up to you if you want to continue generalizing but keep in mind that people like kwikdriver, myself and many, many others have no reason to lie to you.

[potatofree]

To me, hovering over a kid, weighing their food, restricting them, having them take diet pills or any other harsh weight-loss methods will make them just as fat or fatter then letting them eat junk and sit in front of the tv. It sure would make the parent feel better for DOING something, but I'd wager that kind of pressure backfires in ways we're just starting to understand.

What set me off lately is overhearing a bunch of 10-12 year old girls in the mall... one says to her only SLIGHTLY bigger friend (not a one of them the least bit overweight!) "My Mom says you have a big butt and if I eat what you do, I'll never have a boyfriend!" Okay, now THAT is child abuse!!! :rolleyes:

[cygirl]

I thought I cautioned against presuming to know the cause by looking at the effects?

What I ment was to ask..........

If you know no medical reason for your/others childhood obesety,you say fat parents just dont bread fat kids,and they are still obese even with proper diet and exersise...............then why are they obese at a young age. I would love to know what your answer is.
Everyone seems to think i am being mean but i would like the answer.Dont tell me there isnt one.Too many people here to tell me they know.

[kwikdriver]

If you know no medical reason for your/others childhood obesety,you say fat parents just dont bread fat kids,and they are still obese even with proper diet and exersise...............then why are they obese at a young age. I would love to know what your answer is.


What's a "medical reason"? Something tells me, and it's only the barest hint of a suspicion, that your definition of "medical reason" and mine would differ considerably.

I didn't say kids become obese with proper diet and exercise; I said even active kids who don't eat junk food can become obese, as I know well.

For the context of my statement, please re-read your own post:

Children dont get obese by eating healthy foods and having lots of activities.I think it also safe to say obese children are getting the bad foods from their parents.


By the way, it isn't a question of "meanness;" generally when someone tries to be "mean" on a message board it makes me laugh my ass off, and that's a very good thing. ;) The problem I have is when people are unable to differentiate between their opinions (which are all too often informed by prejudices born of ignorance) and fact, and are unable or too stubborn to change their opinions in response to countervailing evidence.

[debmeg]

this is a subject very close to my heart, even though i don't yet have kids. you see, i think the biggest parenting mistake my parents ever made was trying to get me to lose weight.

someone way back on page 1 said if only their parents had put them on a diet maybe they wouldn't have endured the torment of growing up fat. i doubt it. read monika's post - i feel similarly to her.

things were slightly skewed in my house, because i was pressured about food/weight before i ever grew fat. i saw it happening with my brother too, who is 15 years younger than me - as soon as he got the slightest bit - and i mean by 5 pounds - heavier than being a 'skinny kid' my parents started on at him. they did it to me too.

we did not eat junk food at home. my parents cooked us healthy, nutritious meals. very little processed food, no fast food at all, chocolate/sweets once a week. what did i do, as soon as i had the opportunity? bought chocolate for myself. when i was with my mum i would beg and plead to be allowed chocolate on the way home from school. when i was going to school by myself i would take money from her purse every day and buy myself chocolate and crisps.

what was this? emotional eating? it's possible; i wasn't happy at school. i personally think it was an insulin problem that was triggered by puberty (which started for me at age 10). but if it was emotional in part then it was also due to wanting something that was forbidden, that was limited, too much. the focus was too much on it. i wanted it all the more because i couldn't have it.

i think the fact that my parents restricted my food, tried to stop me eating junk, made me conscious about weight, etc, did far more harm than good. it certainly didn't get me to try and lose weight. if anything it made me defiant. accept me as i am, damnit, don't judge me for my weight.

children associate food with nurturing, with love. to deny/deprive them constantly teaches them terrible lessons.

i'm NOT saying don't feed your children nutritiously. the best compromise i can think of if i hopefully some day have kids is to create a balanced, wholesome way of eating that can be shared by the whole family, but not to deny them the junk when they want it.

to my mind, the most important thing you can do for your kids is to build their self esteem and give them a sense of being valued and loved. they will endure enough bullying at school/in the streets - they need a safe, unjudgmental place to come home to. kids will often interpret your reasonable concern for their health as disapproval; after all, if kids are calling them fat and bullying them for it outside the home, and you pressure them too, it will just make them think that you think the same of them that those kids in school do. that's certainly what it did to me.

i think it is very worth trying to avoid your kid developing an insulin problem, and if you have one, it's likely that your kids will have too. i'm very conscious of that. i'd try and develop my kids' tastebuds to like healthy food from a very young age. but if/when they get exposed to junk food, which they undoubtedly will, i will not restrict them too much. i will probably make sure they eat 'healthy' food first, but i will not deny them. and i will never, ever talk to them about their weight, or make them feel judged or pressured.

the way i see it, if kids feel accepted and loved at home, then when they decide they want to lose weight, if they have developed a weight problem, they will come to you and ask your help. if they feel judged and 'bad' because of their weight - and if you pressure them to diet, they will - they will not come to you for help. and their self esteem will be in tatters. like mine was.

[Lisa N]

I think it also safe to say obese children are getting the bad foods from their parents.

Define 'bad' food (take off the low carb hat and think 'standard dietary advice before you answer)? Is a potato a bad food? How about spaghetti or rice? Bananas? Pineapple? Given the current dietary advice to get several servings of carbohydrates a day, I doubt that most people would label those as 'bad' foods for a child to consume and yet a steady diet of such things is likely to promote insulin resistance in a child who is genetically predispositioned to it and if their parents are obese, chances are they are so predispositioned.
You also make the assumption that young children spend 24/7 with their parents. Ever hear of day care and babysitters? Grandparents who love to spoil their grandchildren with 'treats'? Single parents must work and so children go off to day care and eat what the day care provider feeds them for 1-2 meals a day plus snacks. Even in families with two parents, the majority of those both work outside the home. I've witnessed first hand what government food programs and guidelines consider 'healthy' snacks and meals for kids. My oldest DD gained 7 pounds over a period of 11 weeks in a YMCA day camp program one summer, even being very active all day (they don't let those kids just sit around), while eating all those 'healthy' foods. Think she might have a tendency towards carbohydrate intolerance? I do. ;) If you want to blame the parents across the board, that's your choice, but I believe you would be in error in doing so.

It's a dangerous game, to look at an effect and presume the cause is self evident.

Kwikdriver, I quite agree. Correlation does in no way prove causation.

[charmedpea]

my son was on the heavy side all the way up to 2 years ago.. he is 14yrs now.. I never put him on a diet.. I would cut down his servings.. He didnt need to eat 2 hugh plates of speggi or 3 bowls of ceral.. I know he is a growing boy.. Now since he started playing football 3 years ago.. He gets into shape pretty quickly.. On the off season he can gain up to 20lbs..

His stats now.. he turned 14yrs in april.. 6'2 225lbs wears a 14 shoe.. ok the shoe has nothing to do with it.. but i'm amazed at the size foot he has.. and he still has 6 more years to go.. omg.. Now i'm feeding a football team.. lol

charmed